3-Point Hitch 3 point hitch won't lift

   / 3 point hitch won't lift
  • Thread Starter
#31  
Timing couldn't be better... I was on my way to NH when your post came over my blackberry. I didn't buy the 0-rings but priced them at about $16 for the pair.

I took the piston out and found the seal looks new. Here's a pic.

P1040681.JPG

I'm going to put it back together with the original seal (since it doesn't look anything like your failed one) and try something else. Any suggestions?
 
   / 3 point hitch won't lift #32  
I hope the dial to regulate the speed of the 3 point was turned down all the way; this can cause it to not lift.
 
   / 3 point hitch won't lift #33  
I'm going to put it back together with the original seal (since it doesn't look anything like your failed one) and try something else. Any suggestions?

Okay Sevan, Let's have another stab at it.

You fixed the leaks, filter change and you put new Hyd fluid in and still no go.
We need to establish to see if we have flow and then if that flow get to hyd lift piston. You can remove the banjo connection on the discharge and run start the tractor with an assistant taking a bucket to catch the oil coming out. with that you can measure flow but not the pressure. it is a good test but I don't recommend it because it does not reveal what the lift control spool valve is doing. I'd check the system on the discharge size of the spool valve. Your hyd system is open center configuration, just simply if your spool valve handle on the 3-point is all the way down, cause all the flow to go thru spool valve back to hyd reservoir in the diffy housing. As you raise the 3 point level part of the flow goes to lift system and the rest to the diffy. When the spool is at it's highest point then all the flow is directed to the piston till the arm is risen to its highest point and then all the flow is returned to diffy housing. Attempting to raise the 3 point higher and you cause the safety relief valve to release causing a chattering noise.

Look the pic below, This the inside look at you lift cyl head head. You see four holes,
1st from the right with the oring is hyd oil discharge coming from the spool valve.
2nd from the right is the rate of drop needle valve, providing some flow as well to lift move the piston.
3rd from the right is normal flow from the spool to raise the 3 point arm. The opening only allows flow toward piston only becuase it has a ball check valve.
4th hole is open to the diffy to allow for oil release when the lift is under shock loading. This hole is also served by a very stiff spring and a ball check.


dsc04343ru1.jpg


What you see here is two check valves in the lift head. The first with the big ball is for normal flow to the piston and second is a safety relief. The key is to remember is " a completely closed rate of drop knob" can only keep the arm from dropping but you can still raise the arm if it is half way provided you have flow.

dsc04167oh9.jpg


What I would do take the nut off as shown in picture, and start the engine with an assitant to catch the flow. I'd make sure the lift spool is in closed position. At this time you should have no flow coming out, as you raise the lift spool handle to raise the implemnt flow should start. if you do not have fllow then either your spool is bad or your pump not flowing. Rate of drop has no role whatsoever here.

dsc04169ts9.jpg



By the way if the pump is operational and spool is bad and you get no flow coming from the piston head then all flow must be diverted to the diffy reservoir.

dsc04321hl1.jpg


All of that said, likelihood of bad spool valve is minimal and I thinks we're closing in on bad pump or main pressure relief valve is stuck open before any flow to the spool valve as pictured below.

dsc03645xo0.jpg



JC,
 
   / 3 point hitch won't lift #34  
I hope the dial to regulate the speed of the 3 point was turned down all the way; this can cause it to not lift.

I don't believe this is a true statement with 1710 or many other tractors. Rate of return needle valve is not the only passage way for fluid to lift the lift piston. The second hole has a check valve that allow only flow to the piston and not other way. Partially closing the valve and you can limit return flow. But if the knob is all the way closed and the lift arm is in the middle or all the way in the bottom you can still raise the arm, and once you archive max height withe the knob closed then you can not lower the arm until you open the needle valve.

JC<
 
   / 3 point hitch won't lift
  • Thread Starter
#35  
Thanks again!

I did check the rise in the full range of flow from the regualting knob and got nothing.

This sounds like a good test. From FO-44 pg 95, if there is flow as I raise the lever then we're looking at: 1) an adjustment to the linkage or relief valve pressure; 2) faulty o-ring in several places; 3) faulty safety relief valve; or 4) plugged suction filter. However, I can't find where a suction filter is used on the 1710; I checked the NH website and searched for 'filter' under the 1710 catagory.

FO-44 doesn't mention a faulty check valve as a possible cause. Is there a reason a bad (or stuck) check valve wouldn't cause my problem?

I plan to take out the valve assy. and inspec all the parts and run the test here in about an hour or two.

By the way, the post hole digger and subsequently the 3 pt is UP and held up with a cable hoist. Does this matter?
 
   / 3 point hitch won't lift #36  
Thanks for the pictures there is beauty inside a tractor.Al tho i have a newer model ford, I think it would be the same or similar setup, Always wondered just what on inside there.
I saved the pics for future reference.
Thanks Again
 
   / 3 point hitch won't lift #37  
Thanks again!

I did check the rise in the full range of flow from the regualting knob and got nothing.

This sounds like a good test. From FO-44 pg 95, if there is flow as I raise the lever then we're looking at: 1) an adjustment to the linkage or relief valve pressure; 2) faulty o-ring in several places; 3) faulty safety relief valve; or 4) plugged suction filter. However, I can't find where a suction filter is used on the 1710; I checked the NH website and searched for 'filter' under the 1710 catagory.

FO-44 doesn't mention a faulty check valve as a possible cause. Is there a reason a bad (or stuck) check valve wouldn't cause my problem?

I plan to take out the valve assy. and inspec all the parts and run the test here in about an hour or two.

By the way, the post hole digger and subsequently the 3 pt is UP and held up with a cable hoist. Does this matter?


I'd be very careful with the valve assembly as the tolerances are very tight. I'd eliminate all possibilities before going there. No issue I see with the Post hole digger being held up. If main pressure relief is stuck open due to contaminant can cause flow diverted to the sump but possibly a percentage of it and not all. You have not established pump flow yet and manipulating rate of return knob provides no good information. let's make sure you have solid flow out of the pump yet.

JC<
 
   / 3 point hitch won't lift
  • Thread Starter
#38  
Sorry JC... I didn't mean "check valve" when I said there is no mention of it causing the problem.

What I meant was 'needle valve' in the cylinder head or anything else wrong with the cylinder head like a plugged hole.

YES!!! the pictures are great and very helpful.
 
   / 3 point hitch won't lift #39  
Thanks for the pictures there is beauty inside a tractor.Al tho i have a newer model ford, I think it would be the same or similar setup, Always wondered just what on inside there.
I saved the pics for future reference.
Thanks Again

My pleasure, all Ford/shibuara Sp? are designed the same. It is really a very impressive and simple design. Even Kubotas are not as well designed and much disassembly is required to get to the guts of lift system. I really did not have good clue what I was buying, but I'm very pleased after I got to learn the design of it.

JC,:)
 
Last edited:
   / 3 point hitch won't lift
  • Thread Starter
#40  
I guess I'm confussed... Isn't the valve assembly what you've pictured with the springs and ball bearings? More importantly, isn't this what I'm supposed to take out to run the test for flow?

Or am I supposed to take out the plug on the opposite side to test the flow. I believe this plug is where a pressure tester is screwed in so I'm somwhat hesitant to have it open with maybe 2200 psi hyd fluid shooting at me.

Thanks,

Scott
 

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