Another Generator guestion

[IXLR8]

I am looking to get a generator to power 80% of the house when the power goes out for extended periods. I have ruled out a PTO generator due to not wanting to mess with tractor and generator in a storm. We had 50mph winds last night, pouring rain when the power went out. I am not going out in that, remove what is on the 3pt, install the generator and then hook it up to the house in those conditions.
I have figured out I need something in the 6-8Kw range, I would prefer a diesel powered unit as I have other diesel powered equipment so I have the fuel available. No NG supply here, Propane is a bit expensive, Gas does not like to sit around, then again diesel does not last forever either. Does anybody have any manufacturer recommendations or a reasonable supplier. Not interested in a "Chinese" unit. The "Lister slow turning" units looked interesting, not sure how well they work.. certainly not portable which certainly is a nice to have.

TIA

 

[MossRoad]

I think your choice of a diesel engine is wise, considering your reasoning. Diesel, when treated right, will last a very long time. The amount you have to store to operate your generator is a question only you can determine. (We have a gasoline generator and it will consume a gallon of fuel every few hours. )

Are you considering a standby unit that comes on automatically if the power goes out? And have you come up with a budget including the generator, pad to sit on, fuel storage, transfer switch, wiring, etc...?

 

[daBear]

When I rebuilt after Katrina a couple of years ago a 70% of house generator was high on my list. I settled for the Generac natural gas 16K model which included a 100 amp automatic switch and was abut $3,200 then. Current models are 18kw and run about a thousand more. I have used this gen abut 75 hours in two years and it is well worth it. I hear you on diesel and if that is the way you have to go you can get a complete setup for well under 5K. However, you can spend what you want also and go way higher.

 

[IXLR8]

Are you considering a standby unit that comes on automatically if the power goes out? And have you come up with a budget including the generator, pad to sit on, fuel storage, transfer switch, wiring, etc...?

No I was just looking at unit that I could manually "plug into" the house when needed, once the house was isolated from the grid, ie; turning off the main breaker coming into the house. I wanted to keep it portable in case that need ever arrived. I heat the house with wood, so that is not part of the requirements. My main concern is refridge, well pump, a few lights and the hot water heater if the outage gets extended. Longest we have been out in the last 7 years is 2 days. My neighbor has a Propane whole house generator, she has 2 large (ugly) tanks, which I think she said gives her about 3 days running time. The generator is so noisy that I could hear it over the 50+mph winds and pouring rain last night. We are on 2 acre lots, so she is not exactly close. I have heard that the entire setup cost her over $10K. I envision firing it up, running it for a few hrs so the fridge can cycle, get water pressure back and then shutting it down. I don't want to listen to it any longer than I have to.

 

[AMR]

This is what I did:

1. I wired in a 10 circuit manual transfer switch in the basement on one of my 2 200 A panels, $600 installed cost
2. Ran #6 out to the garage to a 50 A 120/240 plug with a 40 A disconnect, $400 installed cost
3. Purchased a porter cable portable 10 kW generator with a Honda engine, $1,500 or so
4. I made up a 25 foot SJO cord with #6 and a 50 A plug, $125 or so

So when the power goes out, I walk out to the garage and start the generator and plug it in, I walk down to the basement and move the manual transfer switch circuits from line to off to generator, I don't need to fool with the mains or anything, just this panel

I power:

1. Well pump
2. Fridge
3. Microwave
4. 2 air handlers
5. Furnace
6. Assorted lights

The run time is about 8 hours on 7 gallons of gas, I can't say that it is whisper quiet but I put it just around the corner from the garage and I can't hear it in the house. Having lights and heat and shower while everyone else is dark, priceless.

 

[Egon]

Don't know what the budget is but perhaps the most economical would be just a good quality hardware store variety gasoline driven generator.

The fears of stale gas may be a little over emphasized.

 

[George2615]

Diesel generators are definetly more expensive than gas comparing wattage ratings. I thought about a diesel generator a few years back for my own house as backup power but I also needed a welder. I bought a Miller Bobcat NT250 which is a 10KW 20HP gas generator which allows me to power the entire house if needed and is a very nice AC/DC welder. Since I do quite a bit of welding projects during the year I don't worry about gas going bad just sitting around. Miller, Lincoln, and Haun are three of the popular welder/generators in my area and are priced under $3500 if you shop around.

 

[MossRoad]

No I was just looking at unit that I could manually "plug into" the house when needed, once the house was isolated from the grid, ie; turning off the main breaker coming into the house. I wanted to keep it portable in case that need ever arrived. I heat the house with wood, so that is not part of the requirements. My main concern is refridge, well pump, a few lights and the hot water heater if the outage gets extended. Longest we have been out in the last 7 years is 2 days. My neighbor has a Propane whole house generator, she has 2 large (ugly) tanks, which I think she said gives her about 3 days running time. The generator is so noisy that I could hear it over the 50+mph winds and pouring rain last night. We are on 2 acre lots, so she is not exactly close. I have heard that the entire setup cost her over $10K. I envision firing it up, running it for a few hrs so the fridge can cycle, get water pressure back and then shutting it down. I don't want to listen to it any longer than I have to.

Heck, if that is all you want to do, it shouldn't be too expensive at all. My little 4000W generator will run the lights, refrigerator, freezer, well pump and furnace fan, just not all at once. I shut off the main disconnect, shut off the main breakers, shut off all the breakers, then back-feed through a 15A 220V outlet in my garage. Once the genny is up and stable, I turn on the breakers that I need.

I have set up my in-laws' home this way, too, and have run their house for 3 days like this on about 4-5 gallons of gas a day. It does not run continuously, just as needed.

But my little gas genny is LOUD! as it has to run at 3600RPM all the time. Have you found any diesel portable units?

 

[MossRoad]

Don't know what the budget is but perhaps the most economical would be just a good quality hardware store variety gasoline driven generator.

The fears of stale gas may be a little over emphasized.

Egon,
That's the way we went. I think I got ours for $400 bucks or so over 13 years ago. Still works fine. I treat our 6 gallon cans in the fall with Stabil. I do not treat them in the summer, as I use it when mowing frequently. But they can sit full all winter if we do not get much snow.

 

[Doc_Bob]

The run time is about 8 hours on 7 gallons of gas,

I like the idea of gasoline. No matter what, you can use this fuel for your vehicle and your generator. Sweet.

 

[IXLR8]

Don't know what the budget is but perhaps the most economical would be just a good quality hardware store variety gasoline driven generator.

The budget is whatever gets me a quality generator with a minimum of 6Kw surge output. If it takes me a little longer to save up for it.. then that is what I am going to do. I am not sure what constitutes a quality brand, I don't have much faith in Home Cheapo or Lowes stuff. I was looking at diesel as that is what I store most of around here, 250 gal of diesel vs 10 gal of gas. A gas unit is not out of the question, but just not at the top of the list.

I found a good variety of generators, diesel and otherwise, here:

GeneratorSales.com

But I still need a clue as to who makes a quality generator and suggestions as to where to purchase.

 

[kennyd]

But I still need a clue as to who makes a quality generator and suggestions as to where to purchase.

Onan, Cummings, and Kohler are at the top of the list for real quality commercial grade gensets.


I have bought 2 Generac units from Norwall PowerSystems. Not sure what they have in diesel's but they where great to deal with!

 

[IXLR8]

I like the idea of gasoline. No matter what, you can use this fuel for your vehicle and your generator. Sweet.

For me.. my car is diesel (average 56mpg ), my tractor is diesel, my backup heating system is heating oil (diesel), which is why I am considering diesel generators. The only thing I have that is gas powered is my lawn mower, which uses about 5 gallon/month.

 

[JB4310]

Here you go, this is the caddy. A little pricey, this was my dream genny, even went to the factory to check them out. I went with the pto gen not so much because it was much cheaper but because I already have 2 diesel power plants in tractors and figured I should utilize them, also these things are such beautiful little machine I figured it would be a shame seeing them sit around 99.99% of the time, If I lived where reg power outages were common occurrence I would have one of these or the 12 kw unit. they are 1800 rpm for 60 HZ (4pole heads)

http://www.4norpro.com/products/lan...anmar_series/power_max_yanmar_series_8PMY.php

I like the idea of the PTO genny but of course they couldn't hold a match to one of these in regards to voltage and frequency regulation with there computer controls now. I agree with you only diesel power for serious electrical generation.
JB.

 

[Steve_Miller]

I like the idea of gasoline. No matter what, you can use this fuel for your vehicle and your generator. Sweet.

I just emptied one of my five gallon jugs into my truck last night while running the generator for a few minutes. I'll get that jug filled in the next couple of days, then dump the other one in my truck. Gas won't go bad unless you let it. I'd hate to let my generator sit that long that the gas went bad and then try to get it going. I run mine once a month for 15 or 20 minutes with a 500W halogen light for a load. It seems that if I let it sit for much longer than that, it takes too many pulls to get it going (getting old sucks). I have a 3500W Porter Cable with a GX Honda engine on it and it will run my water pump and furnace at the same time plus some lights. It ain't perfect but for short power outages it's well suited for me. We've lost power maybe a half dozen times in the last three years since I bought it with the longest outage 5 or 6 hours. I guess you could say the generator was insurance as the power seems to be more stable since I've got it.

Steve

 

[coobie]

No I was just looking at unit that I could manually "plug into" the house when needed, once the house was isolated from the grid, ie; turning off the main breaker coming into the house. I wanted to keep it portable in case that need ever arrived. I heat the house with wood, so that is not part of the requirements. My main concern is refridge, well pump, a few lights and the hot water heater if the outage gets extended. Longest we have been out in the last 7 years is 2 days. My neighbor has a Propane whole house generator, she has 2 large (ugly) tanks, which I think she said gives her about 3 days running time. The generator is so noisy that I could hear it over the 50+mph winds and pouring rain last night. We are on 2 acre lots, so she is not exactly close. I have heard that the entire setup cost her over $10K. I envision firing it up, running it for a few hrs so the fridge can cycle, get water pressure back and then shutting it down. I don't want to listen to it any longer than I have to.

Its hard to beat a honda gen.They are very quiet and do very well on fuel.I don,t believe they make a diesel model.Hondas are not cheap,but you get what you pay for IMHO.I have a Kubota 6500 watt & Honda eu3000 watt both are excellent gens.For what you need I think a 6500 watt gen. would serve your needs.Make sure to check out the honda Eu6500isa watt gens.coobie

 

[sherpa]

Go to this site for great units and prices:
Wise Sales.COM || 800.916.9473 || 1475 Rodenburg Rd, Schaumburg, IL 60193

 

[NuBota]

I have a little B&S 6500W gasoline powered - $600 bucks just about anywhere. I patch it into the panel and run everything (well pump, 2 fridges, all lights, TVs, computers, etc) except the heat pump/furnace, oven, water heater, and washer/dryer, all at once. I was suprised how much it could drive.

In the winter, have two kersosene heaters for heat - we just all move to the main floor. Looking at installing a wood/gas/oil burning solution, just haven't decided what to get yet -stove, furnace, boiler, etc. The 80 gal HW Tank stays warm for about 2-3 days (which really suprised me).

I thought about going bigger since my house is all electric, but just seemed like overkill. We lose power a lot, but not for long stretches. Longest we've ever been out was after Isabel - 5 days.

Plus, the fact that the generator is small and light, I can use it for many other applications

 

[groundcover]

I got one of these as backup to the backup : GenPro Diesel
You are right that if you heat with oil you will have plenty of fuel for the extended event. (as long as the house tank isn't empty)
It is a little,ok a lot,loud but it will outlast me and can be loaded into the pickup ,tractor helps here, for helping out MIL or other projects. I use the Lincon Ranger 8 in the garage with a flex pipe out the window for most outages. Buried wire to house and transfer whole panel in bacement.

 

[LBrown59]

I was looking at diesel as that is what I store most of around here,
1*250 gal of diesel vs 10 gal of gas.

2*. my car is diesel (average 56mpg ),
3* my tractor is diesel,
4*my backup heating system is heating oil (diesel),

1*This 250 gallon tank will supply everything listed in items 2* - 4* except the car.