My New house and low utility bills

[fish6942]

We just finished up with our house build. We looked into a ground source heat pump but the payback was over 10 years. This was for a system that required its own wells (or horizontal trenches).

We ended up going with an air source heat pump (ultra high efficiency, two stage) that is powered from off-peak electricity. The payback on this system is around 4-5 years.

The air source heat pumps are not as efficient as the ground source but they are a heck of a lot better than a typical HVAC system with gas forced air heat and a central AC unit.

 

[david000]

My first post on a tractor forum and it not even about tractors.

I am also going with a geo system. But not open loop. Ours will be a horizontal closed loop glycal mix. The price on the Water Furnace system is $24,900 which includes everything except the excavation. The excavation is going to be about 2000 to 3000 for 3 trenches 150' x 10', 6' deep.

I also priced out an air to air system, which was around $16000. But decided to go with the geo.
In our calculations we have the system paying for itself in 7 to 10 years.
Those prices are Canadian also

 

[fish6942]

We just finished up with our house build. We looked into a ground source heat pump but the payback was over 10 years. This was for a system that required its own wells (or horizontal trenches).

We ended up going with an air source heat pump (ultra high efficiency, two stage) that is powered from off-peak electricity. The payback on this system is around 4-5 years.

The air source heat pumps are not as efficient as the ground source but they are a heck of a lot better than a typical HVAC system with gas forced air heat and a central AC unit.

I should have mentioned that our payback periods were calculated against using natural gas. If we had to use LP, the payback times would have been about half of what I mentioned.

 

[have_blue]

My first post on a tractor forum and it not even about tractors.

I am also going with a geo system. But not open loop. Ours will be a horizontal closed loop glycal mix. The price on the Water Furnace system is $24,900 which includes everything except the excavation. The excavation is going to be about 2000 to 3000 for 3 trenches 150' x 10', 6' deep.

I also priced out an air to air system, which was around $16000. But decided to go with the geo.
In our calculations we have the system paying for itself in 7 to 10 years.
Those prices are Canadian also

Welcome David!

I'll bet you the payback times will shrink every year

 

[have_blue]

My first post on a tractor forum and it not even about tractors.

I am also going with a geo system. But not open loop. Ours will be a horizontal closed loop glycal mix. The price on the Water Furnace system is $24,900 which includes everything except the excavation. The excavation is going to be about 2000 to 3000 for 3 trenches 150' x 10', 6' deep.

I also priced out an air to air system, which was around $16000. But decided to go with the geo.
In our calculations we have the system paying for itself in 7 to 10 years.
Those prices are Canadian also

Welcome David!

I'll bet you the payback times will will be shorter than estimated because of rising fuel costs. It's going to get ugly in 2-3 years!

 

[irvingj]

Check out the "Heat Pump Miracle" thread... I've had a recirculating water-source heat pump operating in my house for 23 years now.... other than a few repairs it's done well, and heating costs have been very reasonable: when built in 1986, estimated heating-season (house is all electric) cost was $350 per year. Electricity, even with off-peak billing, is now costing me about 15 cents per KWH (up from 8 cents or so when house was built); I estimate current heating season costs to be around $650. Still not bad at all. House is about 1800 sq ft, heat pump is a 3-1/2 ton unit.

In the summer I can flip a switch and get A/C, and the thing will even take house heat and put it into DHW... In the immortal words of a former colleague, "It takes a lot less energy to move heat than it does to create it..."

My water loop's incoming line is entirely below the frost line, so I only use water, no glycol. Sealed loop goes down the well hole, right along with the water pump lines & electrical feeds. Sits submerged in about 150' of water.

 

[flgeorge]

We built a insulated concrete form (ICF) home aprx 2324 sq ft, finished March this year. The wall are 9 inches, 4 concrete, 2 1/2 form on the outside and 2 1/2 on the inside. The cost was about the same as 2x6 frame construction. The house faces true north with a three foot overhang with metal roofing light in color (white) and is of the hip design. We have a 2 1/2 ton heat pump and energy efficient windows. The electric cost is at least half of those of 2x6 frame construction in our area, and the best is that we were able to purchase insurance at a very reasonable rate from State Farm because it is a concrete house with a hip roof. These two items are the way to go if you are building in Florida. I looked at the geo systems but decided not to go that route because of the cost and long payback time. With the ICF construction I am not sure it would have been feasible since the electric cost is very good now. Living in Florida, I feel very comfortable with the concrete walls since we are subject to very high winds at times. The windows are those they say you can shoot a 2x4 at, at 50 mph and not break them, glass doors are the same. This way was my way to go and I am sure you were correct to use the geo system in your area.

 

[randydupree]

I know everybody is into the alternative building types and hightech insulation sytems, but most I've seen are not real cost effective and have very long paybacks.

When i built our new house two years a go I went with 6" stud walls, r-19 blown in cellulose, r-48 blown in celulose in the ceiling, and anderson 200 series low-e windows (lots of them as my wife is a sunshine fanatic. I paid attention to the house wrap to get it sealed on the outside, and put my energies in the heating system.

I installed a ground source heat pump with a open loop system that use my well that supplies water to the home to supply a geothermal source. ( I upsized the well pump to a 2 HP and put a variable speed drive on the pump).

I discharge the geothermal water into two 1500 gallon tanks that I use to irrigate my two acre lawn. The heat pump has a variable speed fan and four zones with four thermostats to keep the house perfectly temperate in all areas. The house is the most comfortable I have ever been in it cost less than conventional system as my electric cooperative gave me a 1700 rebate for the system.

The house is 4400 square feet finished with all of it heated and cooled to 73 year round.
It is about 2800 foot ranch over a full walk out basement. I live in Misouri and we have winter with lows of below 0 and summers over 100 for weeks.

The best part is the utility bills. The largest heating portion of the electric bill we have ever had was $45/month, with the largest summer cooling bill of $30/month.

Ground source heat pumps rock

whats the size of your units?
i'm in the process of converting a warehouse into a loft style home,and we are using a ground source system.

 

[ihookem]

I also went with 2x6 walls with blown celulose and r 55 in the attic. The outside is all brick. Also went wth a Quadrafire 7100 and my biggest heat bill was 72 bucks. I go through about 8 face cords a year. The house is at about 68 when we are home. Not bad for Wisconsin. Blown celulose is called Par-Pac. It cost me 2500 more but is well worth it. No air coming in fron the outlets at all and better r value than fiberglass by a long shot.I have 2" foam on the outside under the ground against the block and am putting up 1 1/2 " foam on the inside in the basement and is helping already. Electric is about 55 a month.

 

[JackMentink]

Sounds awesome. We are just in the planning stages and have heard of homes such as yours with low utility bills. I listen to Doug Rye quite often; don't know if you know who he is but you did just about everything he advocates in building an energy efficient home.

Great job!

Yes I have heard of Doug rye and he has been through our area. I've seen his articles in our papers.

I didn't really base things on his stuff, i just researched everything my self. It does help that I am a registered Engineer and Own an Architectural and Engineering firm that designs Commercial Buildings and City infrastucture for a living. I do have sources to alot of good information