Your time is not free

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   / Your time is not free #141  
One of the major reasons I do everything I can myself is because nobody else knows how I want it done besides me. Furthermore I don't trust most people to do it without watching them. There are lots of times I find myself doing stupid things late at night in the shop and I think "I should be hiring somebody else to do this", but by the time I find the right person and explain exactly how I want it done and then check it over when they're finished...I could have just done it already!

Last time I thought I was "too important" to work on my brakes, the shop I went to managed to ruin all four of my wheels and forgot six lug nuts. How do you even do that? When I came back to chew them out there was somebody else already there who's front wheel had just FALLEN OFF because they neglected to tighten the lugs.

Exactly! I do all my own stuff, with rare exceptions,* out of self defense.
Yesterday I changed the oil on 3 vehicles, my 2 son's and the one daughter in law's. I actually kind of enjoy working like that with my hands to balance out sitting in front of a computer all week at my job.
Besides I'm always their guy for car repairs so I view the oil change as pre-emptive self defense...I can often spot something that is an easy fix now rather than a big repair later, that I'd end up doing for them anyway...
As for others doing quality work- well the DIL's VW had a missing bolt from a steel skid plate under the oil pan, allowing it flop up and down..previous oil changes had always been done at the dealer...the dealer had also been using oil that did NOT meet VW's own stringent specs, I was horrified at the amount of sludge present under the oil cap, so much for hiring quality workmanship.

As a benefit I got to spend the day with the three of them and my 4 yr old grandson. All it "really" cost me was $75 for oil and filters and $50 for lunch at 5Guys...priceless to me.




* I did hire someone to pump my septic tank last year...:laughing:
 
   / Your time is not free #142  
Quite some time ago, my house and garage needed new shingles. It's a simple enough job to do, so I priced everything out. I discovered my costs were not a great deal less than hiring a local shingling outfit and they took one day to do the complete job. I would have been days at it and risk the chance of rain and having to fool with plastic sheeting, etc. I decided to hire it out. As it turned out, I got a call-out at work and the money I made from that more than made up the difference between their and my costs, plus I can guarantee, working in my specialty (Lineman) was a lot easier than doing roofing plus I would have had to work many more hours roofing than I worked on that call-out. That was an instance where hiring it out was the better economic choice and I am sure they did every bit as good a job as I could have, quite possible better in fact.

Just over a week ago, I had the intake manifold gaskets changed on my 1994 Chevy 5.7L truck engine. I've no room in my garage to work indoors so I would have had to work outdoors. I've just the single vehicle now, so if I got it apart and needed parts, it would have been a royal PITA with my sole transport immobile. I farmed it out. My mechanic is absolutely top notch and even though I am capable of doing the job, he is too, in spades! Even if it was summer, and I had room in my garage and a second vehicle, I think I would still have decided to farm it all out just because I am 59 and a fat old fart! I looked at my bank account and decided I could easily afford to farm the job out. Could I have saved myself a lot of money doing it myself? Absolutely! But it was worth it to me to have him do it just for the convenience factor which is a very subjective thing and would vary from person to person.

I do a bit of metal working as a hobby and I've made a few one off parts for a friends tractors. One was a battery box for a Cockshutt 30. We were lucky to get an original factory one from a friend and I copied it exactly!
I've also made him a few floor panels for his John Deere D, a couple of tool boxes and battery boxes, again, copied exactly from factory originals. I've made parts for the clutch in his D, and made new parts to eliminate the extreme flop in the hand clutch on my R, plus several other little items. If I tried to cost my labour to make all that stuff, even at minimum wage, it would be more than what you could buy the aftermarket stuff for. Factor in the cost of my tools and equipment that I used while making/fixing the stuff plus material and the total cost would have been ridiculous! I didn't do that work for economic reasons, I did it because it was for my friend, and because I could.

There's three examples where you could put a dollar figure on my labour. There is absolutely no way that dollar figure could be the same in all three instances.

If you do insist on putting a $ figure on your at home labour, I believe it can be only be done when you eliminate hiring someone to do the work, if you can reasonably do the work yourself and you will then be able to say just how much you "paid" yourself doing the job. Sometimes the cost difference might be zilch or even cheaper if you hired it out, but you have the satisfaction of knowing it was done as you wanted it and when you wanted it. Sometimes you might indeed pay yourself very well to do it yourself. Other times you might just plain want to do the job yourself for personal reasons and the costs are not an issue at all. Every job would probably work out to a different rate also...no way could you "flat rate" yourself at a fixed number.
 
   / Your time is not free #143  
That's pretty funny! :D
Didn't think that one through, did ya?

You strike me as someone who, quite simple put, is "Full of himself."

LOL......Thinking the same thing, but didn't want to be labeled a misanthrope.

My neighbor looked this thread over and decided he can't afford to play golf anymore. $90 an hour PLUS the greens fees just pushed him over the edge. Cost me $15 just to read and respond to this.
 
   / Your time is not free #144  
I do have a question for the economists. Carpenters primarily have only time to sell. It's worth is based on their knowledge as well as their productivity. Most carpenters now use nailguns rather than a hammer. Nailgun nails cost (my pricing is probably outdated but..) 8 times the cost of loose nails & nailguns, compressors, hoses are expensive as well. The question; why would any carpenter trade money for more expensive tools & nails to save time when time is all he has to sell?

I will respond because I am an (agricultural) economist and I know a little about carpentry. (My dad was a carpenter/farmer and I helped him as I was growing up. I only wish I had paid more attention to the things he was trying to teach me.:))

You answered your own question when you mentioned productivity. They are substituting (improved) capital for labor in production -- circular saws rather than hand saws, compound miter saws rather than miter boxes, drywall screw guns rather than hammer and nails, etc. It's the same reason that farmers use tractors rather than draft animals, combines rather than reapers and threshers, etc. Of course, that (improved) capital has a cost, but that cost is at least offset by the value of the increased production for a given amount of labor input.

Also, some of this capital allows less-skilled (and less expensive) labor to be substituted for more skilled labor.

Steve
 
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   / Your time is not free #145  
I guess by the logic of this thread, I should give up on heating with firewood and wood pellets, and go back to fuel oil.

Nope, doesn't exactly fit. Cutting and burning firewood DOES have actual monetary value because if you didn't, you would have to buy (with money) a substitute fuel. You are spending your time to avoid a fuel bill.

Now another way of looking at it is this. It used to cost us about $1400 per winter to keep our house at 63 deg and we regularly wore light coats around the house to keep the propane bill as low as possible. In comparison, it's 75 in the house right now and I'm about to chuck another log in the stove. If I had kept the house at 75 with propane, the bill would have been substantially more, so what am I saving? What we actually spent at 63 degrees or what we would have spent had we enjoyed this comfort level?

I choose to say we're saving $1400 minus whatever it costs me to gather the wood. The comfort level is not actually additional savings because we would have never turned the thermostat up this high before. It's more of a non-monetary bonus for having wood heat. The pleasure I get from gathering wood isn't something you can quantify into money either really unless you stretch it to equating the amount of pleasure to something you would pay for like a vacation but then it gets REALLY theoretical.

Ian
 
   / Your time is not free #146  
Quite some time ago, my house and garage needed new shingles. It's a simple enough job to do, so I priced everything out. I discovered my costs were not a great deal less than hiring a local shingling outfit and they took one day to do the complete job. I would have been days at it and risk the chance of rain and having to fool with plastic sheeting, etc. I decided to hire it out. As it turned out, I got a call-out at work and the money I made from that more than made up the difference between their and my costs, plus I can guarantee, working in my specialty (Lineman) was a lot easier than doing roofing plus I would have had to work many more hours roofing than I worked on that call-out. That was an instance where hiring it out was the better economic choice and I am sure they did every bit as good a job as I could have, quite possible better in fact.

Just over a week ago, I had the intake manifold gaskets changed on my 1994 Chevy 5.7L truck engine. I've no room in my garage to work indoors so I would have had to work outdoors. I've just the single vehicle now, so if I got it apart and needed parts, it would have been a royal PITA with my sole transport immobile. I farmed it out. My mechanic is absolutely top notch and even though I am capable of doing the job, he is too, in spades! Even if it was summer, and I had room in my garage and a second vehicle, I think I would still have decided to farm it all out just because I am 59 and a fat old fart! I looked at my bank account and decided I could easily afford to farm the job out. Could I have saved myself a lot of money doing it myself? Absolutely! But it was worth it to me to have him do it just for the convenience factor which is a very subjective thing and would vary from person to person.

I do a bit of metal working as a hobby and I've made a few one off parts for a friends tractors. One was a battery box for a Cockshutt 30. We were lucky to get an original factory one from a friend and I copied it exactly!
I've also made him a few floor panels for his John Deere D, a couple of tool boxes and battery boxes, again, copied exactly from factory originals. I've made parts for the clutch in his D, and made new parts to eliminate the extreme flop in the hand clutch on my R, plus several other little items. If I tried to cost my labour to make all that stuff, even at minimum wage, it would be more than what you could buy the aftermarket stuff for. Factor in the cost of my tools and equipment that I used while making/fixing the stuff plus material and the total cost would have been ridiculous! I didn't do that work for economic reasons, I did it because it was for my friend, and because I could.

There's three examples where you could put a dollar figure on my labour. There is absolutely no way that dollar figure could be the same in all three instances.

If you do insist on putting a $ figure on your at home labour, I believe it can be only be done when you eliminate hiring someone to do the work, if you can reasonably do the work yourself and you will then be able to say just how much you "paid" yourself doing the job. Sometimes the cost difference might be zilch or even cheaper if you hired it out, but you have the satisfaction of knowing it was done as you wanted it and when you wanted it. Sometimes you might indeed pay yourself very well to do it yourself. Other times you might just plain want to do the job yourself for personal reasons and the costs are not an issue at all. Every job would probably work out to a different rate also...no way could you "flat rate" yourself at a fixed number.

Well said. Thank you.....

-Jer.
 
   / Your time is not free #147  
Well I just entered a different tax bracket ... I should have not replied to this.
 
   / Your time is not free
  • Thread Starter
#148  
Mace you bust me up.
You strike me as someone who, quite simple put, is "Full of himself."
Are you coming on to me?
 
   / Your time is not free #149  
I don't date guys, let alone guys in shiny stirrup tights. :D

Sorry to disappoint you. :D:D

serve.asp
 
   / Your time is not free
  • Thread Starter
#150  
This is starting to go to a very strange place
 
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