B2920 HST Creaking Sound

[trum979]

I had been thinking about trading my BX25 in this fall for a 2620. But after reading this tread, I am beginning to become a little more hesitant until this issue is resolved. I can't imagine having to listen to that sound while working with my tractor. It kinda sounds to me like a chattering relief valvue. Will be really interested to see if anyone finds the cause of this chattering and if there is a way to resolve it.

 

[e171fish]

BrierPatch Do you feel that your tractor rolls easier than it should when on a slope?

No. Seems to be fine.

Chriscos Did you have the go pedal all the way down in the second video? Does it make that noise with the go pedal all the way down at full RPM?

Yes, it makes the noise at full RPM with the pedal down.

I've tried to live with the noise for a few weeks now. When mowing it's not noticeable in low on flat ground. Going uphill the noise begins. Forget about mowing in medium.

I dug a 100ft trench and a large flower bed out yesterday. The chattering when using the FEL to scoop and transport dirt on level ground in low was extremely annoying. I could live with the chattering if it only occurred when being worked hard.

My BX2200 and BX2360 were both smooth running machines that tackled the same terrain without an issue. I'm not sure if my expectations are too high but it's to the point that I don't even enjoy using the B2920.

I was hoping this would be my last tractor.

 

[chriscos]

My hearing is shot, and my laptop speakers are horrible, and maybe I am missing some other sound on the videos, but I seem to be hearing "normal" HST whine when there is some load on the HST. Of course, it doesn't look like you have any load in the video...

Grasping at straws here, but...

Have you checked your Hydro fluid, make sure the parking break is not set, make sure one of the wheels aren't partially locked up with a brake-snafu?

I'd take it to the dealer or have them come and get it.

 

[skspurling]

I've had my B2620 since March, and mine makes that noise. After working around skid steer equipment, I don't think it's an odd noise. In fact, an easy way to make my tractor make that Noise is to get going really fast and then let off the forward pedal. It's just like when you are driving a bobcat hard like down a hill (not a really steep one :laughing, you will get that same noise as the pressure tries to keep up with the motion of the loader.

Maybe they left off or adjusted a limiter differently, or changed valve makers. It really doesn't sound any different than any other hydraulic drive equipment I have been around in the past. It's like an oscillation that sets up in the hydraulic drive system when the pump or the motor don't match flow rates and the pump becomes over run/under run. I've heard it in all kinds of stuff, so I didn't think anything of it when I heard my tractor make the same noise.

Oh, and mine has just a slight creep. It holds pretty good for an HST.

 

[OrangeRidge]

Doesn't ANYONE have a B##20 WSM ?
The by-pass valve needs a thicker shim to increase
the by-pass pressure slightly. This is an adjustment
problem at manufacture IMHO.

 

[chriscos]

Doesn't ANYONE have a B##20 WSM ?
The by-pass valve needs a thicker shim to increase
the by-pass pressure slightly. This is an adjustment
problem at manufacture IMHO.

I have the service manual, but if it needs a thicker shim then the dealer should be doing it under warranty, no?

 

[EE_Bota]

I don't have a B. I have a BX.
But my first impression, just comparing the noise to noises I have heard in hydraulics, I was reminded of oil going through metallic tubing and setting up a sympathetic vibration in the tubing itself.

 

[OrangeRidge]

... the dealer should be doing it under warranty, no?

The problem with that is nobody will want to pay . Kubota
won't be doing a recall and the dealer will play-thick ( that's the usual
game in the auto industry) and say "It sounds normal to me" ,( wood duck).

Could you post-up the valve page from your WSM please ?

 

[rswyan]

Time for an update. I loosened the keeper clamp on the drive shaft cover and slid it back. I lubed the shaft and u-joint, and put the cover back on. Whatever sound guys in earlier threads attributed to that cover, it is not the source of this particular chattering.

It may not be strictly a lubrication issue ..... but a position or orientation issue ...

The drive shaft cover is fairly stiff molded plastic (on my B2910 anyways) .... it appears to have a particular angle molded into it .......... just thinking here:

...... molded angle .... rotating shaft .... hmmm ....

Wonder what happens ...... if the shaft cover (with the molded angle in it) rotates out of what is the normal (correct) orientation ?

Reason why I bring this up is that I have been listening to a rather annoying "creaking" (squealing) noise myself for the last several hundred hours on my B2910 ......

Tonight I checked it out and found that it only makes the noise when it is not in 4WD.

So got underneath it and loosened the clamp and slip back the plastic shaft cover as far as I could (couple inches) and squirted some chain lube up there in the large open end at the front ... and squirted some on the shaft at the rear and watched it run down into the cover ..... then I worked the cover back and forth .... and noticed that it would rotate to some degree (mebbe 45 degrees ?) around the shaft.

At any rate I didn't think much more about it, and I positioned the cover in what I thought was the correct orientation and tightened the clamp up.

And then took it out for a test drive ..... the noise was completely gone .... not even a hint :thumbsup: ..... and it was a really loud and very annoying noise.

Point is, by virtue of being placed around a rotating shaft, the cover is probably inclined to rotate to some degree (mine was slathered, on the outside at least, with hydraulic fuild) .... maybe over time it rotates to the maximum point it easily can ...... and then binds due to the angle molded into it ....

 

[bp fick]

It may not be strictly a lubrication issue ..... but a position or orientation issue ...

The drive shaft cover is fairly stiff molded plastic (on my B2910 anyways) .... it appears to have a particular angle molded into it .......... just thinking here:

...... molded angle .... rotating shaft .... hmmm ....

Wonder what happens ...... if the shaft cover (with the molded angle in it) rotates out of what is the normal (correct) orientation ?

Reason why I bring this up is that I have been listening to a rather annoying "creaking" (squealing) noise myself for the last several hundred hours on my B2910 ......

Tonight I checked it out and found that it only makes the noise when it is not in 4WD.

So got underneath it and loosened the clamp and slip back the plastic shaft cover as far as I could (couple inches) and squirted some chain lube up there in the large open end at the front ... and squirted some on the shaft at the rear and watched it run down into the cover ..... then I worked the cover back and forth .... and noticed that it would rotate to some degree (mebbe 45 degrees ?) around the shaft.

At any rate I didn't think much more about it, and I positioned the cover in what I thought was the correct orientation and tightened the clamp up.

And then took it out for a test drive ..... the noise was completely gone .... not even a hint :thumbsup: ..... and it was a really loud and very annoying noise.

Point is, by virtue of being placed around a rotating shaft, the cover is probably inclined to rotate to some degree (mine was slathered, on the outside at least, with hydraulic fuild) .... maybe over time it rotates to the maximum point it easily can ...... and then binds due to the angle molded into it ....

I can believe this drive shaft shroud-cover could be a source of noise in some situations. It would, as you say, only happen when the FWD is activated. A badly adjusted relief valve in the HST would sound off in 2 wheel drive. So, someone with this other clatter/chatter noise will have to post once they've actually had the dealer fix the issue, or post once they've fixed it themselves.

 

[EE_Bota]

I can believe this drive shaft shroud-cover could be a source of noise in some situations. It would, as you say, only happen when the FWD is activated. A badly adjusted relief valve in the HST would sound off in 2 wheel drive. So, someone with this other clatter/chatter noise will have to post once they've actually had the dealer fix the issue, or post once they've fixed it themselves.

On my BX, the difference between 4wd and 2wd would be very slight, since the front drive shaft turns either way, only in 4wd is driven by the tranny, but in 2wd, it is driven by the front axle.

 

[rswyan]

I can believe this drive shaft shroud-cover could be a source of noise in some situations. It would, as you say, only happen when the FWD is activated.

Read what I wrote again: the noise was present on my machine only when I was 2WD - if I switched to 4WD the noise went away.

Logically, what you state should be true - however it is not what I observed in the real world on my machine:

2WD = noise present

4WD = noise absent

A badly adjusted relief valve in the HST would sound off in 2 wheel drive. So, someone with this other clatter/chatter noise will have to post once they've actually had the dealer fix the issue, or post once they've fixed it themselves.

Well ..... unless someone can explain to me how I might have automagically fixed my HST relief valve ...... simply by lubing and adjusting the drive shaft cover ...... my advice would be for folks experiencing such clatter/chatter to have a peek at that cover ....... maybe give it squirt of lube and try rotating it to a different orientation. :confused2:

 

[rswyan]

On my BX, the difference between 4wd and 2wd would be very slight, since the front drive shaft turns either way, only in 4wd is driven by the tranny, but in 2wd, it is driven by the front axle.

Bingo .....

Thanks for the insight as to actual operating conditions :thumbsup:, which explains what seemed to be an illogical scenario ....

 

[BXpanded]

The transmission on my new B2920 is starting to worry me a little bit. It's making a loud creaking type noise when going up slight inclines or working with the box blade. It's in low range, 4wd, with the BB and FEL attached at around 2700 rpm. It's not being worked hard at all.

I'm familiar with HST whine from my BX2360. This doesn't appear to be the typical HST whine.

I have an audio file but I guess it can't be uploaded to the forum.

Any guesses? Normal?

On a positive note I just installed a Tuff Top Canopy and the Kubota Quick Attach. Pretty happy with the results.

OK. Probably checked this already but... How about the new canopy. Sometimes things can vibrate and cause sounds that seem to come from somewhere else. Sometimes, the add-on can change a resonant frequency and make a new noise appear. At any rate, the canopy will make the noise louder to the operator as it reflects sound. If it's an old noise that got louder, the canopy may be the culprit.

 

[bp fick]

Read what I wrote again: the noise was present on my machine only when I was 2WD - if I switched to 4WD the noise went away.

Logically, what you state should be true - however it is not what I observed in the real world on my machine:

2WD = noise present

4WD = noise absent


Well ..... unless someone can explain to me how I might have automagically fixed my HST relief valve ...... simply by lubing and adjusting the drive shaft cover ...... my advice would be for folks experiencing such clatter/chatter to have a peek at that cover ....... maybe give it squirt of lube and try rotating it to a different orientation. :confused2:

Inside voices, inside voices everyone. :laughing::laughing::laughing: My daughter always said that when we guys got too loud.:laughing::laughing:

Alright. First, I was merely trying to say that on my machine, it made no difference whether 4x4 or 4x2. That said, I went back out AGAIN and fussed with that drive cover. This time, I positioned it a bit off from where the drain hole is absolute bottom. Illogical, I know, but since we're experimenting here, why not?

I have no sound now, even when quickly accelerating in high range. Ta da!!!

I cannot replicated a "heavy work out" scenario, as I have no heavy lifting for the machine to do at the moment. BUT.... very pleased and extremely grateful for rswyan for pushing this point. Well done, sir.

I would agree that everyone should keep fooling with that drive cover until they are absolutely satisfied that it isn't the source, as it may well not be in everyone's machine. I'll report back when I do actually make the tractor grunt. It's 101 heat index today, so don't anyone hold their breath!

 

[rswyan]

Inside voices, inside voices everyone. :laughing::laughing::laughing: My daughter always said that when we guys got too loud.

I get a little carried away on the punctuation sometimes ... to hammer home the point

Alright. First, I was merely trying to say that on my machine, it made no difference whether 4x4 or 4x2. That said, I went back out AGAIN and fussed with that drive cover. This time, I positioned it a bit off from where the drain hole is absolute bottom. Illogical, I know, but since we're experimenting here, why not?

I have no sound now, even when quickly accelerating in high range. Ta da!!!

Excellent ! :thumbsup:

I cannot replicated a "heavy work out" scenario, as I have no heavy lifting for the machine to do at the moment. BUT.... very pleased and extremely grateful for rswyan for pushing this point. Well done, sir.

You are quite welcome sir !

Enjoy your new found (relative) quiet.

Believe me when I tell I know how frickin' annoying it can be - I've been listening to it for the last 400 hours or so ... and it's been driving me slightly nuts ... :confused2:

I would agree that everyone should keep fooling with that drive cover until they are absolutely satisfied that it isn't the source, as it may well not be in everyone's machine. I'll report back when I do actually make the tractor grunt. It's 101 heat index today, so don't anyone hold their breath!

It will be interesting to see how long "the fix" lasts .... or whether various work scenarios tend to bring it back.

 

[bp fick]

Believe me when I tell I know how frickin' annoying it can be - I've been listening to it for the last 400 hours or so ... and it's been driving me slightly nuts ... :confused2:

We can tell!!! LOL

Now, I really hope the OP takes your advice and tries fooling around with his boot cover. It seems highly unusual that an HST relief valve would be set as loose as his would have to be to clatter/chatter when just tooling about in his video. Gosh.

 

[e171fish]

BXpanded - The noise occurred before the canopy was installed.

bp fick - Congratulations on solving your noise problem. Thats awesome.

I played with the shaft boot again and put it in several different positions. The chatter is still present in both 2wd and 4wd.

 

[EE_Bota]

OK. Probably checked this already but... How about the new canopy. Sometimes things can vibrate and cause sounds that seem to come from somewhere else. Sometimes, the add-on can change a resonant frequency and make a new noise appear. At any rate, the canopy will make the noise louder to the operator as it reflects sound. If it's an old noise that got louder, the canopy may be the culprit.

I can attest to that, since I had reason to run without my ROPS for a brief period, and I was surprised that my ROPS seems to conduct most of my high pitched whine up to the operator station.

 

[bp fick]

BXpanded - The noise occurred before the canopy was installed.

bp fick - Congratulations on solving your noise problem. Thats awesome.

I played with the shaft boot again and put it in several different positions. The chatter is still present in both 2wd and 4wd.

e171fish- too early to say for 100% certainty. I still need to do some stressful work first. I'll report when I do. Glad you gave the boot cover a good college try. Please do keep us informed on your progress.