Smoking #1 cylinder on My Ford 3000 Diesel

[90cummins]

Did you hone the cylinder when your replaced the rings??
90cummins

 

[mtodd101]

Hello again Johnny. I borrowed a spring compressor from a buddy who has a auto shop by me. Showed him my piston and rings and he thought they looked great, so I feel better about that not being the problem. Like you said, if the bore is bad the rest won't matter. I'm waiting on a bore gauge so I'll be able to eliminate that as the problem. I'll check those #s against the service manual specs. Tomorrow or Monday I'll remove the valves springs and check how the movement of the valve. I was thinking smooth movement up and down is what I'm looking for. Side to side not so much. I'll replace the seals and I bought some valve grinding compound if they look like they need it. The only other thing I'm unsure of is where on the exhaust valve stem the seal goes. The intake seal looks like it goes down to the guide, but I don't see the exhaust seal. I guess I'll see where it is when I take it apart. Anyway I guess I'm on hold till the gauge gets here and I see how the cylinder is. Thanks again for taking the time to help. Matt

 

[mtodd101]

Hi 90cummins. Thanks for asking. I did hone the cylinders. The cylinders weren't in the greatest condition, but as I said in the in another post, I really didn't have the money for a full tear down and machine work. If I made a living with this tractor, different story. They had some blemishes and fine scratches, but nothing you could catch a fingernail on. Hard to believe that much oil could squeeze threw there. The honing smoothed them out pretty well I thought, although this was my first time looking into a cylinder. I've got a bore gauge coming in the mail. Should be here by Wed. or Thur. and I'll check against the Ford spec for the cylinder. I'll be checking the valves, guides and seals in the mean time. Thanks for your interest and taking the time to help. I'll post when I know more. Matt

 

[90cummins]

Diesels do not operate with a vacuum like gasoline engines so I doubt the oil is being sucked in thru the valve guides.
I zoomed in on the pistons and looked at them closely, the top 3 rings expand quite a lot but I noticed that the oil ring looks to be the same dia. as the piston. It looks like the oil ring assembly is missing the expander that exerts pressure keeping the rings in contact with the cylinder.
This would certainly cause your problems!
I think you are missing a 4th piece or the ring is defective.
You may want to pull 1 other piston to compare oil rings.
Why did you rebuild it?
90cummins

 

[mtodd101]

Hi guys. I took the valve springs off today and I'm a little more confused and reassured at the same time. The valves slide nicely in the guides and there is zero "wiggle" with the valve stem and guide. My confusion is the seals. I have new seals from the dealer and also from an after market tractor place that came with the rebuild kit. They are larger than the ones on the stems now. The manual shows a kind of umbrella type seal on the intake side and an O ring type seal on the exhaust side. I found the umbrella type on both sides and no O ring anywhere. The umbrella seals slide down over what I assume is the guide. The exhaust seal was quite hard to the extent that I was afraid I'd break it. The new ones are soft rubber. So I'm back to being not sure of what's wrong again. Here's the pics. Matt
This is what the manual shows.

this is the difference in seals. Right is old. Left is the new

Exhaust valve

 

[mtodd101]

Hi cummins. Thanks again for replying. I didn't notice the oil ring not sticking out farther than the piston. but will double check that. Pulling another piston is a good idea. I'm fairly certain I got all the rings on correctly, but then again, my first try at this. The tractor was my fathers and when he passed it became mine. The reason I started this in the first place is it was getting harder and harder to cold start and it had a lot of smoke coming out the valve cover as well as the exhaust pipe. I heard that ether was not the best for the engine and it required it to start. Anyway pulled the head and the gasket had blown at some point. Visible coolant leak. there was only a couple of rings intact. Impressions from the rings on top of the piston, so it was passed time. Here's a few pics. Thanks again for your help. Matt
Block and old pistons

the head

 

[90cummins]

Umbrella seals typically slide over the valve stem and move with the valve preventing the oil from running down the valve stem into the combustion chamber.
Exactly like a woman's umbrella works.
Not a true seal but a deflector.
The seals that attach to the valve guide are true seals preventing oil from getting into the guide.
90cummins

 

[mtodd101]

Hi Cummins. The umbrella seals that are on both valve stems fit snugly over the guide that the stem goes threw. The new ones are tight on the stems but are no where near tight on the guide. Is that alright or OK? I still don't see where the o ring would go. I didn't see it on the exhaust valve stem. The intake valve stem has one machined groove at the top of the stem which the retainer locks ride in and the Exhaust has two grooves. Top one for the retainers, would the o ring go in that second groove? I don't see the benefit with an o ring there.

Here's the guide. The umbrella seals that are on now fit over the guide and butt up against the ridge on the guide. Is there something else that I haven't removed or am missing? Thanks again. Matt

 

[sd455dan]

Hi Johnny. I didn't check the cylinder bore before I put new rings in. Should have, but didn't have the tools or the knowhow to do that. In hindsight I probably should have split the tractor and done a rebore. The money and experience wasn't there for the undertaking. The old piston and rings looked bad and in some, rings were missing. The tractor smokes more now than before and never went threw the oil like it's doing now. I've order a bore gauge and will check for roundness in that cylinder before I put the piston back in. As far as the valve seals go, I have a full set of seals but haven't ever done any valve work myself. I do have a valve spring compressor. Is that the only tool I would need? I might as well put the new seals on both valves while it's taken apart. Thanks again for taking the time to help. Also have another video. Not sure if they help at all. Besides the smoke, the engine kind of throttles up and down. Not sure what causes that. Matt

The most likely reason the speed is unstable is that #1 cylinder (when firing) is trying to run away due to the oil (fuel) it is ingesting... Good thing you broke the engine back down..

 

[mtodd101]

Hi Dan. Thanks for replying. I figured it must be related in some way to my oil consumption problem. I see you have a Ford 3000 also. Is it diesel? Getting a little tired of this issue. Been off and on with it since late summer last year. Eventually I'll get it figured out. North Idaho is a great area. We go to Farragut St. park every summer. Thanks again, Matt