case 580d backhoe-- attachments

[rjbryan]

"there's no such thing as a stupid question,only stupid answers" with that said ,,i'm stuck on stupid appearently, i bought a shop manual have been evertwhere on internet ,even talked to ppl, on a 1986 case 580D backhoe i got a line comming out each side the lower backhoe arm where it swivels, with quick releases on them,, what are these lines 4 ,where do they go an is there anyway i can use to operate a hydro. rock hammer ?lines ,just spent the most part of this day with that machine,,the cab is very basic,only the controls in pictures,,. i even played in the dirt with it, i crawed under ,poked it from the rear with a stick n flashlight,i crawed under n followed the lines ,i lost them (2 lines )a top the rear axel ,,either it so common i
m missing it or it just vanished leaving no bolt holes drilled,,,,wires hanging, no handles floping, i been a mechanic for 30+years, an i'm havin the worst blonde moment of my life,,, going to try to enclose pictures,,,,,,,,,,,,thks

 

[J_J]

Those hoses look in bad shape.

They are probably for aux hyd motor driven attachments, or hyd hammers. etc.

 

[BukitCase]

My 580B has same controls as yours mostly - in your pic of the boom, I see a few un-used hose clamps on the sides of it - most likely for the missing hoses for what JJ mentioned, or a thumb -

In the pic of the controls, there is one I do NOT have - the side lever that's above the right swing pedal. I'm thinking that's where your QD's are calling home.

Know what you mean about getting lost - if you can, take off the floor plates in the cab. It'll make things a lot easier to see/get at.

Also agree with JJ, those hoses look like they've already died... Steve

 

[rjbryan]

My 580B has same controls as yours mostly - in your pic of the boom, I see a few un-used hose clamps on the sides of it - most likely for the missing hoses for what JJ mentioned, or a thumb -

In the pic of the controls, there is one I do NOT have - the side lever that's above the right swing pedal. I'm thinking that's where your QD's are calling home.

Know what you mean about getting lost - if you can, take off the floor plates in the cab. It'll make things a lot easier to see/get at.

Also agree with JJ, those hoses look like they've already died... Steve

The lever your mentioned ubove the right pedal is for the lock pin ,releases pin that locks the boom arm in place when mobile tommorrow morning going up the mountain where land is ntrace those two hoses n more pictures...............hehe n press or turn every knob i see,outta be real confused when done we'll see

 

[BukitCase]

Jeez, forgot I'd taken my "travel lock" off years ago, was kind of a PITA and I don't do road travel - duh, 'nuther senior moment.

If you've found no "unspoken for" controls, here's another (desperate) thought - could one of your main controls (like bucket curl) be a joystick? front/back for curl, left/right for thumb, or something similar?

Or, maybe, since the boom hoses and whatever they ran are gone, maybe so is the aux. valve they used to be hooked to. I know, I'm reaching - but please, when you find out the "rest of the story", post back - ya got me curious... Steve

 

[J_J]

If that hose is a work port hose, remove the QD and place hose in a bucket and operate all the levers to see if one of them supplies fluid to the circuit.

Do you know if you have an aux position anywhere on the BH.

Is there a switch you have to activate for an aux circuit? Like a solenoid to shift a valve to another function?

Plug a hyd gage in the QD and see if and when you have pressure.

What function does the lever on the right side above right pedal.

Could it be a motor valve spool for hyd motors or to operate a thumb.

Some of these are repeat questions because they have not been answered.

 

[allenr]

Jeez, forgot I'd taken my "travel lock" off years ago, was kind of a PITA and I don't do road travel - duh, 'nuther senior moment.

If you've found no "unspoken for" controls, here's another (desperate) thought - could one of your main controls (like bucket curl) be a joystick? front/back for curl, left/right for thumb, or something similar?

If I forget the boom lock on my Cat 428C the boom and dipper are on the ground by morning.

I think I remember that Case had the boom so's the cylinder could throw the boom overcentre and that locks it. Does that idea really work?

BukitCase, I think its already got joystick controls for the main backhoe functions.

I get the impression from rj's description that the hoses may have been added later, in which case it's anybody's guess where they're plumbed to.

 

[BukitCase]

The controls in the pic look exactly like mine, just a different looking lock lever. The two short ones are outriggers, right tall one is boom, middle tall one is dipper, left tall one is bucket curl, pedals are left and right swing. My lock looked different, apparently Case figured out the 580B needed at least THAT improvement.

Newer Cases (not sure when) had other options that included joysticks and did away with the pedals.

Yes, the "over center" thing works, IF you have rpm's up enough to have the boom moving fast enough AND you're coordinated enough to PUSH the boom lever at JUST THE RIGHT MOMENT. Newer Cases did away with that method.

Mine also leaks down, takes a couple days and the bucket's on the ground UNLESS I park with the hoe end slightly UPHILL.

Those older ones had the Extend-a-hoe option, but the dipper is more complex - this isn't one of those, nor is mine. Only difference I saw from mine (other than the phantom QD's) are the hose clamps added on the sides of the boom and dipper... Steve

 

[rjbryan]

i havent found any switches or levers as of yet, the lever above the right pedal only releases the lock pin 4 the boom ,, i guess i am going to have to follow those 2 lines as best i can an understand where or what connected to.i do n0ot have the extenda boom stick on this machine (that would of been to easy to adapt to)

 

[BukitCase]

Couple things you might wanna know - I got this from a guy at work who runs these things in his sleep, could probably make breakfast with one without breaking the eggs til he was ready

According to him, the older cases with the enclosed boom-dipper joint like yours and mine, the booms are steel, and Case went to the (his words) nodular iron booms (open top joint, hoses exposed) just BECAUSE of rock hammers and compactors - he said the older ones would develop stress cracks from all the vibration. Just FYI.

Also, I don't know when case stopped this, but my 580B has cradles under the tractor that the hoe sits in, and is drawn down with some herky clevis/turnbuckle type devises - there were other options for that model, including a herky 3-point with power down, top and tilt. I have that option with a 7' Gannon box scraper with hyd. rippers, love it.

Point being, if yours has that same setup then it should have a pair of QD's hidden between the hoe and the tractor - pressure, from the loader's PB output, and tank return. If it becomes necessary to add controls to get where you wanna be, you should be able to break into the pressure line at the QD's and insert a new valve(s), running the pressure from loader valve into the new valve, PB from new valve into the pressure input of the hoe, and Tee the Tank connections from new valve AND hoe valves into the OTHER QD, which is a tank return.

You can tee tank returns, but NOT pressure lines, or NEITHER control will work since the other one will be returning any flow back to tank.

Like I said, IF your machine is like mine (don't know) you can do this - otherwise, you'll need to trace things out and do more plumbing - but it still should be do-able... Steve

Oh, if you DO the above, you'll probably want a pretty high flow valve body for the add-on - the lines to/from my hoe are 3/4"...

 

[rjbryan]

after spending a good part of the morning chasing/following ,,i found where at least 1, possibly 2 (both ) hydaurlic lines w/ quick couplers go but i cant find any reference to or picture of the pictured device,,,,,the 2 extra/aux. hydraulic lines are attached to it an there are a few wires leading from it (yet to follow ,thats another day) .it is located on the would be passenger side of tractor at the end of the loader bucket arm next the front of cab) any ides ?

 

[BukitCase]

There should be a Power Beyond port at the rear of the loader controls, should be a 3/4" line - this normally goes to the hoe valves alongside the right (passenger) rear wheel and under the floor plates, back to the hoe control valves.

Sounds/looks to me like yours has an aux solenoid valve that is probably plumbed in BETWEEN the loader valves and the hoe valves - if so, the PB out of the loader valves should be going to the solenoid valve, the tank/drain port of the solenoid would be teed into tank return (there should be a tee or two on the lower inside of the loader valves toward the cab, this is tank return) and the A and B work ports would connect to your QD's - finally, there should be a PB output on the solenoid valve that would continue on to run the hoe.

There doesn't look to be that many lines on the solenoid though - it's possible that ALL its ports can stand full pressure. if so, I'd guess that the two larger lines going DOWN are connected to your QD's, because the large line going rearward seems to be headed the right direction to get to the PB off the loader.

That's my best guess ATM without more pics and input from you. I'll be curious to see where the wires go, and if there's anything on the other end... Steve

 

[J_J]

The valve with wires could be a 3rd function valve for the hyd to the aux circuit on the boom for hyd hammers, hyd motors, or thumb, or a simple aux circuit.

Did you ever remove the QD's off those lines and see if yo had any flow with any lever activation.
If not, see if you can find a switch to activate the solenoid on the valve.

If it is in fact a solenoid valve, remove the wires and apply 12v and ground to the solenoid and see if there is flow out the aux hyd lines.

It should easy enough to put a meter on the solenoid and flip some switches to find the one for the valve.


It could be the valve that switches the hyd flow from normal flow to high flow.