Ram1500 EcoDiesel V6 revealed!

[tcartwri]

What makes you think Ford is exaggerating? Seriously? Where do you get that? And why is Ram understating? What basis do you have? Do you know their test procedures?

Well then, lets look at this from a nannies perspective. Ford rates their gvwr at 96% of the allowable weight on the axles. Dodge .. 87%.

Which truck has the higher margin of safety for an overload condition, or any condition for that matter. I guess being a Ford owner, you had better be carrying a bathroom scale around with you at all times.... cause there's not allot of wiggle room.

Do you seriously think the engineering in the Dodge is that much poorer? Or GM, OR Toyota... which are both in line with Dodges ratings.

Ford is notorious for doing this, all the way through their light truck lineup.

And yes, every truck I've owned before this RAM was a Ford... So I am absolutely not brand baiting, or bashing.

 

[jejeosborne]

(as will countless lawyers on the plaintiff's side).

My main concern^^^^^^^.

I didn't make up the GVWR so don't sue me. I was following what was stated on my door sticker. Nice feeling to have that worry off my mind.

I have never had the thought to sue anyone even though in today's world I probably could have a few times. I can tell you if Billy Bob who believes " If you seriously think your truck is going to fail if you exceed those numbers by a few hundred pounds you're delusional. They are far far tougher animals than you give them credit for.", injures or kills one of my immediate family members, I will either become a rich man or in jail for beating down that individual.

I am NOT, I repeat NOT, an advocate for the government to get involved with many things but why don't they require an endorsement on your drivers license to tow a trailer? I have to pass a written and practical test to ride my motorcycle on the road endangering few people besides myself. Then we have people who don't know the limitations or definitions of vehicles ratings towing 12,000 lb skid steers using a hitch rated for 5000 lbs going 70 MPH down the crowded highway. I am all for this endorsement!

 

[jejeosborne]

Well then, lets look at this from a nannies perspective. Ford rates their gvwr at 96% of the allowable weight on the axles. Dodge .. 87%.

Which truck has the higher margin of safety for an overload condition, or any condition for that matter. I guess being a Ford owner, you had better be carrying a bathroom scale around with you at all times.... cause there's not allot of wiggle room.

Do you seriously think the engineering in the Dodge is that much poorer? Or GM, OR Toyota... which are both in line with Dodges ratings.

Ford is notorious for doing this, all the way through their light truck lineup.

And yes, every truck I've owned before this RAM was a Ford... So I am absolutely not brand baiting, or bashing.

So Ford builds a chassis, suspension, wheels, brakes, transmission, etc that maximizes the axles they have chosen. Way to go Ford. You guys are using your brain.
There is a WEAK link in the Ram and it isn't the axle. That is all we know based on any information I have access to. You may want to call Detroit and ask the person who rendered those numbers what is the limiting factor hold back the GVWR. Simple as that.

On the flip side. How do you feel about the Ram 3500 having class leading GVWR's? 2014 Ram 3500 - Heavy Duty Pickup Trucks
Do you think they are still under valuing the 1500 when they have no problems in other classes?

 

[tcartwri]

On the flip side. How do you feel about the Ram 3500 having class leading GVWR's? 2014 Ram 3500 - Heavy Duty Pickup Trucks
Do you think they are still under valuing the 1500 when they have no problems in other classes?

They had to have something to compete with the F550. The new RAM 3500 is nothing like it's older version. It is basically a 5-ton with pickup sheet metal. Both machines are extremely heavily built.

 

[fordmantpw]

Well then, lets look at this from a nannies perspective. Ford rates their gvwr at 96% of the allowable weight on the axles. Dodge .. 87%.

All that tells me is that Dodge's axles aren't the weakest point in their truck. That's it. Nothing more, nothing less. Maybe it's the brakes? Maybe it's the tires? The springs? I don't know.

Which truck has the higher margin of safety for an overload condition, or any condition for that matter. I guess being a Ford owner, you had better be carrying a bathroom scale around with you at all times.... cause there's not allot of wiggle room.

If you only look at the axles, then sure. But you are failing to realize that there is more to a truck's GVWR than the axles. Once you get that, then you will understand the entire discussion, and what we've been trying to tell you.

Do you seriously think the engineering in the Dodge is that much poorer? Or GM, OR Toyota... which are both in line with Dodges ratings.

Um, no I didn't say or even imply that. Personally, though, I think Ford knows trucks better than anyone else, and that's part of the reason they sell more than anyone else.

Ford is notorious for doing this, all the way through their light truck lineup.

Is this in your mind or do you have proof of this? Show me where Ford's trucks have broken by going just a couple hundred lbs over the payload. From my experience, Ford is notorious for having trucks that are more capable than the competition. I've been in conditions with overloaded half tons from several brands, and I always felt safest in the Ford and I felt that the Ford was the most stable when it was overloaded.

 

[tcartwri]

I seriously doubt either of you two have ever used your truck as a truck. That's my impression.

 

[fordmantpw]

I seriously doubt either of you two have ever used your truck as a truck. That's my impression.

seriously? That's rather uninformed. Maybe my definition of a truck doesn't fit yours, but below is some of what I use my truck for. Does any of that qualify as using my truck as a truck? There are a couple that your Ram (or any other Ram half ton) could NOT do while staying under the max payload. See if you can find them!

• Taking my kids to school and picking them up
• Commuting to work (when I have to go into the office)
• Crusing, because I can
• Towing my 8k (unloaded weight) fifth wheel
• Hauling 2k lbs of wood pellets in the bed
• Hunting, hauling my deer
• Getting around in the snow
• Going to church when we don't want to take the car
• Moving People
• Pulling a trailer loaded with our ATVs
• Pulling a trailer loaded with my tractor
• Off roading
• Taking the diesel and gas cans to the gas station to fill them up
• Hauling appliances
• Hauling whatever the heck I wanna haul

 

[Renze]

I seriously doubt either of you two have ever used your truck as a truck. That's my impression.

They are just some guys fighting another brand war... debating "i felt safer in an overloaded ford" come on, whats this all about ?

 

[fordmantpw]

They are just some guys fighting another brand war...

If you are seeing a brand war in our discussion of payload, then you have trouble reading, or you are "seeing what you want to see" as tcartwri would put it.

debating "i felt safer in an overloaded ford" come on, whats this all about ?

Because my personal experience means less than this hogwash:

Ford is notorious for doing this, all the way through their light truck lineup.

 

[Heywood Jannockitov]

I'm not going to get involved in this pi$$ing match but when I look at virtually all half tons on the road, They look like big SUVs with the back 5 ft cut open. How much of the carrying capacity is lost from having to support all that extra weight of a four door cab, 2 extra full size doors, a rear seat etc. I don't have time to bother looking up specs, but how much more available payload would a RAM ST or SLT 1500 REGULAR cab, 2x4, 8 ft box version have over a Laramie 4x4 quad cab with leather, all the bells and whistles? Its got to be more, I would think. Fordmantpw could do everything listed except pull a 5th wheel, with a Honda Ridgeline! OMG!!

 

[aczlan]

I'm not going to get involved in this pi$$ing match but when I look at virtually all half tons on the road, They look like big SUVs with the back 5 ft cut open. How much of the carrying capacity is lost from having to support all that extra weight of a four door cab, 2 extra full size doors, a rear seat etc. I don't have time to bother looking up specs, but how much more available payload would a RAM ST or SLT 1500 REGULAR cab, 2x4, 8 ft box version have over a Laramie 4x4 quad cab with leather, all the bells and whistles? Its got to be more, I would think. Fordmantpw could do everything listed except pull a 5th wheel, with a Honda Ridgeline! OMG!!

All are 4x2, Ram 1500s with 3.92 gears, 5.7 Hemi and the 8HP70 Transmission:

• Quad Cab, 6'4" bed - Page 4
  • Tradesman - Curb: 5069#, Payload 1830#
  • Big Horn - Curb: 5101#, Payload 1790#
• Crew Cab, 5'7" bed - Page 6
  • Tradesman - Curb: 5129#, Payload 1770#
  • Big Horn - Curb: 5175#, Payload 1720#
• Std Cab, 8' bed - Page 3
  • Tradesman - Curb: 4868#, Payload 1730#
  • Big Horn - Curb: 4896#, Payload 1700#

4x4 adds another ~200# to the curb weight to any of these and takes away ~200# of payload
So, the lightest curb weight (Std Cab, 8' bed Tradesman, Curb: 4868#, Payload: 1730#) to the heaviest (Crew Cab, 4x4 5'7" bed Big Horn, Curb: 5175#, Payload: 1720#) you gain ~507# in curb weight and lose ~220# in payload

Source PDF: http://www.rambodybuilder.com/iph/iph2014/ph2014/phdocs/phram/phrammlup1500.pdf

Aaron Z

 

[fordmantpw]

I'm not going to get involved in this pi$$ing match but when I look at virtually all half tons on the road, They look like big SUVs with the back 5 ft cut open. How much of the carrying capacity is lost from having to support all that extra weight of a four door cab, 2 extra full size doors, a rear seat etc. I don't have time to bother looking up specs, but how much more available payload would a RAM ST or SLT 1500 REGULAR cab, 2x4, 8 ft box version have over a Laramie 4x4 quad cab with leather, all the bells and whistles? Its got to be more, I would think.

You really hit on why some folks don't think about payload. "I have this truck, I can haul anything I want!" But they fail to realize that all of what you mentioned weighs a lot, then they add in a family in the cab, and they are pushing the limits.

Fordmantpw could do everything listed except pull a 5th wheel, with a Honda Ridgeline! OMG!!

A Ridgeline can haul 2k lbs in the bed?

But, I didn't say that I could only use a truck for what I use mine for. I could do most of those with our Ford Flex if I wanted. The main reason I have a Super Duty is to tow my fifth wheel, so, yes, most of the others could be done with a lighter truck. But, I was just pointing out the error in tcartwri's post.

 

[fordmantpw]

All are 4x2, with 3.92 gears, 5.7 Hemi and the 8HP70 Transmission:

• Quad Cab, 6'4" bed - Page 4
  • Tradesman - Curb: 5069#, Payload 1830#
  • Big Horn - Curb: 5101#, Payload 1790#
• Crew Cab, 5'7" bed - Page 6
  • Tradesman - Curb: 5129#, Payload 1770#
  • Big Horn - Curb: 5175#, Payload 1720#
• Std Cab, 8' bed - Page 3
  • Tradesman - Curb: 4868#, Payload 1730#
  • Big Horn - Curb: 4896#, Payload 1700#

4x4 adds another ~200# to the curb weight to any of these and takes away ~200# of payload
So, the lightest curb weight (Std Cab, 8' bed Tradesman, Curb: 4868#, Payload: 1730#) to the heaviest (Crew Cab, 4x4 5'7" bed Big Horn, Curb: 5175#, Payload: 1720#) you gain ~507# in curb weight and lose ~220# in payload

Aaron Z

Those are directly off of the door jamb stickers though, are they?

 

[aczlan]

Those are directly off of the door jamb stickers though, are they?

Sorry, I forgot the link (fixed now), that's per: http://www.rambodybuilder.com/iph/iph2014/ph2014/phdocs/phram/phrammlup1500.pdf so the same info as the door stickers, not the actual live curb weight.

Aaron Z

 

[Heywood Jannockitov]

A Ridgeline can haul 2k lbs in the bed?

But, I didn't say that I could only use a truck for what I use mine for. I could do most of those with our Ford Flex if I wanted. The main reason I have a Super Duty is to tow my fifth wheel, so, yes, most of the others could be done with a lighter truck. But, I was just pointing out the error in tcartwri's post.

There's probably some people out there that think they can!

Aaron - thanks for taking the time to look up those specs - interesting.
I would have thought difference in available payload would have been greater between the reg cabs and quad cabs.

 

[fordmantpw]

Sorry, I forgot the link (fixed now), that's per: http://www.rambodybuilder.com/iph/iph2014/ph2014/phdocs/phram/phrammlup1500.pdf so the same info as the door stickers, not the actual live curb weight.

Aaron Z

I think those weights are without fuel and options, correct? It does say base weight, so I'm pretty sure that is correct. So, you can subtract 175 lbs for a tank of fuel and any options you get on the truck.

 

[jejeosborne]

I seriously doubt either of you two have ever used your truck as a truck. That's my impression.

If I am one of the two, my advice would be to follow facts rather than your impression (in truck buying too). I own 4 trailers: tandem axle boat trailer for my 23' runabout with a 5.7 liter engine, another tandem travel trailer with over 900 lbs tongue weight in which I also carry a 550 lb 4 wheeler in the bed of my truck while towing, a tandem flat bed trailer for my tractor and 7500 lb mini excavator, and finally a small utility trailer for my kayaks.
I wish you wouldn't be so immature about an educating experience for many, including yourself. I have said how much I like the Ram trucks and the good service I got out of my Dakota that I owned just a couple years ago. I see this diesel engine to be a great addition to this class but just wish it's potential could be utilized with more appropriate GVWR's. Same story with the Hemi. Obviously great engines, transmissions, and axles but somewhere in the middle is a weak link that is just unfortunate. Hopefully this will smooth over your impression of me.

 

[fordmantpw]

If I am one of the two, my advice would be to follow facts rather than your impression (in truck buying too). I own 4 trailers: tandem axle boat trailer for my 23' runabout with a 5.7 liter engine, another tandem travel trailer with over 900 lbs tongue weight in which I also carry a 550 lb 4 wheeler in the bed of my truck while towing, a tandem flat bed trailer for my tractor and 7500 lb mini excavator, and finally a small utility trailer for my kayaks.
I wish you wouldn't be so immature about an educating experience for many, including yourself. I have said how much I like the Ram trucks and the good service I got out of my Dakota that I owned just a couple years ago. I see this diesel engine to be a great addition to this class but just wish it's potential could be utilized with more appropriate GVWR's. Same story with the Hemi. Obviously great engines, transmissions, and axles but somewhere in the middle is a weak link that is just unfortunate. Hopefully this will smooth over your impression of me.

Well said!

 

[jejeosborne]

Sorry, I forgot the link (fixed now), that's per: http://www.rambodybuilder.com/iph/iph2014/ph2014/phdocs/phram/phrammlup1500.pdf so the same info as the door stickers, not the actual live curb weight.

Aaron Z

Aaron, those are estimated numbers that will not make it to the door jam sticker.
Tcartwri posted his door sticker and it was about 250 lbs less than the published value. If you dig into the fleet Web pages it breaks down to the pound every option you add to the truck including radio options, power windows, etc.

It would be interesting to order any truck from any manufacturer with its maximum published GVWR and see what shows up. Wonder if it would have paint on the sheet metal. Lol

 

[sd455dan]

If I am one of the two, my advice would be to follow facts rather than your impression (in truck buying too). I own 4 trailers: tandem axle boat trailer for my 23' runabout with a 5.7 liter engine, another tandem travel trailer with over 900 lbs tongue weight in which I also carry a 550 lb 4 wheeler in the bed of my truck while towing, a tandem flat bed trailer for my tractor and 7500 lb mini excavator, and finally a small utility trailer for my kayaks.
I wish you wouldn't be so immature about an educating experience for many, including yourself. I have said how much I like the Ram trucks and the good service I got out of my Dakota that I owned just a couple years ago. I see this diesel engine to be a great addition to this class but just wish it's potential could be utilized with more appropriate GVWR's. Same story with the Hemi. Obviously great engines, transmissions, and axles but somewhere in the middle is a weak link that is just unfortunate. Hopefully this will smooth over your impression of me.

Sorry Jejeosborne
but if you are towing that 7500 lbs. mini ex on a tandem flat bed trailer, with the f-150- and are still running those p rated (passenger tires) you are either right on the line for tire safety or are possibly over it.... or am I mistaken- since this whole thing is about safety and educating people...

I also agree that Dodge should have some Hd option for the new diesel - that is a real bummer if they don't have some type of towing and payload upgrade...