Hydrostatic vs Non

   / Hydrostatic vs Non #51  
With a gear drive when you shuttle forward to reverse, don't you have to come to a stop and step on the clutch?

It depends on the shuttle.. some hydraulic shuttles require no clutching and you shift on the go.. example Kubota Glide shift.

Others you still have to clutch and stop. The advantage of the shuttle here is it allows you to remain in the same gear for forward and reverse.. so your reverse speed will be the same as your forward speed.. but it still wears your left leg out.
 
   / Hydrostatic vs Non #52  
Yep, there is standard shuttle and various makes of power shuttle. Power shuttle is just flip the lever on the steering column from forward to reverse. Standard shuttle is where you still press the clutch.
 
   / Hydrostatic vs Non #53  
With a gear drive when you shuttle forward to reverse, don't you have to come to a stop and step on the clutch?
Most shuttle shifts you need to clutch to forward/reverse.
With a power shift or glide shift you can forward/reverse without the clutch.
 
   / Hydrostatic vs Non #54  
I really like the "power-reverser" that JD uses on their gear tractors. I even find it more efficient than a hydro for doing loader work. My JD "power reverser" tractor has 12 speeds, split into three ranges (A, B, and C). I find that I can maximize loader efficiency by operating the tractor in 9th gear (1st in the "C" range), and the dash throttle set at minimum. That 9th gear is usually just right for transport, where speed can be controlled with the foot throttle. Just prior to stabbing into the dirt or other material pile, I downshift into the "A" range. That puts the tractor into 1st gear, where it's maximum power can be obtained when it is really needed (along with maximum foot throttle if necessary). If I need to cross some rough terrain, I shift into the "B" range, which puts the tractor into 5th gear (just right for crossing ditches, etc.).

This method really simplifies the loader-work task, by only requiring the operation of a single lever with the left hand (no touching of the gear-shift lever, just the range selector). Anyone who has done any loader work will know that there is always one hand available for tasks, while the other is on the steering wheel, so only needing to mess with one left-hand lever is a huge plus.

Prior to, or shortly after backing out of the pile, the tractor is shifted back into the "C" range for transport at optimum efficiency. I do use the clutch for those C range - A range / A-range - C-range shifts, but I am not sure it would be necessary, because the left foot is not busy then anyhow.

I have finally learned how to optimally operate this tractor for loader work but, it's primary function is bush-hogging, plowing and disking, all of which are performed, at various gears, in the "B" range. All of these tasks may require the tractor's maximum available pto and drawbar hp at times. Also, these operations are all best performed at a constant speed which make it no contest, in favor of the gear tractor. I never use the other gears available in the "A" range and the only time I use other gears in the "C" range, is the top (12th), for road transport.

The main reason that this JD gear tractor is more efficient than a hydro, for loader work, is the hydro carries with it a 6 - 15% deduction in available drawbar horsepower. That means that less available power for putting into a pile, a time when all of the tractor's available power and traction may be called upon. Normally, the hydro shines here by providing the optimum speed at all times. I need all the power I can get because my tractor is the lowest powered of it's particular class of JD tractors. I always have had plenty however, and have often wondered why folks fork out all that extra cash for the higher powered machines. I guess a lot of them are making up for the hydro deduction, or perhaps, the extra power needed to run an air-conditioned cab.

The one place that I definitely recognize the superiority of a hydro is for lawn-mowing. I used one of them for a few years. It had the same engine hp and several inches narrower cut than the gear tractor that I use now, yet could always get the lawn cut in considerably less time. Right now, I am shopping for a hydro, zero turn mower, which should solve that problem.
 
   / Hydrostatic vs Non #55  
Today I was out using my gear transmission skid steer - wait - nobody makes a gear drive skid steer. Wonder why since their primary use is as a loader?
 
   / Hydrostatic vs Non #56  
As far as the advantages of a hydro over a gear, think of the letter "L": 1), Loader work, 2) Lawn-mowing, 3) Landscaping, 4) Lazy folks, 5) Ladies. If you and your usage falls mainly into these areas, then the hydro is best for you, otherwise, take advantage of the 6-15% more horsepower, and lower purchase and maintenance cost of the gear transmission.

Lol!!! #4! Lol!!!!
 
   / Hydrostatic vs Non #57  
This may sound stupid but the reason I like standard is because of my height. My long legs are always being jammed into vehicles that don't have sufficient leg-room. Car, truck whatever - my legs are always stuck in this bent position between the back of the seat and the gas pedal.
It's nice to shift into a gear and just put my feet flat on the floor for a while.

It dosnt sound stupid to me. Being tall and having bad knees and a problem with the right ankle from an old injury. In my recent search for a new machine I actually felt much more comfortable on many of the 30 to 40 HP machines in gear rather than the hydro. The one machine that seemed to shine in leg comfort for me was the DK40se HST which was actually a little bigger than I anticipated on buying but in the long run priced out right and should be a long time keeper that both me and the wife can use. If I couldn't have gotten a good deal on this machine I probably would have ended up with a gear drive rather than a hydro and just kept the old JD hydro for her occasional use. Like some here who are very proficient with a gear, I also am and have no problems doing any type work with one providing the range of gears is sufficient. By the way if it wasn't for a raised seat on my JD I would have been uncomfortable on it as well. Sometimes a little modification can go a long way.
 
   / Hydrostatic vs Non #58  
I really like the "power-reverser" that JD uses on their gear tractors. I even find it more efficient than a hydro for doing loader work. My JD "power reverser" tractor has 12 speeds, split into three ranges (A, B, and C). I find that I can maximize loader efficiency by operating the tractor in 9th gear (1st in the "C" range), and the dash throttle set at minimum. That 9th gear is usually just right for transport, where speed can be controlled with the foot throttle. Just prior to stabbing into the dirt or other material pile, I downshift into the "A" range. That puts the tractor into 1st gear, where it's maximum power can be obtained when it is really needed (along with maximum foot throttle if necessary). If I need to cross some rough terrain, I shift into the "B" range, which puts the tractor into 5th gear (just right for crossing ditches, etc.).

This method really simplifies the loader-work task, by only requiring the operation of a single lever with the left hand (no touching of the gear-shift lever, just the range selector). Anyone who has done any loader work will know that there is always one hand available for tasks, while the other is on the steering wheel, so only needing to mess with one left-hand lever is a huge plus.

Prior to, or shortly after backing out of the pile, the tractor is shifted back into the "C" range for transport at optimum efficiency. I do use the clutch for those C range - A range / A-range - C-range shifts, but I am not sure it would be necessary, because the left foot is not busy then anyhow.

I have finally learned how to optimally operate this tractor for loader work but, it's primary function is bush-hogging, plowing and disking, all of which are performed, at various gears, in the "B" range. All of these tasks may require the tractor's maximum available pto and drawbar hp at times. Also, these operations are all best performed at a constant speed which make it no contest, in favor of the gear tractor. I never use the other gears available in the "A" range and the only time I use other gears in the "C" range, is the top (12th), for road transport.

The main reason that this JD gear tractor is more efficient than a hydro, for loader work, is the hydro carries with it a 6 - 15% deduction in available drawbar horsepower. That means that less available power for putting into a pile, a time when all of the tractor's available power and traction may be called upon. Normally, the hydro shines here by providing the optimum speed at all times. I need all the power I can get because my tractor is the lowest powered of it's particular class of JD tractors. I always have had plenty however, and have often wondered why folks fork out all that extra cash for the higher powered machines. I guess a lot of them are making up for the hydro deduction, or perhaps, the extra power needed to run an air-conditioned cab.

The one place that I definitely recognize the superiority of a hydro is for lawn-mowing. I used one of them for a few years. It had the same engine hp and several inches narrower cut than the gear tractor that I use now, yet could always get the lawn cut in considerably less time. Right now, I am shopping for a hydro, zero turn mower, which should solve that problem.

Much of what you describe for loader work can now be done with the newer HST setups without the need to change ranges....they do it for you.

Also, many of them have setting for constant ground speed, and most also have cruise control, which accomplishes much the same thing.

I totally don't get your comment about needing all the machine's available power when digging into the pile....I can fill my bucket completely without using even close to it's available power and traction.

I have both hydro and gear machines, so I'm not against either type, but for the average weekend warrior, it's almost no contest....they'll be more efficient, and happier with a hydro. After reading a lot of comments, I'm convinced that a many of the people who say they prefer gear have never actually owned, or used, something similar with a hydro tranny.

Not that you mentioned it, but when I see people claim an HST setup will cost more in maintenance over the long haul I have to sort of chuckle....if filters and fluid every couple of years is a big deal, I guess I'm not that cheap. On the other hand it seems like more machines get new clutches than rebuilt hydros over time.
 
   / Hydrostatic vs Non #59  
Today I was out using my gear transmission skid steer - wait - nobody makes a gear drive skid steer. Wonder why since their primary use is as a loader?

HAHA! Thumbs up! :D
 
   / Hydrostatic vs Non #60  
Much of what you describe for loader work can now be done with the newer HST setups without the need to change ranges....they do it for you.

Also, many of them have setting for constant ground speed, and most also have cruise control, which accomplishes much the same thing.

I totally don't get your comment about needing all the machine's available power when digging into the pile....I can fill my bucket completely without using even close to it's available power and traction.

I have both hydro and gear machines, so I'm not against either type, but for the average weekend warrior, it's almost no contest....they'll be more efficient, and happier with a hydro. After reading a lot of comments, I'm convinced that a many of the people who say they prefer gear have never actually owned, or used, something similar with a hydro tranny.

Not that you mentioned it, but when I see people claim an HST setup will cost more in maintenance over the long haul I have to sort of chuckle....if filters and fluid every couple of years is a big deal, I guess I'm not that cheap. On the other hand it seems like more machines get new clutches than rebuilt hydros over time.


Most people who don't like the hydro have never had a tractor with it for any length of time. I agree with Gman in the above post.
 

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