Welding 3/16" & 1/4" with 120v wire-feed

[weldermike]

Mike... You could frame those pics and hang on the wall. Pure art!!! http://www.sherv.net/

Thanks brother really appreciate it, and thank you. I, like shieldarc only give constructive criticism when people post projects and questions, and man o man do some people just get rubbed the wrong way. Shieldie is a amazing welder whos retired now and still plays in the game everyday. Guys just gotta lighten up a bit. Cheers bud and thanks again.

 

[dragoneggs]

I guess some just like punishment.:confused3: This is a non thread. A Multi-Matic 200 is a $2000 machine!:shocked: Comparing it to the $199 specials isn't even close. Myself, for $2000 plus the cost of two Honda inverter generators could come up with a much better welding and/or generating set up for less money.

Yep the sticker shock for the portability and Tig scared me away. For half the money I went with the Miller 211 and put it on a HF rollaway cart with drawers. But I think the multimatic only weighs about 36lbs though which is impressive for its power.

 

[Arc weld]

A Multi-Matic 200 is a lot of money for what it is. I think it's about $500 over priced. There's other light weight inverters for a lot less than the Miller.

 

[dragoneggs]

A Multi-Matic 200 is a lot of money for what it is. I think it's about $500 over priced. There's other light weight inverters for a lot less than the Miller.

Exactly what I thought. I probably would have pulled the trigger at $1500 and have one unit that would cover me as a hobbyist/fix it type with stick/Mig/Tig ability. Oh and it's only 29lbs! My 211 is 74lbs but much better duty cycle and aluminum thickness capability for less than half the money but no stick or Tig (200 with Tig is extra $400). Definitely a multipurpose sportscar.

 

[Tractor Seabee]

A pretty weld is not an indicator that it is a sound weld (strong as the base material or more). Like my old welding instructor said over 60 years ago, pretty is not where the strength lies. He concentrated on full penetration from the bottom of the material to the top. What is over the top does not add more strength. At my age pretty went away with the arthritis and neuropathy problems; but, I still concentrate on penetration. No matter how you cut it 20A 120V will only produce so many amps at the stinger. It takes amps to get penetration. I trust my life to penetration and soundness. I refuse to get into the on going ballyhoo, only to say, I use a 225A DC machine fed with 50A 240V and stick weld exclusively.

Ron

 

[dragoneggs]

A pretty weld is not an indicator that it is a sound weld (strong as the base material or more). Like my old welding instructor said over 60 years ago, pretty is not where the strength lies. He concentrated on full penetration from the bottom of the material to the top. What is over the top does not add more strength. At my age pretty went away with the arthritis and neuropathy problems; but, I still concentrate on penetration. No matter how you cut it 20A 120V will only produce so many amps at the stinger. It takes amps to get penetration. I trust my life to penetration and soundness. I refuse to get into the on going ballyhoo, only to say, I use a 225A DC machine fed with 50A 240V and stick weld exclusively.

Ron

And the more power to you, Ron! No argument with your thoughts. I think what is getting under some folks skin here is a summarily dismissal of 110v machines and I think that is a bit short sighted. Obviously thicker materials need more power to adequately weld but for those that aren't doing thick materials and for those that might not have a 240v machine or power available, there are some very good welders out there for them. I should probably shut up on this thread, being a newbie welder but can't help myself. BTW... I am looking forward to getting out to see you this summer soon.

 

[Reverser]

When the new 140E migs come in, I'll do a comparison video...should help solve some discussions, along with a bend test (hopefully) on 3/8" steel, just like it's done for test...root and face. Maybe do one against a 110V transformer mig and and a 240V MIG, like an ESAB or Miller...novice versus experienced?

Great idea, Mark. :thumbsup:
Doing a bend test or even one of Shield Arc's hammer type test would get everyone's attention on this and other boards.
I would like to see what your inverter 120v mig will do on 3/8" material.

 

[Arc weld]

I agree with MIG, especially, a weld can look great on the surface but not have sufficient penetration. Not always but sometimes depending on welding technique and material thickness. Just to throw something else out, on an industrial machine, I prefer a transformer MIG over an inverter. I worked in shops that used Miller Dimension 452's. Top of the line CC/CV 3 phase transformer machines. One of the shops got a brand new one for me when I started. I also worked at a shop that switched over to Miller XMT 304 CC/CV machines, again top of the line machines. On stick the XMT's were fabulous. On MIG however, there must be a learning curve because presetting the volts and wire speed the same had different results compared to the Dimension 452's. There were a few of us that did what looked like perfect root passes but on x-ray showed piping(elongated porosity) in the root pass. I have never found anyone who could give a detailed explanation what caused this. I've heard it was because of wrong volts but never a real good explanation. It's almost like the arc was too smooth. Even one of the instructors at the tech. school said he preferred the old Hobart MIG machines to the new inverters. He said you could set up the arc exactly how you wanted it.

I'm not sure doing a groove weld on a 3/8" test plate is a definitive test for a 120 volt MIG. Groove welds by design make full penetration easier to achieve. I think a fillet weld break test would give a better idea of what it's limits are.

 

[haveissues]

I don't think there are many people that will tell you a 110 mig is not worth having and they are fine IMO for 3/16 and down light duty cycles. However, when someone says 'what welder should I buy' and this being a tractor forum I assume the welder will also be used to repair things like tractors and implements. If you are going to buy one welder and will weld 1/4" and up you are doing yourself a disservice buying a 120v only machine. So I'm going to say it-if you are only going to buy one welder don't buy a 120v.

 

[Sodo]

I guess some just like punishment.:confused3: This is a non thread. A Multi-Matic 200 is a $2000 machine!:shocked: Comparing it to the $199 specials isn't even close. Myself, for $2000 plus the cost of two Honda inverter generators could come up with a much better welding and/or generating set up for less money.

Is it possible that definition of "non thread" is a welding thread that "the Arcs" are not able to control?

Anyway I highly doubt that the generating setup you could envision, would be as quiet and easy to use for other stuff as a pair of Hondas. And you don't do "projects", Arc, you'd have to check with someone who does (like me?)

I'm not sure doing a groove weld on a 3/8" test plate is a definitive test for a 120 volt MIG. Groove welds by design make full penetration easier to achieve. I think a fillet weld break test would give a better idea of what it's limits are.

This is because a groove weld on 3/8" test plate will pass the bend test.

You could have written (as a welding expert on a hobby/maintenance welding forum) "If you encounter occasional 3/8" thick welding tasks, a 120v MIG can do the job. With a larger machine, a groove may not be necessary, but if it's only a 2" weld, this is easy to accommodate".

I don't think there are many people that will tell you a 110 mig is not worth having and they are fine IMO for 3/16 and down light duty cycles. However, when someone says 'what welder should I buy' and this being a tractor forum I assume the welder will also be used to repair things like tractors and implements. If you are going to buy one welder and will weld 1/4" and up you are doing yourself a disservice buying a 120v only machine. So I'm going to say it-if you are only going to buy one welder don't buy a 120v.

I would change that a little to say, if you already have a larger MIG, don't bother buying a 120v MIG.

If you already have a stick welder, a 120v MIG can become your favorite tool for any repair or project 1/4" and less.