The blurry line between CUT and UT???

[gladehound]

We one thing for cetrain, the front tires on all the Kubota TLB's are woefully undersized for the machines weight and power. The M59 is a UT. The L45 is a very heavy CUT.

Why was this tread started anyway? Very Blurry indeed.

To say the M59 is a UT is like saying that a Case 590 Supper N is a row crop tractor!

The M59 is a dedicated TLB, which is an entirely different animal from an Ag tractor. Dedicated TLBs have smaller front tires than Ag tractors of similar size because it helps with loader geometry and visibility - designers are willing to give up clearance and traction which are more important for Agricultural tasks.

There are many design differences between a dedicated TLB and slapping a backhoe on a CUT or UT.

As to "why start this thread", yes it is bury but I've learned a lot and it is much more clear to me now. First there is an ASAE definition for a CUT - I didn't know that before this thread, most here probably didn't know that. Second, some have proposed what might be the single best way to identify CUTs vs UTs and that is front rim size.

Anyway, the discussion was helpful for me. I'm sorry if it wasn't helpful for you.

 

[LD1]

From the pictures I have seen of the 2605, I am 99% sure it has 20" fronts.

And agree, all the TLB's like the B26?,L39, L45, L48, M59, deere 110, 210 etc are totally different.

There is no comparison between a tractor with an add-on backhoe, and a small TLB with optional 3PH.

 

[Piston]

From the pictures I have seen of the 2605, I am 99% sure it has 20" fronts.

And agree, all the TLB's like the B26?,L39, L45, L48, M59, deere 110, 210 etc are totally different.

There is no comparison between a tractor with an add-on backhoe, and a small TLB with optional 3PH.

I didn't really consider the TLB's 'totally' different than normal CUT's, but I suppose you guys are probably more on the right track than I was. It makes me wonder though, from a capability perspective, I can't think of any advantage a normal tractor has over a dedicated TLB aside from cost?

 

[Piston]

From the pictures I have seen of the 2605, I am 99% sure it has 20" fronts.

And agree, all the TLB's like the B26?,L39, L45, L48, M59, deere 110, 210 etc are totally different.

There is no comparison between a tractor with an add-on backhoe, and a small TLB with optional 3PH.

I didn't really consider the TLB's 'totally' different than normal CUT's, but I suppose you guys are probably more on the right track than I was. It makes me wonder though, from a capability perspective, I can't think of any advantage a normal tractor has over a dedicated TLB aside from cost?

 

[gladehound]

I didn't really consider the TLB's 'totally' different than normal CUT's, but I suppose you guys are probably more on the right track than I was. It makes me wonder though, from a capability perspective, I can't think of any advantage a normal tractor has over a dedicated TLB aside from cost?

Take a Kubota M59 and a similar hp UT out in a muddy field and you'll learn real fast that there is at least one task that an Ag tractor is better at, as that heavy TBL sinks those little tires to the low slung frame!

But I do agree that for the types of things most of us do with our CUTs, a dedicated TLB will do those things better. Exceptions may be hilly hay rides where you need more engine than weight, fetching a trailer or implement out of deep snow where ground clearance is important, mowing because the high power to weight ratio of the CUT will get more done faster, Skidding logs up hills at a decent pace and obviously, any job requiring a 3pt hitch is done more economically and in some cases more effectively especially if the CUT has Ag tires.

Actually, now that I think about it more, the only things a dedicated TLB does better than a CUT or a UT is run a back hoe and loader.

 

[LD1]

Yep, different machines built for different purposes, but both can do either.

A tractor can be fitted with a backhoe and loader and do what a TLB does, just not as well.

Likewise you can fit a TLB with a 3PH and do what an ag tractor can do, just not as well.

 

[engine29]

With the CUT's being offered in larger HP's lately (over 50), it has blurred the.dividing line of the definition of the two. I would consider the DK 55 a utility, but the new DK 5510 and the NX 5510 and 6010 are really still CUT's. Historically UT's have never had hydros and CUT's are avail. w/ hydro. The DK90 or PX
is definitely a UT, not a CUT.
The main difference between the two classes have been frame size and was cat. 1 vs. 2 but that has now been thrown out the window w/ 55+ hp CUT's having cat. 2.

 

[buckeyefarmer]

I ignore all those names.

 

[ovrszd]

I ignore all those names.

I tend to agree. Like I said earlier, when you get on a tractor and operate it you know what "class" it is. And it either lives up to your expectations or it doesn't.

 

[gladehound]

I started this thread to get some clarity - and I think we have it.

We have and ASAE definition of a CUT:
< 40 PTO hp
< 4,000 pounds
< Cat 1 3pt.

Thus anything that exceeds these would be a UT. However newer machines built on CUT frames have pushed hp & weight beyond the limits of the ASAE definition and incorporated Cat 1/2 eyes. Yet these machines are built on the same frame as machines that are clearly within the ASAE definition so something more was needed.

LD-1 offered front wheel size (in 4wd AG tire configuration).

20"+ rims is UT
anything under is CUT

And this seems to make sense in all cases. A limited list of tractor series falling into each class is below for anyone referencing this thread. I recommend we stop this thread right here to make this information easy to find. If people want to make the list below more extensive, just quote this post and add to it. Thanks.

Kioti - DK50se and smaller, all the NX, DS and DK10 series and the DK45s are CUT's. And the DK55 and larger, All the RX and PX series are UT.

kubota, all the L's and MX's in their current line is CUT. All the M's are UT's

Deere (an this is actually how they have them listed), All 4x are CUT and all 5x and larger are UT

Massey....2600 and bigger UT, smaller are CUTs

New Holland - Workmaster series and T4 and larger are UT, and all the boomers and "Workmaster Compact" are CUT's.

LS is as listed on their website. XJ, G, XG, and XR are CUT. K, XU, and P are all UT's.

Mahindra 4035 (CUT), Mahindra 5035 (UT)