Block Heater Question/Confusion

jk96 · Dec 9, 2016

New tractor with factory installed block heater and hydraulic fluid heater. There is a plug for both. Temps are at 11 degrees this morning so I decided it was probably time to find the plug locations and get it warmed up for weekend work. In reading the instructions I ran across this

"NOTICE: Plug the heat maintainer in when the oil is still warm from operation of the tractor. Do not use heat maintainer to heat cold oil; it will scorch the oil. Use heat maintainer after the tractor has been operated to "maintain" the oil temperature for easier starting in cold weather"

I was surprised to see this. I always thought it was ok to plug a block heater in at anytime regardless of cold weather. So looks like I need to leave it plugged in all winter long just in case its really cold outside the next time I need to use the tractor. Seems odd to me. And how would it scorch the oil when starting with cold oil vs already warm oil?

powerscol · Dec 9, 2016

Block heater should be fine - its the hydraulic one they seemed concerned about. If block heater is working I see no need for the hydraulic one. For my tractor it warms up quick if the block is warm, even with the oil cooler being separate from the radiater.

jk96 · Dec 9, 2016

powerscol said:
Block heater should be fine - its the hydraulic one they seemed concerned about. If block heater is working I see no need for the hydraulic one. For my tractor it warms up quick if the block is warm, even with the oil cooler being separate from the radiater.

Got it. Thanks. That makes more sense. The manually doesn't differentiate one from the other.

jk96 · Dec 9, 2016

Finally found the plug in the side of the block for the cord to attach to. It was behind this hose which will not flex enough to get the plug in. Going to have to warm things up to see if I can get any more flex out of this hose to get it attached. I think engineers that design these things should be forced to work on them.

Looking4new · Dec 9, 2016

jk96 said:
Finally found the plug in the side of the block for the cord to attach to. It was behind this hose which will not flex enough to get the plug in. Going to have to warm things up to see if I can get any more flex out of this hose to get it attached. I think engineers that design these things should be forced to work on them.

View attachment 490986

Why don't you cut the zip tie off, pull the hose out of the way, plug in the BH cord and then put a new zip tie in the same place. Lowes, home depot, any automotive store sells zip ties.

jk96 · Dec 9, 2016

Looking4new said:
Why don't you cut the zip tie off, pull the hose out of the way, plug in the BH cord and then put a new zip tie in the same place. Lowes, home depot, any automotive store sells zip ties.

Thanks for the information on where to purchase zip ties. Now could you please explain what exactly your are referring to when you mention the zip tie? I want to make sure I cut the correct part of the hose. Are they expensive? Easy to replace?

In all seriousness it is not the hose with the zip tie. Its the hose that runs horizontal directly under the plug in the engine block. It was originally covering the connector. Part of the engine block prevents it from being pushed up. Its too tight (no extra play to pull out away from the plug). I was able to push it down just enough to expose the plug but the direction of the connector housing prevents it from being plugged in as the orange housing has a 90 degree turn straight down into the hose location. Going to have to have to remove the hose and replace with a longer one.

roadhunter · Dec 10, 2016

Best thing for hydraulic oil in cold temps is switching to synthetic IMO. At least for me it stopped all pump whining even at sub 0 temps.

Zebrafive · Dec 10, 2016

jk96 said:
Thanks for the information on where to purchase zip ties. Now could you please explain what exactly your are referring to when you mention the zip tie? I want to make sure I cut the correct part of the hose. Are they expensive? Easy to replace?

In all seriousness it is not the hose with the zip tie. Its the hose that runs horizontal directly under the plug in the engine block. It was originally covering the connector. Part of the engine block prevents it from being pushed up. Its too tight (no extra play to pull out away from the plug). I was able to push it down just enough to expose the plug but the direction of the connector housing prevents it from being plugged in as the orange housing has a 90 degree turn straight down into the hose location. Going to have to have to remove the hose and replace with a longer one.

The "zip tie" is right be low your thumb in the picture on the hose below your hand. If you follow the hose to the left in your picture there another "zip tie" tying the hose to what looks like a steel line. I am not sure if this hose is the problem. I can't tell what hose you might mean behind/below it.

I call "zip ties" cable ties. Look for them in the electrical department. They are not expensive $3-$5 for 100.

jk96 · Dec 10, 2016

Zebrafive said:
The "zip tie" is right be low your thumb in the picture on the hose below your hand. If you follow the hose to the left in your picture there another "zip tie" tying the hose to what looks like a steel line. I am not sure if this hose is the problem. I can't tell what hose you might mean behind/below it.

I call "zip ties" cable ties. Look for them in the electrical department. They are not expensive $3-$5 for 100.

Thanks Zebra. I was aware of the item called a "cable tie" but had never heard of this so called zip tie. Your clarification brought everything home for me. I now feel more confident in myself and may not be as ignorant as first thought. I was started to feel the need for a safe space.

Problem hose is indicated by the arrow in the updated pic. It's a hydraulic line that is run so tight there is no play in it at all. Going to take a lot of work in order to get to this hose and replace with a longer one just to be able to plug into the block. I've tried pulling the line forward in order to slide the plug in behind the line but there is just no play to it at all.

jk96 · Dec 10, 2016

roadhunter said:
Best thing for hydraulic oil in cold temps is switching to synthetic IMO. At least for me it stopped all pump whining even at sub 0 temps.

New tractor is a CVT trans so hydro whine is not an issue. If I still had my hydro I would be tempted to pay the extra $ to try synthetic. I've seen a few posts from others that showed there hydro was fairly quiet. Mine was one that was not. It was pretty significant.

powerscol · Dec 10, 2016

JK96
As it is a new tractor, let the dealer sort it out. Or take your outer plug to NAPA and find a straight in one for the power. Your dealer should be able to help too. Looks like a universal female connection on the block to me. Hope this helps

on edit - Amazon.com: Kat's 285 18/3 Gauge, 5' Straight in Replacement Cord: Automotive

Also I cant tell from your picture, but can the block plug be rotated buy 90 degrees - again a dealer issue, but it is not good to have that hose underneath so close and rubbing depending on where it goes,

jk96 · Dec 10, 2016

The cord you linked to may just work. Thank you.

MHarryE · Dec 10, 2016

The block heater use is typical - plug in to warm the engine. The hydraulic oil heater is a heat maintainer. "The owners manual for my 275 magnum says the oil heater is only supposed to be used to keep oil warm. Not to try to get cold oil warmed up because it will scorch the oil right around the heater." Engine coolant has very low viscosity even in sub-zero temperatures. Hydraulic/transmission oil, however, will become very viscous in cold temperatures so the oil will not circulate freely like coolant will in an engine block where hot coolant rising will create a natural fluid movement. Oil at the very cold temperatures will not have the natural fluid movement and the oil can be scorched before circulating away from the heater. Plugging in while the fluid is still thin due to heat and the temperature will be maintained at a level where the engine will turn over easily and any shifting will be easier.

jk96 · Dec 10, 2016

MHarryE said:
The block heater use is typical - plug in to warm the engine. The hydraulic oil heater is a heat maintainer. "The owners manual for my 275 magnum says the oil heater is only supposed to be used to keep oil warm. Not to try to get cold oil warmed up because it will scorch the oil right around the heater." Engine coolant has very low viscosity even in sub-zero temperatures. Hydraulic/transmission oil, however, will become very viscous in cold temperatures so the oil will not circulate freely like coolant will in an engine block where hot coolant rising will create a natural fluid movement. Oil at the very cold temperatures will not have the natural fluid movement and the oil can be scorched before circulating away from the heater. Plugging in while the fluid is still thin due to heat and the temperature will be maintained at a level where the engine will turn over easily and any shifting will be easier.

Thanks for the information. I would have never thought about the hydraulic oil scorching if plugged in cold unless had had caught it in the manual. Powerscol thank you for the link and info. I found exactly what you suggested at our local O'Reilly's store. Straight plug without the 90 on the cord. Problem solved.

powerscol · Dec 11, 2016

Glad to help - others have done the same for me. That's what is great about this place.

The holiday best to you and your family

Merry Christmas everyone

pat32rf · Dec 11, 2016

Years ago I ordered the optional heaters on my JD. The block heater was ok but small, the hydro oil heater hung from the lowest point of the rear axle.
I wound up removing the oil heater and just plugged the hole. I also installed a large heater in the lower rad hose and a battery warmer. The three cords are all spliced together and come out as one plug. About 750 watts total but I only need to switch them on for 1/2 hour at 30 below.