Actual cost of firewood

[LD1]

I think many of us cut firewood, go deer hunting, and play sports for many of the same reasons. Life is not just about counting pennies.

You are right about that. Do what makes you happy in life.

There is more to heating decisions than just finances. Heat with whatever makes you happy at the end of the day.

The purpose of my posting.....its that I constantly hear people boasting about how many thousands of dollars they are saving. (their main justification for cutting wood in the first place). But people just need to understand the TRUE cost of burning wood which has value.....but they dont think to consider it.

Look, I dont care what you heat with or why. Just dont mis-lead people about how much money can be saved. Thats all I'm saying.

 

[gladehound]

The purpose of my posting.....its that I constantly hear people boasting about how many thousands of dollars they are saving. (their main justification for cutting wood in the first place). But people just need to understand the TRUE cost of burning wood which has value.....but they dont think to consider it.

I still think you are misunderstanding people when they are talking about their savings from heating with wood and your last post demonstrates the disconnect. Look at the words in bold.

When the vast majority of people talk about their savings they are talking about the savings from the entire process from felling to putting it in the stove. You however, are making a big deal about the savings related to the very last step (putting it in the stove) vs selling it. You are ignoring the rest of the process. That value of the wood is the value created by the rest of the process and it isn't appropriate to subtract it out when valuing the entire process.

 

[LD1]

I still think you are misunderstanding people when they are talking about their savings from heating with wood and your last post demonstrates the disconnect. Look at the words in bold.

When the vast majority of people talk about their savings they are talking about the savings from the entire process from felling to putting it in the stove. You however, are making a big deal about the savings related to the very last step (putting it in the stove) vs selling it. You are ignoring the rest of the process. That value of the wood is the value created by the rest of the process and it isn't appropriate to subtract it out when valuing the entire process.

You HAVE to put a dollar value on the "rest of the process" which you are not.

I think THAT is the disconnect. As you feel your time and effort to cut all of that wood is only costing you the few bucks to run your saw. And the labor you are just chalking up to exercise.

Its easy to assign a dollar value to the "rest of the process". Its whatever the wood is selling for in your area. Weather that be delivered, delivered and stacked, or the customer picks up.

Money (dollars) is just the medium.

Weather you cut wood to burn, or to sell......at the end of the day you are ultimately trading wood for heat. You choose the direct approach of burning 6-8 cord a year.....which directly heats your house.

I too trade wood for heat. But I first trade wood for dollars.....then trade dollars for heat. But the same end game.

Not directly YOUR numbers, but just some random simple numbers to illustrate.
Lets say you cut, split, stack, and burn 10 cord of wood a year to keep warm. DIRECT cost to you is maybe $100 a season for consumables like saw gas. You think you are doing great because it would cost you $2000 a year to the power or fuel company to keep warm. So you assume you are saving $2000-$100=$1900 by directly burning the wood. And justify doing so because....man thats alot of savings.

But reality check. Do the EXACT SAME WORK of cutting splitting, and stacking that 10 cord of wood. But rather than burn........trade it for cash. Lets say $160/cord (prices in my area). Take out the same $100 worth of consumables and you pocket $1500. Throw another $500 with it and buy your heat.

So are you "really" saving $1900/yr? or is it closer to $500/yr savings. BIG difference. Thats my whole point.

And with regional differences, these numbers can be all over the place. You might be able to heat your house on $1000 worth of wood and would cost you $3000 for another form, be it electric, fuel, etc. Or you might be burning $2000 worth of wood when $2000 worth of gas would have heated your house just as well.......yet you still think you are saving $2000 because you are not "directly" paying for your heat.

I find it hard to believe there are THAT many people saving THOUSANDS AND THOUSANDS heating with wood. Pre-Geo at my house I had 2 options. Wood (6-cord a year....value $960). Or baseboard heaters at ~$2000 per 6-month season.

I "actually" saved just a tad over $1000/yr in the 2 years I burned. Certainly not the $2000/yr that it would "seem" on the face of it.

With so many people claiming they save $20k+ over 8-10 years.....I find that just a tad optimistic......and feel there is more to the story and those arent accounting for the value of the wood, had they choose to sell it instead of burn it. Because that value ABSOLUTELY needs to be factored in if you are gonna boast about how much you save burning wood.

 

[CobyRupert]

By burning the wood he saved $1900.

By selling the wood, he saved $1400
$1400 = ($1500 (income) - $100 (expenses); or calculated another way
$1400 = $2000 (what he would have to pay for fuel) - $500 (what he now pays for fuel) - $100 (expenses)

 

[nickmags]

You HAVE to put a dollar value on the "rest of the process" which you are not.

I think THAT is the disconnect. As you feel your time and effort to cut all of that wood is only costing you the few bucks to run your saw. And the labor you are just chalking up to exercise.

Its easy to assign a dollar value to the "rest of the process". Its whatever the wood is selling for in your area. Weather that be delivered, delivered and stacked, or the customer picks up.

Money (dollars) is just the medium.

Weather you cut wood to burn, or to sell......at the end of the day you are ultimately trading wood for heat. You choose the direct approach of burning 6-8 cord a year.....which directly heats your house.

I too trade wood for heat. But I first trade wood for dollars.....then trade dollars for heat. But the same end game.

Not directly YOUR numbers, but just some random simple numbers to illustrate.
Lets say you cut, split, stack, and burn 10 cord of wood a year to keep warm. DIRECT cost to you is maybe $100 a season for consumables like saw gas. You think you are doing great because it would cost you $2000 a year to the power or fuel company to keep warm. So you assume you are saving $2000-$100=$1900 by directly burning the wood. And justify doing so because....man thats alot of savings.

But reality check. Do the EXACT SAME WORK of cutting splitting, and stacking that 10 cord of wood. But rather than burn........trade it for cash. Lets say $160/cord (prices in my area). Take out the same $100 worth of consumables and you pocket $1500. Throw another $500 with it and buy your heat.

So are you "really" saving $1900/yr? or is it closer to $500/yr savings. BIG difference. Thats my whole point.

And with regional differences, these numbers can be all over the place. You might be able to heat your house on $1000 worth of wood and would cost you $3000 for another form, be it electric, fuel, etc. Or you might be burning $2000 worth of wood when $2000 worth of gas would have heated your house just as well.......yet you still think you are saving $2000 because you are not "directly" paying for your heat.

I find it hard to believe there are THAT many people saving THOUSANDS AND THOUSANDS heating with wood. Pre-Geo at my house I had 2 options. Wood (6-cord a year....value $960). Or baseboard heaters at ~$2000 per 6-month season.

I "actually" saved just a tad over $1000/yr in the 2 years I burned. Certainly not the $2000/yr that it would "seem" on the face of it.

With so many people claiming they save $20k+ over 8-10 years.....I find that just a tad optimistic......and feel there is more to the story and those arent accounting for the value of the wood, had they choose to sell it instead of burn it. Because that value ABSOLUTELY needs to be factored in if you are gonna boast about how much you save burning wood.

What you say makes sense to me, and I agree $20k is very optimistic. Being retired, I have more time than dollars, so cutting dead standing trees on my own land for me is virtually free. If nothing else I'm not forced to come up with large monthly sums of cash money to give to power or oil companies. For ME not spending money translates to saving money.

 

[buckeyefarmer]

Just think how much it cost me to watch tv every night, when i could be working instead. I cant afford to sleep now, knowing the cost i have to charge myself.

 

[Sawyer Rob]

Just think how much it cost me to watch tv every night, when i could be working instead. I cant afford to sleep now, knowing the cost i have to charge myself.

AND worse yet, I bought my self a big screen TV for Christmas!!

NOW, I feel so guilty!! lol

SR

 

[Piston]

Just think how much it cost me to watch tv every night, when i could be working instead. I cant afford to sleep now, knowing the cost i have to charge myself.

Exactly! We don’t need to put a dollar amount on every activity we do. Imagine how much more money I could make if I worked every hour I’ve spent raising 3 children. Boy they become expensive.

Or, in better perspective, how much time is spent on TBN trying to convince others how much money they are NOT making? Imagine how much you are losing by not earning income while convincing others that they are spending too much on firewood.

Like I said before. Life is more than just counting pennies.

 

[beowulf]

So much of this depends on personal habits and where you live and convenience and ambience, and so on.

I have no idea what I save or could save or what I lose or could lose by burning wood vs selling wood. Does not really matter to me. We spend about $1200 a year for propane (two tanks, one for house and one for gym/guest house and laundry room). That propane is, however, used for hot water heaters in both buildings, and for the gas dryer, as well as for furnaces in both buildings. The guest house furnace is only on when we have guests. In any case, I cannot isolate what I spend on propane just for heating.

We don't burn fire wood in the mornings when we get up unless it is going to be really cold or rainy all day and we will be inside all day. Most days in the Winter we will run the furnace for a while in the morning to warm up the house. It is then typically turned off and we are outside. In the evenings if it is really cold we will start a fire - we do this because it is nice to have a fire - cozy - and with a ceiling fan on reverse and slow - it will gradually heat up most of the house. On those evenings we do save a bit as not using propane - but over a year it is likely not a lot. Sometimes it is just more convenient to turn on the furnace for a while rather than starting a fire that we don't need for a protracted period of time.

The fire wood we have stored up (and give away) is mostly a byproduct of other activities (on our 90 acres of substantially wooded acres) such as taking out old trees, fallen branches, clearing up roads, and scrap lumber from projects. And the labor expended in those chores (and the equipment associated costs for saws, fuel, tractor, etc. ) would be expended anyway. And those tasks also provide benefits independent of the wood we get - e.g., satisfaction, improving the property, exercise, time with spouse in joint ventures, and so on. And the dogs enjoy the time with us as they think we are out helping them hunt squirrels.

So, again, each experience will be different. If you are saving money one way or another, or think you are saving money, or are not saving money. . . well, its all fine.

 

[ultrarunner]

We do only about 2 cords a year and that is because Mom likes doing it... it reminds her of another time and at 83 seeing a neatly stacked cord of split oak provides great satisfaction... we don't do it anymore on her property but now at my brother's place... they are too busy so I took my splitter to the farm... with the deal anything I leave here will be kept inside...

Two weeks ago she was chipping and not splitting... keeps her active... thankfully there were only about 30 unsold cut trees this season... sad to chip but enjoying the new chipper...