How to transition to MIG?

[BigBlue1]

I have been welding with stick as my only method for many years. Not that I'm good at it or have done it a ton, but I can make metal stick together passably. It doesn't look great and I wouldn't stake my life on the results but most of my projects are non-critical and they hold up fine.

Stick welding is a pain though, probably because I'm not that good at it. Sometimes it is hard to strike an arc. Probably using the wrong type of rod. And I probably should get a better helmet that is auto-darkening so I can see what I'm doing before I strike the arc randomly an inch away from where I'm supposed to be starting. I know I have some challenges overall. Going to work on those. My welder is an ancient (30-40 year old) Lincoln buzzbox. I think it is in decent condition but I guess it is possible that it may not be in tip-top form itself so that may contribute to my pains. I have replaced the leads and ends recently.

But I'd like to get into MIG welding. It seems like it may be a little easier to control things and not be as futzy as stick welding. Is this a reasonable thought? Does anyone have a pointer for someone who knows the general concepts of welding to get up to speed on MIG? Things like choosing fluxed vs. non-flux wire, what gas is needed, wire thickness to choose, wire speed, etc? I'd like to learn about it before buying a new welder.

Thanks,
Rob

 

[mike48130]

Plenty of youtube videos out there.

The one tip I will say, if you haven't bought a welder yet, get one with the auto wire feed setting. Then you just set the temp and the welder will set the wire speed. Works for most applications until you might get into the thin sheetmetal stuff or something odd.

Look up the Millermatic 211. There are other brands with the same, but I found it to be very helpful for someone who is not a super experienced welder.

 

[BigBlue1]

Thanks for the tip. Does the Hobart 210MVP have that auto speed capability? That's the one I've been eyeing. Seems like it is pretty capable and highly regarded and also only about half the price of the Miller 211.

Rob

 

[ovrszd]

This is a great topic. You should get a LOT of response. There are several Craftsman Welder Guys on here!!!

MIG is much easier to use than stick. Your technical questions can only be answered by knowing your expectations in regards to thickness of metal, etc.?

Hobart makes a nice affordable 140A MIG welder that will use gas/solid core wire or flux coated wire. I'm not pimping Hobart but they are readily available and expendables are easy to find. With that Amp range you'll probably use .030 wire.

This is just me now. I wouldn't buy a 110V MIG welder. Just like if I thought I needed a 30hp tractor I wouldn't buy a 25HP. Since you already are welding you have a need. Buy a brand name, 220V, 140A minimum, gas capable welder. You'll love it.

If Mark from Everlast gets in here he'll give you very logical, sensible advice whether you buy his brand or not.

Edit: I have a Miller 250 that I run .035 wire with 75/25 gas.

 

[mike48130]

Thanks for the tip. Does the Hobart 210MVP have that auto speed capability? That's the one I've been eyeing. Seems like it is pretty capable and highly regarded and also only about half the price of the Miller 211.

Rob

No. But has the dual voltage which is nice. I have used mine on 120 or 220 volt based on different occasions to use it.

I bought my 211 used, and never had an issue, but it was basically new when I bought it. Go to a local welding store, sometimes they do demo days.

 

[mike48130]

Thanks for the tip. Does the Hobart 210MVP have that auto speed capability? That's the one I've been eyeing. Seems like it is pretty capable and highly regarded and also only about half the price of the Miller 211.

Rob

No. But has the dual voltage which is nice. I have used mine on 120 or 220 volt based on different occasions to use it.

I bought my 211 used, and never had an issue, but it was basically new when I bought it. Go to a local welding store, sometimes they do demo days.

 

[ovrszd]

No. But has the dual voltage which is nice. I have used mine on 120 or 220 volt based on different occasions to use it.

I bought my 211 used, and never had an issue, but it was basically new when I bought it. Go to a local welding store, sometimes they do demo days.

I traded my Miller 180 millermatic to a guy for the Miller 250 I now have. Even trade. I was giddy.

With the millermatic feature I always had to bump up the wire speed just a pinch. And I wanted to weld thicker metal.

 

[BigBlue1]

This is a great topic. You should get a LOT of response. There are several Craftsman Welder Guys on here!!!

MIG is much easier to use than stick. Your technical questions can only be answered by knowing your expectations in regards to thickness of metal, etc.?

Hobart makes a nice affordable 140A MIG welder that will use gas/solid core wire or flux coated wire. I'm not pimping Hobart but they are readily available and expendables are easy to find. With that Amp range you'll probably use .030 wire.

This is just me now. I wouldn't buy a 110V MIG welder. Just like if I thought I needed a 30hp tractor I wouldn't buy a 25HP. Since you already are welding you have a need. Buy a brand name, 220V, 140A minimum, gas capable welder. You'll love it.

If Mark from Everlast gets in here he'll give you very logical, sensible advice whether you buy his brand or not.

Edit: I have a Miller 250 that I run .035 wire with 75/25 gas.

Thanks. I'm not looking for specific answers on those welding concepts, just the guidelines and knowledge needed to figure that stuff out as I encounter situations.

I'm not looking for an entry-level MIG. But also not a high-end unit. I want something capable of welding at least 1/4" steel and hopefully 3/8". I'm a guy that likes to go a little overkill but not wastefully so. Last thing I want is to buy something that I outgrow soon or that disappoints me when I need to do something. I have 220V in my shop for my stick welder but having a 110/220V capable one that can be portable to 110V sites would be a plus. That's why the Hobart 210MVP looks good to me.

Thanks,
Rob

 

[Big Barn]

Rob.
From what you say though I think you would greatly benefit from:

1 purchasing an auto darkening helmet
2 having an experienced welder go over technique and use of your current stick welder with you.
3 then by all means purchase a MIG welder as an upgrade if you wish.

Good luck

 

[searcyfarms]

bigblue1 - i started as a kid on a lincoln buzzbox and have used 3 of them for years, one at my house, one at the farm and one at my buddies that i bought for him at his farm so we had a welder, I will say this, I LOVE stick welding outside of overhead or vertical, im not proficient with it. However give me a flat angle and boy it will be pretty.

Next, if you are doing farm welding like me - on rusty, painted broken farm stuff - stick is the way to go - you can do some with flux wire but if it is any thickness to speak of it will take a good sized mig and unless you get one with dual voltage it will not be very portable.

I am not as fond of the MIG for several, due to the nature of the tip they are harder to see the puddle, if you use gas your piece to be welded HAS to be clean AND you will not have good luck if there is any WIND to blow the gas around. Flux core is not subject to the wind and burns a little hotter than the gas mig.

That being said its much easier to product a lovely looking weld with a mig but i think a little more difficult to be sure of your penetration due to the fascination of such a great looking weld.

Not sure what kind of stick you are using in your buzz box but i can tell you w/out reservation the 7014 is the BEST rod to run in a lincoln AC225 box, i will make some amazing welds.

I HATE 6011, 6013 is mehhhh, 7018 stink even 7018AC rods, never tried to run a 6010 in a 225AC buzzer but they probably wouldnt run that well. 7014 is the only rod i run in my buzzers. Since moving to a idealarc 250 with ac/dc i love the 6010 in it, the 7018 are ok BUT they are a pain to start cause you have to whack the stick each time to start to chip off the flux that seals over on the end of it due to the nature of the rod.

Mig is great for thinner stuff than your AC225 is capable of so what you are trying to weld will determine what you want to look for with the MIG.

Mig is much more complicated to weld than stick. You have more variables such as prep, temp, speed, angle, wire vs gas, so as was mentioned to help you in that get one of the auto synergy/setting type

millermatic - autoset is their term
lincoln - 210mp
vulvan - omni 220
everlast - 211si is one

many options but just wanted to throw that out there - what kind of welding are your plans for? new? repairs? thick? thin? aluminum? cast?

 

[BigBlue1]

Most of the welding I've done or am likely to do is either fabbing up stuff for my shop/tractors/equipment or repairs. Likely things like 1/8 - 1/4" angle and flat stock or round tube mostly. I've done things like replace a rusted frame on a small utility trailer, build my own welding table, weld up a frame for steps for a camper, build brackets for my MC510 cart's hydraulic dump that I added, tools and jigs for shop work. Unlikely to be any sheet metal or non-steel, though maybe aluminum some day.

I've tried 6010, 6011, 6013 rods. 6011 and 6013 have worked decently, 6013 the best. 6010 is a miserable failure that I can't get an arc struck with. I think I bought the 6010 accidentally without realizing they are mostly for DC welders. Never tried the 7014.

I want more precise control of the weld and better looking welds. Like I said initially, most of what I weld is structurally sound but the welds are a bit messy with a lot of splatter.

Rob

 

[ovrszd]

I think you are an excellent candidate for a MIG welder.

I used my Lincoln tombstone welder last Summer to burn 3 7018 rods on a disc repair. I can't remember the time before that. Got it if needed, just rarely needed.

I will say my 250 might be a bit big for you. Lots harder to weld thin metal.

The 175A range seems to be the most widely used.

 

[WranglerX]

Might want to do a little viewing of site link below of curious about MIG

Welding Tips and Tricks - TIG, MIG, Stick and a pantload of other info

I transitioned from stick to MIG after selling old tombstone Lincoln... Love the MIG, so much simpler, and only thing to relearn was how focus arc to ensure getting good penetration and weld area prep is a little fussier (clean steel)....

I have Hobart Handler 140 (120V AC machine) but seriously thinking of selling and going to a dual voltage (120V/240v) machine to get the bigger amperage for bigger materials...

Whatever you do if you go MIG is get a machine the will do FCAW (Flux Core Arc Weld) and GMAW (Gas Metal Arc Weld)... Might even consider a combo machine the can do Stick, MIG. and TIG then you can have best of all worlds....

Dale

 

[WranglerX]

Thanks for the tip. Does the Hobart 210MVP have that auto speed capability? That's the one I've been eyeing. Seems like it is pretty capable and highly regarded and also only about half the price of the Miller 211.

Rob

No... All manual settings.... BUT it's a really good machine once you learn its operation....

Dale

 

[BigBlue1]

Thanks for the tips, guys. I'll follow up on the suggestions.

Rob

 

[fried1765]

This is a great topic. You should get a LOT of response. There are several Craftsman Welder Guys on here!!!

MIG is much easier to use than stick. Your technical questions can only be answered by knowing your expectations in regards to thickness of metal, etc.?

Hobart makes a nice affordable 140A MIG welder that will use gas/solid core wire or flux coated wire. I'm not pimping Hobart but they are readily available and expendables are easy to find. With that Amp range you'll probably use .030 wire.

This is just me now. I wouldn't buy a 110V MIG welder. Just like if I thought I needed a 30hp tractor I wouldn't buy a 25HP. Since you already are welding you have a need. Buy a brand name, 220V, 140A minimum, gas capable welder. You'll love it.

If Mark from Everlast gets in here he'll give you very logical, sensible advice whether you buy his brand or not.

Edit: I have a Miller 250 that I run .035 wire with 75/25 gas.

It seems as thought the Hobart Handler 190 MIG (220V only) might be a more cost effective option for the OP.
TSC lists it at $649.99, and it is a great machine.
Lots of very poisitive reviews!

 

[MinnesotaDaveChalmers]

I have been welding with stick as my only method for many years. Not that I'm good at it or have done it a ton, but I can make metal stick together passably. It doesn't look great and I wouldn't stake my life on the results but most of my projects are non-critical and they hold up fine.

Stick welding is a pain though, probably because I'm not that good at it. Sometimes it is hard to strike an arc. Probably using the wrong type of rod. And I probably should get a better helmet that is auto-darkening so I can see what I'm doing before I strike the arc randomly an inch away from where I'm supposed to be starting. I know I have some challenges overall. Going to work on those. My welder is an ancient (30-40 year old) Lincoln buzzbox. I think it is in decent condition but I guess it is possible that it may not be in tip-top form itself so that may contribute to my pains. I have replaced the leads and ends recently.

But I'd like to get into MIG welding. It seems like it may be a little easier to control things and not be as futzy as stick welding. Is this a reasonable thought? Does anyone have a pointer for someone who knows the general concepts of welding to get up to speed on MIG? Things like choosing fluxed vs. non-flux wire, what gas is needed, wire thickness to choose, wire speed, etc? I'd like to learn about it before buying a new welder.

Thanks,
Rob

Mig is a good process - I use it as much as stick and tig. Faster to learn too.
Hard wire 0.030" (gas shielded) will do about anything you want - even outside. If it's windy, lean a piece of plywood up against the item to block it.
I use 0.030" and 0.035" way more than 0.024". I just used 0.035" for body panels a few months ago and it worked fine.

I use 100% co2 for shielding because it's cheap. Standard mixed gas works great too.
There is almost no need to get more fancy that regular mig wire, and 71t-11 self shielded flux core (for when you really can't use shielding gas).
In my opinion, everything else is just for goofing off and seeing if you like it (like spray arc or gas shielded flux core or pulse mig, etc.).

There are a few things to know. Wire feed speed is your amperage - it controls penetration (depth of fusion).
Voltage controls bead profile. If a bead is tall and ropey, increase volts to widen and flatten puddle.
If arc is spattery and unstable, bead wide and flat, lower voltage until it runs right.

Stay on the leading edge of the puddle. If you don't actually see the arc cut into fresh metal, then assume it didn't.

If you're just an occasional welder who fixes things as needed, you'll likely really like mig. Get one in the 180-200 amp size and weld happy

 

[Big Barn]

It seems as thought the Hobart Handler 190 MIG (220V only) might be a more cost effective option for the OP.
TSC lists it at $649.99, and it is a great machine.
Lots of very poisitive reviews!

Another vote for the Hobart Mig. I had the predecessor to the 190 (187) and it was a great little welder.

I would love to try an Everlast MIG machine if I had the chance.

 

[searcyfarms]

90day wty i not good for the HF unit, although you can buy an extended then you are getting up in price - just FYI get waht you can afford - id stay away from the 110 units unless price is an issue as most folks wish they had the 220v more amperage option later - again depends on how much you want/have to spend - u have lots of options for aluminum not just tig but if you go tig you will need an AC machine for tig not DC tig so remember that

u can weld aluminum with a mig/spool gun although typically not really thin aluminum from my understanding - oxy acet for aluminum and also stick weld aluminum, tig will of course do the prettiest from what i have been told i dont do it i would just have someone else do it.

flux mig will give you splatter like arc/stick just not as much so keep that in mind - to get the cleanest u will want gas

if you are building new stuff u will likely grab your mig, if you are fixing rusty old broken down stuff and in a hurry you will grab your stick

 

[Birdhunter1]

I had that same welder, I found it ran 7014 and 6013 very well, I could make semi decent welds with 7108AC but I never loved it. But I've also welded alot of stuff that was welded very well and it has taken alot of abuse and never failed.

Having taken several welding classes and done alot of welding work I knew I could weld better with other welders and was never pleased with that Lincoln 250 amp a unit, but the budget I had when I bought it that's what I could afford and I knew it would work.

I first bought a 140 amp Everlast mig, it work swell up to 1/4" steel, will do 3/8' if beveled out well, but I mainly bought it for 1/" and smaller stuff and to tack stuff together, namely horseshoe art kind of stuff. I later bought an Everlast 200 amp DC stick welder and absolutely love it, much easier to weld every rod with than the Lincoln Tombstone ever did, dual 110/220 voltage but I'm not impressed with it on 110 and only use it on 220, but at the inrush currents it has It can run on just about any 220V outlet.

The Lincoln Tombstone went away pretty fast, I put a price on it for someone really needing a good welder with a really low budget.