Ag vs flat face on grapple

TomIre · Apr 30, 2020

I'm going to add a grapple to my tractor and so can specify what couplers to use. I'm thinking flat face since easier to clean and fits more skid steer accessories if I ever buy/rent anything.
I'll need to add a third function as well so will be easy enough to get same fittings.
But, don't have any real experience to go on. Smart move or am I missing something?

Redlands Okie · Apr 30, 2020

I have flat face on my FEL because of the rental and swapping tools situation. I will say mine are a bit harder to bleed off than ag style when connecting them. They are easy to clean. Just in case you swap out tools with other equipment a lot and if your kind of picky like I am keep in mind the fluid mixing between units. I usually hook up one line and loosen the connection on the other when I install attachments back onto my tractor. Then bleed the line a bit to help insure only my fluid type ends up in my tractor.

jjp8182 · Apr 30, 2020

Either will work. The ag connections are cheaper, but will lose a bit of fluid when connecting/disconnecting. The flat face won't lose fluid, but are more expensive and can be a bit harder to connect if the implement lines build up pressure when unconnected (e.g. thermal expansion of the fluid).

Since my tractor came with the ag-style connectors on the 3rd function that's what I use, and when I bought an implement with flat face all I did was make an elbow adapting connectors that have ag connectors on one side and flat face on the other.

hosspuller · Apr 30, 2020

Yesterday, I fitted flat face to my tractors to use the hay grapple. The grapple has a skid steer mount and hydraulic connection. So the tractors were adapted.

LD1 · Apr 30, 2020

Unless you get the connect-under-pressure flat face couplers, they are a pain. Which is why I went with ags.

IF I ever had the need to rent/borrow something with FF couplers, either swapping the tractor ones or swapping the implement ones is pretty easy.

But I'd rather not deal with the PITA year round for the once-in-a-blue-moon that I rent/borrow something and have to swap couplers

Industrial Toys · Apr 30, 2020

Flat face seal nicely unlike Pinoneer Females that require a plug to keep dirt out. Left outside, Flat face couplers can seize solid. I have a lot of FF connectors and they are a GIANT pain to connect under the slightest pressure, like temperature changes. In winter, carrying a propane torch is a MUST!

jjp8182 · May 2, 2020

Industrial Toys said:
Flat face seal nicely unlike Pinoneer Females that require a plug to keep dirt out. Left outside, Flat face couplers can seize solid. I have a lot of FF connectors and they are a GIANT pain to connect under the slightest pressure, like temperature changes. In winter, carrying a propane torch is a MUST!

Summer time issues with flat face couplers here; make the mistake of leaving an unconnected implement sit in the sun for an half hour or more and ....good luck. Had that experience a couple of times, so when I'm needing to use multiple implements for a task, the unused one will be unhooked and left in any shade I think will last long enough for me to come back to the implement.

One of the handy things about having the elbow adapter is (if needed) it's easier to force the connection on a flat face connector when it's not on the machine in a place where you can't use you're body weight to help make the connection.

Thunder chicken · May 4, 2020

sorry slightly off topic, but what about putting a ball valve at the end of the hose, then your preferred coupler? urn off the valve, disconnect ( leave he grapple open even if you'd like). then there's no pressure pushing on the coupler to make reconnecting difficult? it's all behind the ball valve.... a hyd rated ball valve ain't cheap, but...?

rScotty · May 4, 2020

LD1 said:
Unless you get the connect-under-pressure flat face couplers, they are a pain. Which is why I went with ags.

IF I ever had the need to rent/borrow something with FF couplers, either swapping the tractor ones or swapping the implement ones is pretty easy.

But I'd rather not deal with the PITA year round for the once-in-a-blue-moon that I rent/borrow something and have to swap couplers

I'm pretty ignorant about this. Mine are just Ag type, I don't switch them much, and I tap the ball to release the pressure. No real problem.

I keep meaning to make or buy a tool to push the ball, but never have.

But now I'm curious. If there are connect-under-pressure couplers that work why doesn't everyone use them?
rScotty

ericm979 · May 4, 2020

They cost more. And the ones I have tried both flat face and ag style have super stiff release collars. So stiff that I find them too difficult to use.

dstig1 · May 4, 2020

rScotty said:
I'm pretty ignorant about this. Mine are just Ag type, I don't switch them much, and I tap the ball to release the pressure. No real problem.

I keep meaning to make or buy a tool to push the ball, but never have.

But now I'm curious. If there are connect-under-pressure couplers that work why doesn't everyone use them?
rScotty

I have them, and they don't really seem to solve the problem. I still fight to connect my flat face couplers on the tractor and grapple. i was hoping for better...

TractorGuy · May 4, 2020

I have iso poppet on mine.

Redlands Okie · May 4, 2020

I put a “T” on each hydraulic line on the attachments then I took the ag connectors (section that has the ball on the end) that the attachments had on them originally add a short hose and attached them to the “T”.
Now I just bump the ag fitting against something and it releases the pressure. Makes for easy hook up of the flat face fittings. Its a few bucks for the rig up but it works great, fast and easy.

TomIre · May 4, 2020

Sounds like somebody needs to invent a better coupler system! Intended up going with ag. If and when I rent something, I'll deal with it then.

ptsg · May 4, 2020

TomIre said:
Sounds like somebody needs to invent a better coupler system! Intended up going with ag. If and when I rent something, I'll deal with it then.

You can always buy a Ag to flat face adapter for those sporadic uses of rental attachments.

Something like this: https://www.amazon.com/16028-Pioneer-Style-Coupler-Adapter/dp/B07NZ2NHCV

Redlands Okie · May 4, 2020

Unless your swapping a lot with flat face coupler attachments its easier to do the adapter or swap fittings. You can always do something later if needed and save the money and hassle for now.

LD1 · May 5, 2020

TomIre said:
Sounds like somebody needs to invent a better coupler system! Intended up going with ag. If and when I rent something, I'll deal with it then.

Flat face were the "better" coupler.

Ag's worked for years, but the spill a few drops of oil every time they are hooked and unhooked.

The FF solve that. But create another issue.

SO if someone were to come up with a "better" coupler system now,'' It would just be one more of already many styles out there just to confuse people. IT is one of those times I just wish we could unwind the clock a bit and eliminate so many of the different couplers that all do pretty much the same thing, and even look similar, but DONT interchange.

Like ISO 5675's (which people generically call "AG's")....ISO 7241...series A or ISO 7241 series B.

All three look similar.

I know if you dont work with various equipment and hydraulics often, or own all your own stuff and keep things uniform, you dont really understand the frustration it can cause. But its alot like air couplers. The "industrual" vs "automotive" style.
Borrow a air tool off a friend, or take an air tool to a friends to help and find out you gotta swap this or swap that because the nipples are the wrong "style". Such a PITA. They do the EXACT SAME THING. One is no better than the other. WHAT IS THE NEED TO CONTINUE MAKING BOTH STYLES?

oosik · May 5, 2020

My 2009 Kubota came with OEM Euro style quick attach implement coupler. I have either the grapple or bucket for the FEL. It's actually pretty easy if you follow the directions and are on hard ground.

FTG-05 · May 8, 2020

LD1 said:
Unless you get the connect-under-pressure flat face couplers, they are a pain. Which is why I went with ags.

IF I ever had the need to rent/borrow something with FF couplers, either swapping the tractor ones or swapping the implement ones is pretty easy.

But I'd rather not deal with the PITA year round for the once-in-a-blue-moon that I rent/borrow something and have to swap couplers

I have to partially disassemble one of my FF couplers everytime I hook up my grapple. Doesn't seem to matter what i do to prevent it; it's just impossible for me to make the connection with my hand strength.

Has anyone bought and used one of these tools from Ken's Bolt On Hooks:

Video on how it works:

Waite Hydraulic Decompression Tool Video - YouTube