Ford 4610SU Log Winch Setup

[ETD66SS]

Looking to log some Scots Pine to use as sawn non-structural lumber for my house build. Need a quick and dirty log winch setup, can't afford a ~$8000 log skidding winch right now.

I'm looking to use the frame from my cheap County Line 3pt hole auger and mount a winch to the draw bar.

My question is, how cheap of a winch can I get away with? I'd like a winch with wireless remote so I can follow the log with a cant hook to maneuver it through obstacles.

I won't use the very end of the auger frame to lift the logs, most likely I'll mount a clevis to one of the available locations closer to the 3pt lift arms.

My tractor has iirc about 500 lbs of suitcase weights on the front, making the tractor weigh about 5500-6000 lbs. I plan to buy a ~9000-10000 lb winch.

I won't have a blade to push in the ground to stabilize the tractor when pulling the logs. The logs I will be dealing with will vary from ~16" to 22" at the butt end and 25ft long. Green, that size Scots pine should be around ~2500 lbs.

I intend to use the tractor battery to run the winch, so the tractor will be running with parking brakes applied when I'm skidding.

Has anyone done something similar? Thoughts? Would Synthetic rope be better/worse than wore rope? I'd like a winch with the guide rollers, those seem to only come on winches with wire rope.

 

[Sawyer Rob]

IF you can't afford a 8k skidding winch, why don't you buy a 4k one?

It will still be a thousand times better than what ever you cobble up, and the 4k skidding winch will have some actual "resale", when you are done with it.

SR

 

[ETD66SS]

Because I am building a house and can't spend 4k right now. But thanks for the "tip".

 

[Sawyer Rob]

The real "tip" was/is, spending 4k now (actually, they can be bought for less) you would have a winch to use right now, and you WILL get your money back later...

Best part is, "later" you may be better off, and can keep the winch, as once you have one, you won't want to give it up!

SR

 

[CobyRupert]

There’s been a lot of threads about using electric winches on tractors as logging winches. I think people use them in a very limited capacity. Maybe one log here and there. Keep in mind that tractors come with pto shafts instead of electrical receptacles. Most other thread comments focus on:

What is amperage rating of tractor’s alternator? It’s usually low compared to other type vehicles and compared to winch’s demand. What is winch’s amperage demand?
We’re only talking 12volts here, so amperage has to be high to get any power. (At best, it takes about 56 amps (at 13.2 volts) to get 1 horsepower from the winch.

What is winch’s speed? Again, some people find them intolerably slow. Again, being slow makes them quick to drain the battery only after 1 pull or two.

What is the winch’s duty cycle? A “cheap and dirty” winch may claim to have a lot of pull, but for how long before it overheats? (Then again, resting the winch may go together with having to let the battery try to recharge.)

It probably would be faster (operating and constructing) and cheaper to get a few fixed length (25’, 75’, 125’) sections of cable (that you’d have to buy anyways) and some snatch block (pulleys) and do your logging with those.

 

[ericm979]

A hydraulic winch would have a better duty cycle but the ones that run off power steering need something like 3 gpm at 1500 psi so you'd have to have some flow control and relief valves.

Forestry winches have a "shoe" that digs in to resist the force of the winch pulling the tractor backwards. You'd need to make that. Otherwise you'll be depending on the parking brake and tire traction alone to keep the tractor from moving. Forestry winches also have longer cables than truck winches- 160-230' vs 60 or 70.

I've been using cables and chains to pull logs and the big limitation there is having a space to move the tractor the same distance you need to pull the log. My land is steep and wooded so tractor movement is limited. Yours may be better in that regard.

 

[ETD66SS]

I'd be using the winch to pull about 16 to 20 logs that weigh 1500 to 2500 lbs. I don't have the time to be making logging paths to the trees I intend to cut down, and the one path I do have is only abou 8-10ft wide. Not a lot of room for snatch blocks etc as the woods are too thick to even walk through, really want a remote control winch option.

I figure the winch could go on my utility trailer after this job. The amperage and duty cycle comment is a good point. Likely rules out the Chinesium winches for $300.

I'd love a skidding winch, because I do have more logging to do in the coming years. However I'd want one sized to my tractor, which iirc is 58 HP at the PTO. So buying a 15-30 HP rated $4k skidding winch doesn't seem like a great idea. The correct size skidding winch with wireless remote would be a 30-60 HP unit which run like $7-9k, can't do that right now.

All I need to buy is a winch atm. I do have a PTO HYD pump for this tractor, so maybe a HYD winch is an option, but then it can'tbe move to my trailer.

 

[WranglerX]

Think a capstan "winch" would be most economical..... Most electric winches are for occasional "recovery" use, not really a good choice for continual log skidding.... If you tractor does not have a 150+ AMP Alternator and a robust battery an electric winch will be good for about one pull and you will have to run tractor for a hour or so to recover the battery....

Hydraulic winch is more adaptable for winching with a drum style winch.. As hydraulic power is continuous as long as engine is running... But quite expensive...
Easy and cheapest solution may be a "log arch" and back up to log, chain up. hoist and drag it out....

logarch - Google Search

capstan winch - Google Search

 

[ETD66SS]

I can't back up to the logs, they will need to be pulled dozens of feet through a real dense forest.

I've got 60+ acres, I logged about 5 acres of it the past 15 years with my 575D backhoe. It's easy when you're basically clearcutting. Not doing that this time around. I have a narrow windy path that is about 1800ft long, and looking to pick and choose choice trees for decorative beams, panneling & trim.

The Norwood hyd winch looks interesting but my tractor does not have remotes.

 

[Wyobuckaroo]

Like in the picture posted, I have used the arch portion of the post hole digger to skid timber.. Using the arch with the top link and not the arm portion of the PHD...

Using a hook on a heavy quick chain link pinned to the point where the top link attaches to the arch.. This to lift the log, then using the fixed draw bar to pull the load has worked well for me..
Keep safe...

 

[ETD66SS]

Like in the picture posted, I have used the arch portion of the post hole digger to skid timber.. Using the arch with the top link and not the arm portion of the PHD...

Using a hook on a heavy quick chain link pinned to the point where the top link attaches to the arch.. This to lift the log, then using the fixed draw bar to pull the load has worked well for me..
Keep safe...

I did just that today as a test, it works pretty well. Just need to come up with a winch solution now.

 

[ROUSTABOUT]

Looking to log some Scots Pine to use as sawn non-structural lumber for my house build. Need a quick and dirty log winch setup, can't afford a ~$8000 log skidding winch right now.

I'm looking to use the frame from my cheap County Line 3pt hole auger and mount a winch to the draw bar.

My question is, how cheap of a winch can I get away with? I'd like a winch with wireless remote so I can follow the log with a cant hook to maneuver it through obstacles.

I won't use the very end of the auger frame to lift the logs, most likely I'll mount a clevis to one of the available locations closer to the 3pt lift arms.

My tractor has iirc about 500 lbs of suitcase weights on the front, making the tractor weigh about 5500-6000 lbs. I plan to buy a ~9000-10000 lb winch.

I won't have a blade to push in the ground to stabilize the tractor when pulling the logs. The logs I will be dealing with will vary from ~16" to 22" at the butt end and 25ft long. Green, that size Scots pine should be around ~2500 lbs.

I intend to use the tractor battery to run the winch, so the tractor will be running with parking brakes applied when I'm skidding.

Has anyone done something similar? Thoughts? Would Synthetic rope be better/worse than wore rope? I'd like a winch with the guide rollers, those seem to only come on winches with wire rope.

Just look around and get a big ole pto winch off an oilfield truck or whatever. You could have it on your tractor in one evening. We just put a winch on my brothers tractor two weeks ago. We have a situation like yours. We have a skidder, but tractor is best. Cut your lengths before you skid them, lot easier. Pick up a big snatch block and hang on top of it to run cable through. One of them big winches will last half a dozen lifetimes on a tractor. They are around, just look for one.

 

[ETD66SS]

So I'm looking for something like this?

pto winch - heavy equipment - by owner - sale

pto driven winch complete heavy duty

meadville.craigslist.org

Looks like it runs off a chain drive from the tractor pto.

 

[Sawyer Rob]

I have one of them, most were run off a pto shaft from the transfer case of a truck, many were converted, and ran by a hydraulic motor...

They are sloooow, using one is about like watching paint dry... lol

SR

 

[John_Mc]

Don't bother with an electric winch on your tractor for skidding logs. It might work for getting yourelf unstuck, but there are a number of problems:

1. Duty Cycle: many electric winches have only a 5 or 10% duty cycle. This means you might run it for 90 seconds at full load, then need to let it cool for 13.5 minutes (10 % duty cycle). When you consider that under full load, it's probably only moving 6 or 7 FPM, that's a lot of sitting and wait to accomplish a 50' pull.
2. Amp Draw: a 9000# winch draw in excess of 300 Amps at full load. Many compact tractors have a 40 or 50 Amp alternator (and they'll only get that rating at high RPMs). You are likely to ruin your battery under such abuse. Evan at half rated load, they are likely pulling 200+ Amps.
3. Limited cable length (50' max is typical)
4. They are SLOOOOOW

If I were in your shoes, and just could not swing a 3 Pt Hitch logging winch, I'd be looking at a Portable Capstan Winch, like the PCW5000. 100% duty cycle, no strain on the tractor's electrical system, length of pull is limited nly by the length of rope yo have available, pulls at 40 FPM (stil slow compared to a logging winch, but it beats the electric winches. As an added bonus, You still may fins you have a use for it even after you eventually get a 3 Pt Hitch logging winch

 

[WranglerX]

Don't bother with an electric winch on your tractor for skidding logs. It might work for getting yourelf unstuck, but there are a number of problems:

1. Duty Cycle: many electric winches have only a 5 or 10% duty cycle. This means you might run it for 90 seconds at full load, then need to let it cool for 13.5 minutes (10 % duty cycle). When you consider that under full load, it's probably only moving 6 or 7 FPM, that's a lot of sitting and wait to accomplish a 50' pull.
2. Amp Draw: a 9000# winch draw in excess of 300 Amps at full load. Many compact tractors have a 40 or 50 Amp alternator (and they'll only get that rating at high RPMs). You are likely to ruin your battery under such abuse. Evan at half rated load, they are likely pulling 200+ Amps.
3. Limited cable length (50' max is typical)
4. They are SLOOOOOW

If I were in your shoes, and just could not swing a 3 Pt Hitch logging winch, I'd be looking at a Portable Capstan Winch, like the PCW5000. 100% duty cycle, no strain on the tractor's electrical system, length of pull is limited nly by the length of rope yo have available, pulls at 40 FPM (stil slow compared to a logging winch, but it beats the electric winches. As an added bonus, You still may fins you have a use for it even after you eventually get a 3 Pt Hitch logging winch

My 10,000# winch on my Jeep has 96 feet of useable length (last 5 coils stays on drum)... 100 ft (+/-) is typical on large winches...

 

[dieselscout80]

Looking to log some Scots Pine to use as sawn non-structural lumber for my house build. Need a quick and dirty log winch setup, can't afford a ~$8000 log skidding winch right now.

I'm looking to use the frame from my cheap County Line 3pt hole auger and mount a winch to the draw bar.

My question is, how cheap of a winch can I get away with? I'd like a winch with wireless remote so I can follow the log with a cant hook to maneuver it through obstacles.

I won't use the very end of the auger frame to lift the logs, most likely I'll mount a clevis to one of the available locations closer to the 3pt lift arms.

My tractor has iirc about 500 lbs of suitcase weights on the front, making the tractor weigh about 5500-6000 lbs. I plan to buy a ~9000-10000 lb winch.

I won't have a blade to push in the ground to stabilize the tractor when pulling the logs. The logs I will be dealing with will vary from ~16" to 22" at the butt end and 25ft long. Green, that size Scots pine should be around ~2500 lbs.

I intend to use the tractor battery to run the winch, so the tractor will be running with parking brakes applied when I'm skidding.

Has anyone done something similar? Thoughts? Would Synthetic rope be better/worse than wore rope? I'd like a winch with the guide rollers, those seem to only come on winches with wire rope.

I wonder if you could use the post digger arch as the toplink for a box blade to help keep the tractor from sliding back when winching and still allow you to pickup the log when you are dragging it with your tractor.

 

[Mudfarmer]

I've used a setup like you describe on my tree farm for ten years; I've never had enough yarding to do to justify a Farmi. My boom is a little different with a cross bar at the base where I could bolt on a two inch receiver, but it works just like you anticipate. I would suggest a cheap Harbor Freight winch with steel cable (the winch comes with cable - a real cost saver). Also at harbor freight you can get cheap 2 inch receivers and a cheap 2 inch receiver cradle mount for the winch. Figure our how to attach a two inch receiver to your tow bar in pic number one. You're almost set. You'll need a snatch block for the end of the crane and a couple more to hang on trees to get logs around corners while you're yarding them in. Just be aware that using that set up is hard on your battery.

 

[Mudfarmer]

If you're worried about slipping backward, here's another solution I've used. Also cheap. Cheap logging winch

 

[ETD66SS]

I've used a setup like you describe on my tree farm for ten years; I've never had enough yarding to do to justify a Farmi. My boom is a little different with a cross bar at the base where I could bolt on a two inch receiver, but it works just like you anticipate. I would suggest a cheap Harbor Freight winch with steel cable (the winch comes with cable - a real cost saver). Also at harbor freight you can get cheap 2 inch receivers and a cheap 2 inch receiver cradle mount for the winch. Figure our how to attach a two inch receiver to your tow bar in pic number one. You're almost set. You'll need a snatch block for the end of the crane and a couple more to hang on trees to get logs around corners while you're yarding them in. Just be aware that using that set up is hard on your battery.

I have growing concerns about the tractor alternator & battery like others have described. So not ready to spend the ~$300 on a Harbor Freight winch just yet. I'm looking into possibly using an old truck alternator connected to the PTO on my tractor hooked to a separate 4D battery to power the winch. Just not sure I can fit all that equipment in the space I have on top of my drawbar. I'd need a gearbox to up the PTO RPM to something that gets close to max amp output of the alternator, I have a couple spares from a Ford 914 mower deck.

As usual, it's just turning into a much larger (time intensive) project.