Bobcat vs. Kioti Maintenance

[beeser]

I don't have a Kioti Operation and Maintenance Manual but apparently there are substantial differences in the maintenance intervals between Kioti and Bobcat compact tractors. According to someone on YouTube the following items are addressed at 50 hrs of operation.

Replace Engine Oil and Filter
Replace Fuel Filter
Replace Hydrostatic Filter
Replace Hydraulic Fluid Filter
Note: He is not changing the hydraulic fluid.

In contrast to that my Bobcat manual calls for only the hydrostatic/hydraulic filters and fluid to be replaced. The fuel filter doesn't get replaced until 200 hrs and the engine oil and filter doesn't get replaced until 400 hrs. I thought the engines for these two brand tractors were the same. Why the substantial differences in maintenance intervals?

 

[RjCorazza]

I guess the real difference is an engineering team's opinion, with likely input from the bean counters.
The hydraulic fluid replacement at 50h varies by manufacturer, and even flips back and forth from the same manufacturer.

My last 2 Kubota machines specified the hydraulic fluid to be replaced at 400h. The first one I changed at 50h, and the second I followed the MFG interval of 400h. I suspect it's about a 50/50 split on what operators actually do, but you are not asking that.

Drifting further off topic, I personally would be concerned with leaving the engine oil in there past the first 50h.

 

[beeser]

Recall at one time manufacturers requiring the oil shipped with their engines to remain for a period of time for break-in purposes. Maybe this is what Bobcat has in mind with their recommendations. It still doesn't explain the differences between Bobcat and Kioti since its supposedly the same engine.

 

[beeser]

Here is a link to another YouTube video showing a Kioti CK3510 50 hr service.

Here is a link showing the Bobcat Maintenance Schedule for their compact tractors.
Maintenance Schedules - Bobcat Company

Again, the differences are puzzling considering the engines are supposedly the same.

 

[MechanicalGuy]

The hydraulic fluid isn’t subjected to a combustion process and rarely even gets hot, 50 hr. Fluid change is merely a way to promote their service department.

 

[MESSMAKER]

The hydraulic fluid isn’t subjected to a combustion process and rarely even gets hot, 50 hr. Fluid change is merely a way to promote their service department.

The hydraulic service cost a good bit of $$.

 

[Quickster2]

Changing new fluids after a reasonable amount of "break in" is a tried and true method. Personally, this is what I do because I want to see how everything is working. I almost always do it myself anyway.

 

[beeser]

Adding to the confusion, Bobcat's 50 hr maintenance kit shows replacement of the oil filter and again at 100 hrs and 200 hrs. The manual doesn't show it being replaced until 400 hrs.

 

[MechanicalGuy]

Changing new fluids after a reasonable amount of "break in" is a tried and true method. Personally, this is what I do because I want to see how everything is working. I almost always do it myself anyway.

On an engine where there are hundreds and of moving parts this is tried and true, on a hydraulic system where you have very few moving parts by comparison, and no break in lube to expunge from the system, and all the pump parts are completely submerged in hydraulic fluid continuously, this is a waste of time and money imo. It’s not done on ANY of the industrial equipment that I’ve maintained in my 20+ years as a mechanical tech or mechanical engineer.

we don’t even change the fluid after a pump grenades from over ten years of continuous use! Filters regularly, fluid rarely-as far as hydraulic systems are concerned.

Adding to the confusion, Bobcat's 50 hr maintenance kit shows replacement of the oil filter and again at 100 hrs and 200 hrs. The manual doesn't show it being replaced until 400 hrs.

Departments be separated from each other, they gotta get their story straight!

 

[Username Taken]

Changing new fluids after a reasonable amount of "break in" is a tried and true method. Personally, this is what I do because I want to see how everything is working. I almost always do it myself anyway.

When it comes to engines, I like to get the oil out of there sooner rather than later.

God only knows what is inside that engine block. Micro metal shavings, sand from the casting furnace (ask Navistar about that)..... Who knows? And what oil are they using? Fast Eddie's Good Stuff Oil who happened to win the bid because he submitted the lowest price?

Use a good oil, too. Synthetic really isn't that much more expensive. And there's not much difference when it comes to brands. Shell, Mobil, Valvoline are all good. So are many of the Store Brands. Amsoil is good if you're into that thing. I am not. But if you are, good on you.

My 2 cents and worth every penny

 

[ruffdog]

Adding to the confusion, Bobcat's 50 hr maintenance kit shows replacement of the oil filter and again at 100 hrs and 200 hrs. The manual doesn't show it being replaced until 400 hrs.

I would follow the manual, not the label on the "kits".

 

[beeser]

Following is the question raised with Bobcat and their response if you call it one.

The Operations and Maintenance Manual is not consistent with your Maintenance Service Kits. The Manual doesn't show the oil and filter to be replaced until 400 hrs yet the Service Kits are at 50 hrs, 100 hrs, 200 hrs, 400 hrs, etc. Which is correct?

We apologize but we don't offer technical assistance to end users, you will need to reach out to your local dealer for any technical issues. I have added the link below to find your closest dealer.

 

[murphy1244]

I changed my fuel filter and hydraulic oil at 200 hours.

50 hrs I changed engine oil and filter
Hydraulic filter
HST filter

 

[ruffdog]

Following is the question raised with Bobcat and their response if you call it one.

The Operations and Maintenance Manual is not consistent with your Maintenance Service Kits. The Manual doesn't show the oil and filter to be replaced until 400 hrs yet the Service Kits are at 50 hrs, 100 hrs, 200 hrs, 400 hrs, etc. Which is correct?

We apologize but we don't offer technical assistance to end users, you will need to reach out to your local dealer for any technical issues. I have added the link below to find your closest dealer.

So, are you going to call the dealer?

 

[beeser]

So, are you going to call the dealer?

Nope

 

[LS Tractor Owner]

So, LS has the motor oil / filter , hydraulic and HST filters only, at 50 hrs, then every 200 hrs thereafter for the motor oil. The first hydraulic OIL change is at 250 hours. Air and fuel filters also done at 250 hrs. I have the dual air filter on mine, so I blow out / clean the outer air filter about every 20-25 hours, replaced it at 100 hours. The inner air filter just gets a quick check / cleaning.

Call me stupid or paranoid, but I change the motor oil and filter religiously every 100 hrs wether it needs to be or not.... I also run synthetic oil.... peace of mind, I guess.

Fuel filter is still original with 238 hours.... it will get changed at 250.

Do I think it's a good idea to get the build / manufacturers fluid out of there? YES !

 

[rademamj1]

Adding to the confusion, Bobcat's 50 hr maintenance kit shows replacement of the oil filter and again at 100 hrs and 200 hrs. The manual doesn't show it being replaced until 400 hrs.

That is now same as Kioti for engine oil change. 50 hrs, 100hrs, 200hrs, 300hrs, etc.
I suspect the Bobcat manual has printing errors. Recommend following Kioti or Kubota maintenance intervals. It's worked well for decades of tractor ownership.

 

[Quickster2]

On an engine where there are hundreds and of moving parts this is tried and true, on a hydraulic system where you have very few moving parts by comparison, and no break in lube to expunge from the system, and all the pump parts are completely submerged in hydraulic fluid continuously, this is a waste of time and money imo. It’s not done on ANY of the industrial equipment that I’ve maintained in my 20+ years as a mechanical tech or mechanical engineer.

we don’t even change the fluid after a pump grenades from over ten years of continuous use! Filters regularly, fluid rarely-as far as hydraulic systems are concerned.

Departments be separated from each other, they gotta get their story straight!

I agree. I just shared what I do. I should of added that after the initial maintenance I extend the hydraulic change interval significantly for the reasons you mentioned.

 

[lacritz]

removing the hydrylic filter on my Kioti CK25CK had to drive a screw driver nto the filter to get it off, all the fluid leaks out! The fromt grille on mine does NOT come forward to raise the hood. The 5 AMP fuse to the starter relay comes loose while running and the engine shuts down, Many of the screws in the hood fall out or or are loose, this is only at 200 hours! No stay away from KIOTI.

 

[rademamj1]

removing the hydrylic filter on my Kioti CK25CK had to drive a screw driver nto the filter to get it off, all the fluid leaks out! The fromt grille on mine does NOT come forward to raise the hood. The 5 AMP fuse to the starter relay comes loose while running and the engine shuts down, Many of the screws in the hood fall out or or are loose, this is only at 200 hours! No stay away from KIOTI.

Using a screw driver to remove any filter is a desperate action, and should be avoided at all cost. The factory Hydraulic filter is painted on, and requires considerable effort to remove. After that first filter change, everything should go more smoothly. But never heard of a screwdriver being utilized for Hydraulic filter removal. The front grill guard rotates forward after the pins are retracted, allowing you to raise the engine cover/hood for engine service.

I checked my hood, and their are no "screws" on the Kioti Hood, except for those located at the hinge positions. Are those you are referring to? Specifically which model is the CK25CK that you own, is this an older CK25 or the newer model CK2510?