TruFuel 50-1or Stihl 50-1 or Red Armor 50-1??

[mx842]

I use the Stihl oil, and run 100 Sunoco leaded race fuel. Since I only burn less than 10 gallons in the 2 stroke stuff it’s good life insurance for the saws. What got me started on it is an MS440 that I ported and runs about 200 psi compression. Turned out to be a great wood cutter and I started using the 110 in the rest of the 2 strokes and they are really happy with it. I mean if you are going to go out of your way + spend extra $$ why not?

I'll agree when you start porting and working on squish clearance and velocity it's time to jump up to VP 110 at least and with tighter squish clearance you'll need to bump it up more. VP has changed the numbers on their fuel since we stopped MX racing but I think we ran what is now x85L. that was $75.00 for a 5 gal can now it's well over $100 probably closer to $125.00.
All of my saws were older like the 051, 044, 031 and they all ran just fine on pump gas. I had the 051 for 20 years or more and the 044 was flirting with 30 and boy how much wood they both cut. Some days on a log pile I would go through 5 gal or more. All they ever ate was pump gas and Stihl oil. I still had the 044 and the 031 and both were running good until they got burned up in the shop fire I had. I found out, now this is what I have seen in the shop that the oil used was more of an issue that the gas itself. The main reason for jobs being in my shop were fuel related. I got to the point that I started asking where they were buying their fuel and what oil they were using. When asked, the ones that said they get it anywhere they can find at the time and that they used penns oil,wally world oil or some other brand were the ones that 90% of the time had problems. Penns oil says right on the can that it is good for boat motors, moto cycles,chain saws or about anything you wanted to put it in. That's bunk because oils formulated for air cooled engines is completely different than oils that are made for water cooled engines. This is what I have found in my own little world over the years.
I do see what some are saying about the ethonol fuel it did play havic with the older 2 stroke boat engines before they found out how to make the rubber parts that that were in them.

That's what botheres me about going out to replace my saws now because of the way they are making them now. I have to do that soon because I have a lot of wood to cut before summer gets here.

 

[dodge man]

Just my opinion but I suspect it’s true but the premade 2 stroke fuel is nothing special. It’s a higher octane ethanol free fuel with 2 stroke oil. I suspects it’s a quality product but no better than if you can get your hands on ethanol free gas. It’s kind of like buying bottled water, you are really paying for the convenience.

 

[M59]

What is the best and experience? I got a gallon of Red Armor. We have e-gas here and it's terrible. Not cheap but is it worth it???

No experience with any of the pre-mixed 2 stroke fuels. I can't justify spending crazy money for stuff I mix myself from 87 octane that contains alcohol and Echo 2 cycle oil.

I had a MS290 chainsaw powerhead fail ( seized ) after 20-30 hours run time and Stihl warranteed and immediately gave me a new powerhead after verifying I used Echo 2 cycle oil in the 50:1 mix. Stihl determined the powerhead was running lean due to air leak created during original assembly.

 

[mike5511]

20 years ago I switched to Opti 2 oil. I have not worked on a single 2 stroke engine since. I even ran 87 E10 with no problems. After experiencing issues with the 87 E10 in some of my older 4 stroke engines I switched to 91 octane but still have no luck finding it in E0. I have had good results with it and my 4 stroke engines run fine. The Opti 2 oil has a stabilizer in it that works as good as anything I've found elsewhere.

I had a small engine repair shop tell me about 30 years ago if I used Opti 2 I would never have any problems. I just replaced a McCullough weed eater and a McCullough leaf blower that were both about 30 years old. Never did nothing to them, started every spring after sitting all winter.....and I never drained the carbs. Hard for me to use any other oil with that kind of experience. ( I did have to replace the fuel lines and primer bulbs, maybe a spark plug once. I never use corn gas.)

 

[andymil]

FYI, I recently discovered through the magic of the inter web, that ethanol will leach resins out of fiberglass tanks, especially older tanks. Many boats have fiberglass tanks and I can attest to a brown goo coming out of the tank on my Rickman CR manufactured in 1974 (pictured in avatar). This has caused me many headaches. Now I know the cause.

As for my small equipment, mostly Stihl, I’ve been using premium E10 with K100 fuel treatment to mix with my Stihl Ultra. No problems so far. I keep hearing good things about the RedArmor, but haven’t felt the need to try it yet.

 

[bgr]

What is the best and experience? I got a gallon of Red Armor. We have e-gas here and it's terrible. Not cheap but is it worth it???

I have used Red Armor for Stihl, Echo, and Shindaiwa equipment with ethanol 10% gas for 10 years now. The Stihl premium synthetic is good too. With Red Armor in the tank, I can start a saw that has not run in a year in 3 pulls. I have not had to clean a carb in 9 years. I can't recommend it highly enough. Though I believe that any premium synthetic mix with fuel stabilizer will do as well. Red Armor is the most reasonably priced in my area. I prefer the mix bottles for 1 gallon gas as it can start to age when opened. You would have to use all in a year to be good. Red Armor and Stihl premium will work with ethanol gas for me, so I don't have to find a special fuel.

To start a saw which has stood for a year with red Armor in the tank, pour the old fuel in the tank back into your container of fresh mix(1 gallon or more), shake container to mix and pour into tank on saw, push primer to get all fresh fuel into carb and start. If any problem, wait half an hour to dissolve any old fuel deposits and try again. I have even started customer's saws with junk 2 cycle mix in them. Pour out old . Put in new Red Armor and prime into carb. If it does not start in a few tries , wait 24 hours to dissolve old deposits and try again.

I have several 2 cycle trimmers, pole saws, etc. which only get used every 4 months or so. With Red Armor or equivalent, they will start right up. What a time saver. It runs in any 2 cycle no matter what mix ratio is called for.
I have not had a 2 cycle seize a piston using it. it is a big time saver.

 

[ericm979]

Phase separation depends on the water content of the fuel and the temperature:

Temp here is degrees C.

If you keep water out of your fuel, which is a good idea anyhow, then it's got to get really cold to get phase separation. Phase separation is not something I have seen but it's rare to get into the 20s (degrees F) here. Using sealed fuel jugs helps keep water laden air out.


I used to run 50/50 unleaded race gas and pump premium in my off road motorcycles. The race gas is nice because it stays good in storage and is consistent. But it's way too expensive for me to run in chainsaws and they do not need the high octane. The fancy premixed fuel is also too expensive, and I don't know what oil is in it. 91 octane E10 works fine for me and lets me run my preferred oil.

 

[hiddentacocatneddih]

I wish they would switch to methanol at the pump or e100

Then give me all the compression, boost and HP!

I would venture to say water in gas isn't near the problem as pot metal in modern junk.

1985 honda 4 wheeler, original carb. Has sat with old gas with ethanol 10 years. Cleaned up and no problem.

Modern chinese carb. Sits 6 months and corrodes to pieces.

 

[shooterdon]

After reading more comments my issues may have been caused by using old gas/oil mix. I have 2 gallon containers and mix 2 gallons at a time to save the hassle of mixing often. I have one container for the equipment in the pole barn and another for the equipment in the garage. If I am not using the saw, the blower and trimmer do not use a lot of fuel.

I assumed that using non-ethanol fuel and Sta-bil would address the storage issue. I have 5 gallon jugs that may sit for months before getting used. I use non-ethanol in the Mule, ZT, saws, blower and trimmer. Typically stored for 4-6 months at a time.

Yesterday when TruFuel "solved" my problem I was very encouraged. It may have "solved" a problem I created.

 

[4Liberty]

I'll agree when you start porting and working on squish clearance and velocity it's time to jump up to VP 110 at least and with tighter squish clearance you'll need to bump it up more. VP has changed the numbers on their fuel since we stopped MX racing but I think we ran what is now x85L. that was $75.00 for a 5 gal can now it's well over $100 probably closer to $125.00.
All of my saws were older like the 051, 044, 031 and they all ran just fine on pump gas. I had the 051 for 20 years or more and the 044 was flirting with 30 and boy how much wood they both cut. Some days on a log pile I would go through 5 gal or more. All they ever ate was pump gas and Stihl oil. I still had the 044 and the 031 and both were running good until they got burned up in the shop fire I had. I found out, now this is what I have seen in the shop that the oil used was more of an issue that the gas itself. The main reason for jobs being in my shop were fuel related. I got to the point that I started asking where they were buying their fuel and what oil they were using. When asked, the ones that said they get it anywhere they can find at the time and that they used penns oil,wally world oil or some other brand were the ones that 90% of the time had problems. Penns oil says right on the can that it is good for boat motors, moto cycles,chain saws or about anything you wanted to put it in. That's bunk because oils formulated for air cooled engines is completely different than oils that are made for water cooled engines. This is what I have found in my own little world over the years.
I do see what some are saying about the ethonol fuel it did play havic with the older 2 stroke boat engines before they found out how to make the rubber parts that that were in them.

That's what botheres me about going out to replace my saws now because of the way they are making them now. I have to do that soon because I have a lot of wood to cut before summer gets here.

Only thing I ever had problems with on 93 pump gas was the fuel line on a really old 028 that someone gave me. Who knows what oil they used in it, I think you are onto something with the oil used I never had a problem with ethanol fuels in anything. I normally cut/burn about 25 Tons a year.

 

[stevem5215]

I use the Stihl Ultra Synthetic oil with Stabilizer in my 80' Skidoo Blizzard 7500+ along with my Toro Suzuki 2 stroke lawn mower (1987 purchase) and my Cub Cadet EFCO 57cc 20" chainsaw. None obviously are used a ton but that combination of fuel (always use the Premium gas. Ethanol based always) with that oil has been good for the whole time Stihl has been selling that product. I'd say around 12 years or so. In all of my other 2 cycle small engines I've switched to using TruFuel in 40-1 or 50-1 depending on the product need. Including my small Ryobi chainsaw for limbing work as it's lighter and handy. All the products I use the TruFuel in have worked well and I've had no carb failures since. The last problem child I had was a Craftsman chainsaw that the lines rotted on since it was at least 20 years old when I bought it and the engine scored badly and was done. (rebuild more than the Roybi replacement cost at $79 for a refurb from DirectTools.com) The engineered fuel from TruFuel is a great product for small carb passages which are easily plugged up. I too have a MrFunnel for the water in fuel but with Trufuel you can eliminate that step as it's always fresh in small batches as I use it enough to replace the cans every few months as I use it up. It's a good product. Try it. Your fuel lines will thank you.

 

[two_bit_score]

What is the best and experience? I got a gallon of Red Armor. We have e-gas here and it's terrible. Not cheap but is it worth it???

I use TruFuel and Stihl MotoMix 50:1 interchangeably on everything. Saws, trimmers, blower, everything. Starts easier and have had no problems since I started using it. The KM131 powerhead and the 261C have never been ran on anything except the TruFuel or MotoMix since bought. you won’t need to purchase additional stabilizer, treatment or oil. Just pour it in, crank up and go. To me, it’s worth the cost.

As for Non E fuel I have easy access to it in Central Texas as well as East Texas and I use it in mowers only. Occasionally I’ll top off my truck with a few gallons of Non E if I’m filling a few cans for the mowers but not that often.

 

[5030]

Only the BLUE marine stabil works. Having really good results with the 50-1 Trufuel in my saws btw. Home Depot sells it in gallons and 2.5 gallon cans. Lowes has it in gallons too. Farm and Fleet has the Red Armor and the Trufuel bit only in quarts. Less in gallons price wise.

-4 here this am...lol.

I will say my 43 year old 028 runs much better on the Tru-Fuel than the 10% e-gas with Marine Stabil and Stihl pre mix oil in it. It actually idles now.

 

[BX23S-1]

Old thread, but worth adding my 2 cents.
I strictly run VP 50:1 when i can`t find Echo Red Armor locally.
My saws love the stuff, and i`ve NEVER had any carbon issues with Red Armor 50:1, or VP 50:1.

You can get VP 50:1 (94 octane) right at tractor supply (at least ours carry's it)
You can get Red Armor 50:1 (93 octane) at most any Home Depot

I`ve tried mixing my own (non-ethanol) for years, the canned fuel is far better.
You`d have to buy your non-e gas from a dedicated pump to get a better non-e gasoline that is TRULY non-ethanol.

When you buy your non-e gas from a multi selection pump at the local gas station`s, that pump is going to give you some e gas in it until the hose and filter is cleared, and THEN, you`ll get your non-e gas coming out of the ground tanks. I`ve noticed many times buying non-e at the pump, my saws ran like sh*t, because there was some E gas mixed in it. If you don`t use a chainsaw much, stay away from the gas stations and just buy some VP or Red Armor for your occasional use.

VP & Red Armor:
Unopened - 5yr shelf life
Opened - 2 yrs shelf life

 

[BX23S-1]

And stay away from Stihl`s ULTRA 2-stroke oil. Its GARBAGE!

 

[hiddentacocatneddih]

I'd take that e100.

 

[BX23S-1]

I'd take that e100.

e100 ???
What are you talking about (?)

 

[ultrarunner]

And stay away from Stihl`s ULTRA 2-stroke oil. Its GARBAGE!

What’s the downside outside of cost?

 

[hiddentacocatneddih]

e100 ???
What are you talking about (?)

All the alcohols. Then we can turn up the compression. Boost and power !

 

[BX23S-1]

What’s the downside outside of cost?

Serious carbon build up. Look around some of the pro arborist and chainsaw forums. There is TONS of information with why the oil is so bad. I noticed how carboned up my saws were getting. Then i started looking around some other forums for some answers, and there were many others out there that had issues with it, too. Many have said the cheaper Stihl oil was better than the ULTRA-HP. Some of the forums had the data sheets posted where what oil was rated and what ones weren't. Stihl ULTRA-HP is NOT "JASO FD" rated from what i`ve found out. Ever since i started using the Red Armor 2-stroke oil, i am no longer having carbon problems at all. (Red Armor also has fuel additives in their 2-stroke oil that keeps your gas fresh, ULTRA-HP does not) That alone convinced me that people knew what they were talking about, and why they won`t use the ULTRA-HP at all.

This was one of Stihl`s claims. Its right on their website!

https://www.stihlusa.com/products/oils-lubricants-fuels/oils-and-lubricants/oilhpultra/#reviews

"This fully synthetic oil is also highly biodegradable, degrading by 80% in 21 days."

I would post the forum links in here for you, but the ADMINS & MODS will likely frown on it.