120v MIG weld on a 3/8" thick (bevel 60deg)

[radioman]

thanks MinnesotaDaveChalmers and mudstopper. This is exactly what I thought.

 

[Arc weld]

I'm not a pipe welder, but likely because of a knife edge root prep.
Notice he only said he did the root that way - root pass uses less amps.
(Arc weld, feel free to correct me if I guessed wrong)

Tig roots are commonly done in the 80-90 amp range with a knife edge.
But as the passes get farther from the root, the amperage keeps getting increased.
I know on plate steel, I get up to 150-170 amps at times - but much less in an open root.

This is one of the limiting factors on heavy iron with a small mig - the farther from the root you get, the more mass there is under the arc.

I'm not saying successful open root 3/8" welds are impossible with underpowered machines - but I would definitely not advise them based on the methods I use that I know work. Plus, t joints and lap joints would require even more amps.

Yes it's a knife edge with a 5/32"-1/4" gap depending. On the real thick stuff, you have to use a big propane torch for preheat. The root is a very small weld. After the root pass, you run a hot 3/16" 7018 to give enough fill so the sub-arc won't burn through.

 

[MinnesotaDaveChalmers]

Yes it's a knife edge with a 5/32"-1/4" gap depending. On the real thick stuff, you have to use a big propane torch for preheat. The root is a very small weld. After the root pass, you run a hot 3/16" 7018 to give enough fill so the sub-arc won't burn through.

I had a feeling you were gonna break out the big guns after the root

 

[Sodo]

I just went out and tacked up the plates 27.5ｰ (for a 55ｰ included angle) bevel on each plate IRRC. 1/4" root gap I will weld them up in the am. I will weld them 3g uphill to give them the best chance of success. Just tacking these up taxed the welder so this is going to be a slow process.

Thx for the details! I welded mine (3 tests) level with 60deg groove (bout the same), but root gaps zero, 1/16" and 3/32".

What does 3g mean?

Understand "slow process" but its relative; nobody (?) will do this in a commercial setting. If it takes 3 minutes longer that's nothing.

 

[roadhunter]

Good to hear, you and I look at it about the same. New Rule#1: steps taken that nobody is maimed by poorly welded test-plates!

Can't be me doing all the work and posting all the pics. Shield's out, now Dangit looks like Mark's out too. Need someone with formal training to jump in.

What about Fifelaker? You have a little MIG, can you ask your instructor what to do,,, if you had to weld 3/8" thick steel from one side without preheating? And then SHOW IT on TBN?

I'll try to do a little test with a few machines this weekend. I can compare what the Miller maxstar 150 will do compared to a Everlast 200 when both are hooked to 110v power. I'll also throw in my Hobart 125 handler and hook a wire feeder up to the Everlast 200 and compare whey they can both do hooked to 110v power as well.


Thanks for posting the pics and bend of your welds. Funny how some folks enjoy telling you what a failure you are because of the bend test. dont' sweat that crap. Seem like they are picking up right where Shield left off. Like I said before most welds you see wont' pass a bend test and dont' have full penetration so most welds and welders are failures in their book. I bet that in the end when this is all over we all have a much better idea of what 110v welders can do as well as learning tricks and techniques to maximize our 110v welder capabilities.

I learned on a Lincoln sp135 building railings for boat docks down on lake Texoma. Never had any problem even though I only used a 110v welder. There a plenty of uses for 110v welders.

 

[BlacknTan]

Use the PROPER tool for the job at hand. This is the reason they make different tools ... for different applications!

If one has 240 at hand, why use 120V? It makes no sense. If I cannot do a job PROPERLY myself, I'll give it to someone who can.

Bring back Shield Arc ... He may have been rough around the edges, but he obviously knew what he was talking about.

 

[Sodo]

Like I said before most welds you see wont' pass a bend test and dont' have full penetration so most welds and welders are failures in their book.

And nobody posts them.

Shield was about the only (?) belligerent member who ALSO posted pics (in that it was a loss). When he was sharing knowledge and not doing a shoutdown, it was useful. Some others enjoyed tagging along, now they have to strike out on their own. I've seen a lot of posts by internet weld inspectors. They can't see the application, don't understand structure, and wouldn't know the first thing about serviceability, no harm no foul, some are even funny.

Test plates are more useful than I thought. They get down to the nitty gritty. But you must have "spare time" to do them. Also time to sift thru posts for the members who actually know what they are typing.

If one has 240 at hand, why use 120V? It makes no sense. If I cannot do a job PROPERLY myself, I'll give it to someone who can.

It makes no sense I'll give ya that! Might let the thread work this out you may learn something (but nothing from me of course ).

 

[roadhunter]

Use the PROPER tool for the job at hand. This is the reason they make different tools ... for different applications!

If one has 240 at hand, why use 120V? It makes no sense. If I cannot do a job PROPERLY myself, I'll give it to someone who can.

Bring back Shield Arc ... He may have been rough around the edges, but he obviously knew what he was talking about.

With all due respect if you can't see the benefit of using a 110v welder please dont post in this thread. We dont need more arguing on this subject. We have already beaten that dead horse enough. This thread is about welding with 110v welders so please don't derail the thread with stuff like this.

 

[Fifelaker]

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=389046&stc=1&d=1409843927

 

[muddstopper]

road runner, nobody has ever said that there are not uses for a 110v welder. Mostly what everyone is saying is that 110v mig welders do have limitations.
As for the bend test failures, it stands to reason that if the welds cant pass the bend test, then its probably not in anyone best interest to say the welds are good enough. Stop and think about it, those weld coupons where most like made on a bench, laid flat. The easeist welding position to make a weld. Yet those welds where not strong enough to pass a bend test. I dont know about you, but when my equipment breaks, it usually isnt the flat, top part of the metal that is broken. I have to weldup the sides and sometimes underneath, and all sort of angles. Now if you cant get a weld with decent penetration welding a flat bead on top of a piece of metal, most likely, the weld is going to get even worse if done under out of position welding. Its not about 110v welders not having a use, its about using a small welder outside safe working perimeters. The same principal applies if I was to take my 220v welder to a ship yard to weld together ship hulls. Could I take my 220v machine and weld a ship together, most certainly, would my welds hold under the stress, very doubtful. Thats the whole rub with this thread, Sodo wants to convince everybody that using a machine with limited power, to weld material outside the safe and recommened perimeters of the equipment, is fine and dandy, when nobody with any real experience, nor any manufacturers of any of the small machines, nor will any certified welding instructor, would recommend or try and teach such a unsafe practice. Then to add insult to injury, Sodo isnt willing to admit he is wrong and that his insistance could be placing anyone willing to listen to him, into trying and doing something that could result in failure. Those failures, could result in personal injury or death to the enduser, and quite possibly to some other unaware bystander. If Sodo wants to continue endangering his well being and the well being of others, there isnt anything I can do about it. He certainly has already turned a deaf ear to any reasoning and wont be satisfied until everyone here agrees with his position. Those that know better wont ever agree with him. So the saga continues.