40x60x14 Shop

[bigtiller]

Are Dehumidifiers expensive to operate?

No experience with them around here but in Washington State to shop is always damp and it is a problem for the antique cars big time.

The 70 pint one I referenced in post 275 cost about $15 a month to run. I don't have any way to meter it's power usage so what I did was to add up the power used in the month of July for the past 5 years to get an average for that month, and compare that average to the current month of July. I did the same for August and September.

The fan on mine runs continuously to circulate the air but the compressor kicks in and out as needed. I had it set at 60% and that seamed to work out the best.

 

[ultrarunner]

Thank you... appreciate the info...

 

[JHurt]

Well I believe my builder is officially done with his part of the shop. Finally got the floor heat lines enclosed and painted up. Time for me to start dragging stuff in and placing it where I want it.

 

[Kyle_in_Tex]

View attachment 593773
Well I believe my builder is officially done with his part of the shop. Finally got the floor heat lines enclosed and painted up. Time for me to start dragging stuff in and placing it where I want it.

That's a nice heater setup. Don't want to back into that, or brush past it with the loader bucket.....

 

[JHurt]

That's a nice heater setup. Don't want to back into that, or brush past it with the loader bucket.....

Please don’t jinx me like that!

 

[JHurt]

Floor heat is having issues! Just my luck because it’s supposed to be super cold the next couple of days. It’s been running great for about a week, but all of the sudden has flow issues. Went from 2.8gpm to .4gpm. Cleaned the filter in the heater and it had a little bit of debris in it but not enough to cause that much construction. Pump doesn’t seem to be pumping like it was in my opinion. Builder thinks it’s a propane/regulator issue. We finally got it “tricked” into kicking on so it’s putting out heat and flowing but with only .7gpm. It’s not right for sure. It’s a closed system, with 22psi, hot water manifold says 115°, cold water manifold says 60°. Thoughts anyone?

 

[dstig1]

Probably air in the system. Try flushing/refilling & repressurizing. Air is the #1 reason for no flow. Do you have an air eliminator valve in your system?

The propane regulator has nothing to do with this. If it wasn't heating up, then look at that, but this is system flow which is only affected by the pump, a plugged filter and/or air in the system. I do recall you had a mixing valve also, which really is not needed. Not sure if that may be the issue as I am unfamiliar with their use.

When I flush, I do it from a large tub (I think it is a cattle water tub from fleet farm). I use the pump to recirculate through the system and back into the tub so you don't waste a crap ton of water. Also very important since I have a 50/50 antifreeze water mix in mine. Don't want to dump that on the ground everywhere...plus it costs money... I put some cheesecloth over the return line at the tub to filter out any debris and clamp it to the side of the tub so it doesn't go flying around.

I did previously warn you that you may lose flow after some time in use...I know I did.

 

[JHurt]

Probably air in the system. Try flushing/refilling & repressurizing. Air is the #1 reason for no flow. Do you have an air eliminator valve in your system?

The propane regulator has nothing to do with this. If it wasn't heating up, then look at that, but this is system flow which is only affected by the pump, a plugged filter and/or air in the system. I do recall you had a mixing valve also, which really is not needed. Not sure if that may be the issue as I am unfamiliar with their use.

When I flush, I do it from a large tub (I think it is a cattle water tub from fleet farm). I use the pump to recirculate through the system and back into the tub so you don't waste a crap ton of water. Also very important since I have a 50/50 antifreeze water mix in mine. Don't want to dump that on the ground everywhere...plus it costs money... I put some cheesecloth over the return line at the tub to filter out any debris and clamp it to the side of the tub so it doesn't go flying around.

I did previously warn you that you may lose flow after some time in use...I know I did.

I private messaged you about the issue. Feel free to disregard that since you have answered all my questions.
I do have an air eliminator in the system.
I’m unsure on the proper way to flush/refill and pressurize as the builder did it initially. I may have to phone a friend tomorrow and see if I can get it figured out. Thank you for your response.

 

[dstig1]

Didn't get notified about PM...apparently I had a setting turned off, hopefully fixed now.

I went back and looked over your photo from post #250, and your system looks pretty straightforward, other than the mixing valve, which I already noted. It looks like an air separator is right above the pressure tank. If it were me, I'd get rid of the mixing valve (the thing right above the pump). Other than that item (which would be needed if you had a boiler, but not for a tankless) it looks like everything is by the book, though it doesn't have a great location for fill ports. I also don't see a check valve after the pump, but those Grundfoss's often have them built-in. There is a nice valve kit that makes filling very easy: 58613 - Webstone 58613 - 3/4" Sweat Purge & Fill Ball Valve
You turn the handle and now it diverts the flow from the closed loop to the hose ports. So you feed in water on the hot side and purge it out on the cold (return) side and it ensures one-way flow. This allows you to get air out by purging through. But you don't have this...

Make sure you shut off/unplug your heater before you start any of this. You can't use the ports on the heater flush valves as those only work for flushing the heater. The only option I see is the hose fittings on the ends of the manifold. You would need to shut off the valves feeding those manifolds first (red & blue). Connect your pressure hose to the one on the lower manifold, and connect the return hose to the upper hose port. Purging should be done one zone at a time to be effective. To do this, you need to isolate each zone, one by one, and it gets tedious. Close both zone valves on ALL zones of the manifold (the white ones on the upper, and the flow valves on the lower) and leave one pair open (same zone, 1 in, 1 out). Flush that zone until it runs clear with no air for a few minutes. It may be best to leave off the return line filter fabric I mentioned above for this as it makes it hard to see air. When you are satisfied with that zone, close those valves and open the next pair. Always keep pressure on the system once you start. When you are all done, open up the manifold inlet valves, close the upper hose port, open all zone valves and pressurize to whatever your setting is (looks like 20-25 psi). You cannot avoid a tiny bit of air, but that is what the air separator valve is for.

Attached is a picture of filling/flushing my shop the first time. I had to use a pump and cart water in in buckets as i had no water source at the time. I was filling from the pump in the green bucket and dumping into the black tub, but eventually just put the pump in the black tub and recirculated it around that way. This system has a fill valve setup that is similar to the one I linked, but not as nice. Hard to see, but it is where the hoses are attached.

It's not hard to do, just tedious. If you have plain water, it is easier as you can use a hose from the well pump to do a lot of this. If you have antifreeze, you will need a pump with a hose fitting and really need to recirculate/capture the fluid.

Hope this helps.
-Dave

 

[JHurt]

Didn't get notified about PM...apparently I had a setting turned off, hopefully fixed now.

I went back and looked over your photo from post #250, and your system looks pretty straightforward, other than the mixing valve, which I already noted. It looks like an air separator is right above the pressure tank. If it were me, I'd get rid of the mixing valve (the thing right above the pump). Other than that item (which would be needed if you had a boiler, but not for a tankless) it looks like everything is by the book, though it doesn't have a great location for fill ports. I also don't see a check valve after the pump, but those Grundfoss's often have them built-in. There is a nice valve kit that makes filling very easy: 58613 - Webstone 58613 - 3/4" Sweat Purge & Fill Ball Valve
You turn the handle and now it diverts the flow from the closed loop to the hose ports. So you feed in water on the hot side and purge it out on the cold (return) side and it ensures one-way flow. This allows you to get air out by purging through. But you don't have this...

Make sure you shut off/unplug your heater before you start any of this. You can't use the ports on the heater flush valves as those only work for flushing the heater. The only option I see is the hose fittings on the ends of the manifold. You would need to shut off the valves feeding those manifolds first (red & blue). Connect your pressure hose to the one on the lower manifold, and connect the return hose to the upper hose port. Purging should be done one zone at a time to be effective. To do this, you need to isolate each zone, one by one, and it gets tedious. Close both zone valves on ALL zones of the manifold (the white ones on the upper, and the flow valves on the lower) and leave one pair open (same zone, 1 in, 1 out). Flush that zone until it runs clear with no air for a few minutes. It may be best to leave off the return line filter fabric I mentioned above for this as it makes it hard to see air. When you are satisfied with that zone, close those valves and open the next pair. Always keep pressure on the system once you start. When you are all done, open up the manifold inlet valves, close the upper hose port, open all zone valves and pressurize to whatever your setting is (looks like 20-25 psi). You cannot avoid a tiny bit of air, but that is what the air separator valve is for.

Attached is a picture of filling/flushing my shop the first time. I had to use a pump and cart water in in buckets as i had no water source at the time. I was filling from the pump in the green bucket and dumping into the black tub, but eventually just put the pump in the black tub and recirculated it around that way. This system has a fill valve setup that is similar to the one I linked, but not as nice. Hard to see, but it is where the hoses are attached.

It's not hard to do, just tedious. If you have plain water, it is easier as you can use a hose from the well pump to do a lot of this. If you have antifreeze, you will need a pump with a hose fitting and really need to recirculate/capture the fluid.

Hope this helps.
-Dave

View attachment 594250

I understand how to bleed I think, but I’m unsure on how to pressurize the system again. Btw, thank you so much for the help!