425 vs Kubota 7510 or 7520?

MossRoad · Aug 22, 2005

have at my disposal a Kubota B2910, a New Holland TC24D, a Ventrac 3000 and a Cub Cadet 1862... 
you guys are making me jealous! 

Bob, I have a late sixties Simplicity, my PT425 and a beat up old IH... YOU are making ME jealous! /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

marrt · Aug 22, 2005

If 80% of your tractor work involves using the front end loader and the mower, I don’t think the PT can be beat. As a loader, it will run circles around any std. tractor and will do it MUCH MUCH safer and with less turf damage. The mower is also much better than most tractor mowers because it’s out front where you can see what you’re doing and it’s rear discharge and doesn’t leave windrows as bad as a side discharge mower (and the turf damage is less due to the full time 4WD with articulated steering). And, as noted, the PHD works better as well.

Now, if you need to pull a plow, run a tiller for a large garden, run a box blade, etc…, a std. tractor is much better IMHO. Also, you can find cheaper implements for a std. tractor (used ones or cheap new ones from TSC) for occasional jobs. With the PT, most of their implements are very heavy duty and very expensive, like skid steer attachments ($1600 for forks and $1600 for PHD head for the 1430). You can’t just buy a cheap attachment at TSC that you will only use a few times.

Now all that said, I think PT’s in general have gotten much too expensive. I love my 1845 but there’s no way I would pay $28K for a new one with mower and 4 in 1 bucket. No way Jose. And even the 425 is expense now, considering it’s not a diesel. I absolutely love my PT but I would look very hard at a Kubota IF I were buying NEW today. Even though the PT will do more of what I need, and will do it faster and safer…for home owner use, I wouldn’t be able to justify the price difference when you also consider the warranty, local repair, and resale advantages of the Kubota. I’m very happy with what I have. But I think PT is starting to price themselves out of the “Estate Tractor” market. My 2 cents.

funpilot · Aug 22, 2005

Well, no one commented on my typo of 7510 or 7520...should have been a 7610... So, my obvious lack of knoweldge here was kindly overlooked. This is turning into an excellent thread and so here are my follow up questions:

First, I really am not mechanically inclined...so the PT is a double edge sword for me. Its ease of changing attachments is wonderful, but repairing it could be a nightmare for me. I am not sure I even know who to ask for help where I live so I would lose two weekends driving it to the factory, then picking it up. Howver if that is not likely to happen, then perhaps I may not need to worry.

Second. With some thought, I see my primary use will be to move stuff with the loader and forklifts. I would still have a Simplicity to mow the lawn with when it is not in the shop (now going on one month).

So, if I get the Kubota, most likely I would leave the mower on for good counterbalance for the loader (I want the pull behind finish mower), and buy an aftermarket forklift blades (see attachment). However, the versitility of the PT is not lost on me. So, does this impact anyone's advice?

pequeajim · Aug 23, 2005

Thanks for the reply Kent, I hope you don't think that I was implying that you were getting heated. I only meant to say that some times we have a good thread like this start and because people are so passionate about what they own, it (can, may, might) get heated and then ruin a good thread.

You were not that way at all.

To all:

As far as comparing a 3pt finishing mower to something out front on an articulated tractor, there IS no comparison. I had one on my Massey and after buying my Ventrac, I swore I would never go back. I actually knocked a light pole down once /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif because I wasn't paying attention when turning.

At this point, that is what would keep me from buying a 3pt cut again. The only thing that cuts grass better than the front mount is a ZTR, and I am very happy with what I have.

(although those Dixie Choppers look pretty cool.. /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif )

KentT · Aug 23, 2005

( First, I really am not mechanically inclined...so the PT is a double edge sword for me. Its ease of changing attachments is wonderful, but repairing it could be a nightmare for me. I am not sure I even know who to ask for help where I live so I would lose two weekends driving it to the factory, then picking it up. Howver if that is not likely to happen, then perhaps I may not need to worry.
)

These things are MUCH simpler than a traditional CUT, so there are many less "systems" to fail on a PT -- for example, there's no radiator, no fan belt, no driveshaft, no clutch, no transmission, no 2WD/4WD transfer case, axles or differentials, no mechanical PTO, no brake system (except parking brake), etc.

There are essentially only two "systems" on the PT -- the engine, which a local small engine shop can handle, and the hydraulic system (and there are places around that specialize in hydraulic systems).

There would be no need to take it to Tazewell except for a warranty repair, where you wanted to take advantage of their free labor if you take it back to them. They'll still provide free parts under warranty for you to do the repair or have the repair done locally, if you so desire... they just won't pay someone else's labor.

MossRoad · Aug 23, 2005

I doesn't hurt to get a small understanding of hydraulics, either. Amazing stuff you can do with fluid under pressure. /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

Bob_Skurka · Aug 23, 2005

So, if I get the Kubota, most likely I would leave the mower on for good counterbalance for the loader (I want the pull behind finish mower), and buy an aftermarket forklift blades (see attachment). However, the versitility of the PT is not lost on me. So, does this impact anyone's advice?


As the NON-PT owner here, but someone who has a Kubota, let me make a few comments.

Using a RFM (rear finish mower) as a counterweight is not recommended unless you have some wide open spaces. That thing will be roughly 5' wide and will stick out about 4' back, you will be amazed at the places you cannot get into with one of those attached on the back of your tractor. Furthermore, it is my general understanding of your yard (based on a couple threads and a photo) that you have a HEAVILY landscaped yard, that will further hinder you with a big RFM hanging on the back.

Now with regard to the front forks. Forget it. You are looking a very small (7510) and a small tractor (7610). There are no quick attach forks built for those little machines. That would limit you to clamp on forks. Your lift capacity would be so dramatically reduced that you'd only have a few hundred pounds of lift capacity! That is hardly worth the effort. Certainly you would NOT be able to lift any stone, and even if you tried to pick up a pallet of mulch, it is likely you'd only get 1/4 of a pallet of bark mulch off the ground.

Let me offer a bit of an explination. The farther FORWARD you carry the load, the lower your capacity. Kubota measures bucket capacity at the center of the bucket. So whatever capacity you have at the bucket center, for every 20" you go forward, you can deduct about 30%. Bucket forks clamped to the bucket would move the load out from the 'center' of the bucket to a point that would roughly be centered 40" forward of the bucket center, so roughly you'd lose 60% of your lift capacity! That may not be 100% accurate, but it is a pretty good estimate.

BillCroasmun · Aug 23, 2005

( I am not sure I even know who to ask for help where I live... )

Here's some places I google'd for you. You could call and check to see if they work on hydraulics on your "tractor". No need to tell them the make or anything, should all be the same to them. You might want to see what kind of services they offer (i.e. Will they pick it up, etc.).

American Heavy Industries
(757) 858-2000 - 4.5 mi N
E Hoffman Industries Inc
(757) 424-7655 - 3.1 mi SE
F East Coast Auto Transport Inc
(757) 465-2200 - 5.1 mi W
G Power & Hydraulics Ltd
(757) 853-6556 - 3.7 mi NE
H Hydraulic Repair Corp
(757) 397-7789 - 3.8 mi NW
I Hydraulic Service Co Inc
(757) 487-2513 - 4.4 mi W
J Hydraulic Service Company Inc
(757) 487-2513 - 4.4 mi W

funpilot · Aug 23, 2005

OK, down to the wire. I can get a almost new 425 with generac engine for $9000 and a warranty. For some reason I thought the 425 came with a kohler engine but it comes with a Robin engine that I have never heard of... so is the generac engine the better way to go?

Or I can buy a 2004 used one (Robin engine) not under warranty with 150 hours and these toys:

4-in1 bucket
10 cu bucket
post hole digger
12" Auger
Blade with rubber lip kit and steel cutter bar kit
Stump Cutter
Potato Digger
Lift Boom
Cement Mixer
Forks
Minihoe
Bar Tread tires on machine

Asking $13,000. I did some math and think it should be closer to $10,500. What do you think?

funpilot · Aug 23, 2005

Also found a local rental company whose owner said no problem on working on this equipment. Seems he is certified in everything ... So, that is now behind me. Funny, he got excited over what I described and he may get one to rent out. Oh, and thanks Bill....great alternatives for me.