58 MPG by 2032

[WinterDeere]

If they are inevitable due to their superiority there would not be a massive governmental regulations to mandate them. Consumers would naturally make the change. Thats how capitalism works or we would still be riding horses to work. Reeeeee they are nicer, NOW BUY THEM. or else. If you want a smart car buy it I prefer a car that not monitored by microsoft, local government, state governmenr, federal government, corporations, hackers, CIA,FBI, Google, BIng, HP. Enjoy your electric car they can turn off as soon as you say or do the wrong thing.

Can you point to a government mandate that is forcing you or me to buy an electric car? I'm not seeing it.

Also, can you give an example of an electric car that "turns off as soon as I say the wrong thing"?

This is pure tinfoil hat BS, as far as I can see. And before you make too many assumptions, two of my three vehicles have 6.4L HEMI's, the third only being 5.7L because they didn't offer the 6.4L in that configuration. Put otherwise, I'm no EV fanatic, but I'm also not towing any political line.

 

[nickfank]

If they are inevitable due to their superiority there would not be a massive governmental regulations to mandate them. Consumers would naturally make the change. Thats how capitalism works or we would still be riding horses to work. Reeeeee they are nicer, NOW BUY THEM. or else. If you want a smart car buy it I prefer a car that not monitored by microsoft, local government, state governmenr, federal government, corporations, hackers, CIA,FBI, Google, BIng, HP. Enjoy your electric car they can turn off as soon as you say or do the wrong thing.

Let's just get ourselves back to reality here for a second...

1) There is currently no mandate. The *proposed* rule that started this conversation is 9 years in the future.

2) In spite of the fact that there is no mandate and never has been, the market share of EVs has grown steadily every year for the past decade. You can't explain that in any way other than consumers choosing EVs over ICE cars.

I share your concern about freedom from meddling, therefore neither of my EVs are connected to the Internet except briefly, when I ask the dealer to apply a software update that I want.

Since I've done some software work for a large manufacturing firm, I can tell you that most modern diesel semis spend more time connected the Internet than my EV, and in fact, there's one engine that can be tuned remotely while driving. (Can't tell you which one without breaking an NDA, but your diesel community will confirm this.)

 

[Deleted member 371759]

Can you point to a government mandate that is forcing you or me to buy an electric car? I'm not seeing it.

Also, can you give an example of an electric car that "turns off as soon as I say the wrong thing"?

This is pure tinfoil hat BS, as far as I can see.

Umm emission mandates that are unobtainable is de facto forcing electric vehicles on everyone along with massive regulations on the fossil fuel industry. Tin foil I have heard all that before. Truckers and their supporters in Canada had their bank accounts frozen, millions of people were fired from jobs for not taking the jab, thousands of people de-platformed from social media.. But they wont shut off your car. Give me a break.

 

[WinterDeere]

Umm emission mandates that are unobtainable is de facto forcing electric vehicles on everyone along with massive regulations on the fossil fuel industry. Tin foil I have heard all that before. Truckers and their supporters in Canada had their bank accounts frozen, millions of people were fired from jobs for not taking the jab, thousands of people de-platformed from social media.. But they wont shut off your car. Give me a break.

Emissions requirements are per fleet, which is what has permitted FCA Dodge to continue producing 6.4L and 6.2L supercharged engines up through 2023, they're offset by the tens of thousands of Fiat 500's and Chrysler minivans that clog our streets.

Interesting you bring truckers into this. Are you a trucker? I'm not, and what affects them has no bearing on my personal vehicle, or my choices thereof. We are talking here about personal vehicles, not commercial vehicles.

 

[nickfank]

Umm emission mandates that are unobtainable is de facto forcing electric vehicles on everyone along with massive regulations on the fossil fuel industry.

Again, that proposed efficiency standard is in the future, yet EV market share has been increasing during the previous decade. You're not really making sense.

I'm a little more paranoid than others on this thread, so I *do* share your worry about hacking the control system of a drive-by-wire car connected to the mother ship... but surely a skilled diesel mechanic can find & disconnect a 5G antenna as easily as I did.

(And to echo WinterDeere's comment, before you go making assumptions, my barn is full of tools to maintain ICEs, I drove a semi for a year when I was young, and I've probably rebuilt more ICEs than most of the people on this forum.)

 

[Deleted member 371759]

LMAO I brought up the fact truckers and their supporters bank accounts were frozen for performing a activity that was outside of the approved narrative. If they could have disable their vehicles like they can with modern electric vehicles they would have. They tried by refusing them diesel but supporters smuggled in in. I dont care about what you drive I find it quite telling that you care so much about what i drive though. I like big turbos and oversized injectors on pre emission diesels.

 

[nickfank]

LMAO I brought up the fact truckers and their supporters bank accounts were frozen for performing a activity that was outside of the approved narrative. If they could have disable their vehicles like they can with modern electric vehicles they would have. They tried by refusing them diesel but supporters smuggled in in. I dont care about what you drive I find it quite telling that you care so much about what i drive though. I like big turbos and oversized injectors on pre emission diesels.

I can't recall anyone posting that they care about what you drive. In fact, until you told me in the last sentence of this post, I didn't know what you drive.

I enjoy discussions about the relative merits of different technology, but if it's getting so personal that I'm hurting your feelings, I'll stop.

The reason I posted on this thread is primarily to point out the faulty reasoning of equating dependence on global oil companies with personal freedom, and also claiming that producing and using your own energy is in some way knuckling under to government pressure.

I hope I inspired a few people think about whether it makes sense for consumers who have no other option to rabidly defend the fossil fuel industry. I think they'll be just fine without our help, and encouraging the development of alternatives can only increase our freedom.

 

[Deleted member 371759]

I can't recall anyone posting that they care about what you drive. In fact, until you told me in the last sentence of this post, I didn't know what you drive.

I enjoy discussions about the relative merits of different technology, but if it's getting so personal that I'm hurting your feelings, I'll stop.

The reason I posted on this thread is primarily to point out the faulty reasoning of equating dependence on global oil companies with personal freedom, and also claiming that producing and using your own energy is in some way knuckling under to government pressure.

I hope I inspired a few people think about whether it makes sense for consumers who have no other option to rabidly defend the fossil fuel industry. I think they'll be just fine without our help, and encouraging the development of alternatives can only increase our freedom.

It takes a lot more than someone I dont know whos opinion i value less than my morning coffee to hurt my feelings. If you would like to trade global oil companies for authoritarian tech companies that is up to you. No one said anything about no benefits of producing your own energy good on ya. If you some how think that the development of technology over the last 20 years has increased our freedom I really don't know what to tell you. I would be all in on a open sourced vehicle whos code can be inspected, changed and the vehicle used in any way you want. Thats not what you or we are getting. We are getting closed sourced giant cell phones with more freedom destroying technology than ever seen before.

 

[nickfank]

If you would like to trade global oil companies for authoritarian tech companies that is up to you.

That would be a terrible idea! I'm glad I didn't say that. <grin>

 

[Deleted member 371759]

That would be a terrible idea! I'm glad I didn't say that. <grin>

But you did. You said

encouraging the development of alternatives can only increase our freedom.

How will close sourced software designed by giant tech corporations increase your freedom? These companies have already proven by past behavior they care zero about your freedom and will do anything they can to mine your data and attempt to influence society. I would say that the best indicator of future behavior is past behavior. First thing I do when I get a new PC/laptop is wipe windos and install Linux, first thing I dowhen I get a new router is wipe the OS and install OpenWrt first thing I do when I get a new cell phone is wipe the OS and install a custom ROM with no Google spyware tracking apps. Give me a electric car that will let me anonymously travel and I may not be against the technology.