77 Satoh Beaver S370D wont start, low compression

[Ilikeurtractor]

It does sound louder/different (deeper?) to me for some reason but that doesn't mean there is anything wrong with it. It might just be the missing air filter. My G154 sounds like it has a ticking noise. I adjusted the valves but it didn't make any difference. I can't really see any smoke in the video but it depends heavily on what is in the background. Sometimes you can't see any smoke in the right lighting, usually the sunnier the less noticeable. If you want to see some smoke go out at night, start it up, and turn the headlights on. The exhaust blows right in front of the headlights with the muffler in that configuration and if you can't see any smoke you would have a great running engine in my opinion. All of my tractors have what generally appears to be some white (maybe with a hint of blue) smoke. Some of it is water vapor along with some unburned hydrocarbons I would guess. When the engines are run hot the smoke tends to clear at least some (water vapor doesn't condense and usually you get more complete combustion.) Unfortunately most of these engines do not come with thermostats so they tend to run cooler (~160F) than ideal which I would say would be around 200 degrees F. It's hard to keep them hot also unless you're doing tilling, snow throwing, or some other activity which is drawing most of the engine's power which usually requires some PTO driven equipment. Just driving around, even pulling a trailer doesn't normally put the engine in a hot condition. An engine that runs cooler is more susceptible to sticking rings and "wet stacking" although I've never noticed wet stacking yet. One of my tractors had stuck rings and I just tore apart a 1-cylinder Hatz diesel that had one of the rings stuck so tight on the piston I barely got it out of the groove even after breaking it into pieces. You can retrofit a thermostat on these which is helpful.

 

[HomesteadOC]

It does sound louder/different (deeper?) to me for some reason but that doesn't mean there is anything wrong with it. It might just be the missing air filter. My G154 sounds like it has a ticking noise. I adjusted the valves but it didn't make any difference. I can't really see any smoke in the video but it depends heavily on what is in the background. Sometimes you can't see any smoke in the right lighting, usually the sunnier the less noticeable. If you want to see some smoke go out at night, start it up, and turn the headlights on. The exhaust blows right in front of the headlights with the muffler in that configuration and if you can't see any smoke you would have a great running engine in my opinion. All of my tractors have what generally appears to be some white (maybe with a hint of blue) smoke. Some of it is water vapor along with some unburned hydrocarbons I would guess. When the engines are run hot the smoke tends to clear at least some (water vapor doesn't condense and usually you get more complete combustion.) Unfortunately most of these engines do not come with thermostats so they tend to run cooler (~160F) than ideal which I would say would be around 200 degrees F. It's hard to keep them hot also unless you're doing tilling, snow throwing, or some other activity which is drawing most of the engine's power which usually requires some PTO driven equipment. Just driving around, even pulling a trailer doesn't normally put the engine in a hot condition. An engine that runs cooler is more susceptible to sticking rings and "wet stacking" although I've never noticed wet stacking yet. One of my tractors had stuck rings and I just tore apart a 1-cylinder Hatz diesel that had one of the rings stuck so tight on the piston I barely got it out of the groove even after breaking it into pieces. You can retrofit a thermostat on these which is helpful.

It sounds quieter with the filter on, but still has the knock/tick to it. Most people say it just sounds like a diesel, one guy says it doesnt sound good, and hes the most mechanically knowledgeable out of those polled. I like the idea of a thermostat retrofit, I did notice that the smoke decreased after I started ramming and lifting my cactus patch and knocking over trees, but when I had to throttle up a big puff of smoke came with it. Does your turbo iseki smoke less than the others? Ive thought about welding a stack on the beaver to get those pesky hydrocarbons out of my face and away from the front loader boom. My exhaust blows right on the hydraulic lines and thats probably not good, so I keep the boom above the smoke trajectory. If you have a manual handy can you tell me if my valve adjustment procedure was correct?
Cylinder 1 TDC adjust cold for 1 intake and exhaust at 0.014
Cylinder 2 TDC adjust cold for 2 intake and exhaust at 0.014
I used a balloon on a compression tester nipple to see where it stopped compressing and started sucked in the balloon, then wobbled back and forth til I found the exact top.

 

[thepumpguysc]

You don't have the marks/notches on the front hub to tell you TDC??

 

[Ilikeurtractor]

On setting the valve clearance just rotate the engine clockwise (looking at the front of the engine) until you see the intake valve close for the particular cylinder you're adjusting and then continue to rotate the crankshaft another 90 to 180 degrees in the clockwise direction and then set the clearance. The balloon trick is a good idea to get you absolutely at TDC but it is unnecessary to be there to get acceptable adjustment. The main thing is to have the lifter resting on the minor diameter of the cam lobe.

Smoke is a great indicator of what is going on with the engine. Obviously it is best to not see any at all but that is difficult to achieve in general. Black smoke is difficult to eliminate even with a turbo. Only in a narrow band of high sustained load does the turbo keep the black smoke at bay in my particular case. On heavy acceleration you almost always get black smoke. Keep in mind these engines are relatively crude by today's standards. The combination of low injection pressure, late timing, flywheel weight, cooler operating temp, and potentially lower compression all are contributing factors to the various colors of smoke. One of the best methods to deal with it is exactly what you said - install a vertical stack to keep it as far as practical from your breathing zone. I plan on converting all my horizontal exhaust engines to vertical when time and priorities allow.

In my experience, the 3-cylinder Mitsubishi (K3) diesels seem to have a much more distinct "tick" to them. Probably because they are somewhat quieter in general and it's easier to hear the ticking. I'm not sure where the noise is originating but I would guess it is in the valve train.

 

[HomesteadOC]

You don't have the marks/notches on the front hub to tell you TDC??

I couldnt see any marks on the hub, it was dirty, but I wiped around where I thought it should be and still nothing.

Seems like Ive adjusted the valves correctly, Ill get another video of it running with everything back together so you guys can tell me if it sounds ok. Im currently looking into an add on thermostat, hopefully I have enough clearance to add it in the hose.

Still need to install the hour meter, fuel injector T, powerwash, and touch up paint.

One thing that bothers me is the 3PH lever gets bumped and lets down the 3PH while im driving. Maybe theres a leak and it comes down on its own? Either way Im constantly lifting it up and one main thing I want this tractor to do is carry ibc totes on the back with a little forklift 3PH thingy and thats not going to work too well with the lift arms dropping down constantly.

 

[Ilikeurtractor]

I'd say put it back together and run it. If something is terribly wrong it will show up and probably already would have. Otherwise it's just a matter of living with the imperfections like everything else. If I could give you a tour of my equipment I can point out something wrong with everything I have, even after repairs - lol. A lot of brand new stuff has problems. Sometimes I wonder if some items are even tested as they seem like they must go straight from the drawing board to a store shelf.

Your 3-pt piston probably needs new O-rings. I posted about how it is on the Iseki TX tractors over in that forum fairly recently. I'd suspect the Satoh is very similar. It's an easy job to do, at least on the Iseki. Just need to find out what O-rings are used. Pick up your 3-pt and let it sit over night. It should not fall at all when it's in good condition under its own weight.

 

[HomesteadOC]

Its already back together since saturday. Ill see if I can find your o-ring post, I parked it with the hitch up, well see what it looks like when I get home today.

 

[Ilikeurtractor]

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/iseki/392056-3-point-bleeding-leaking-down.html

 

[HomesteadOC]

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/iseki/392056-3-point-bleeding-leaking-down.html

3PH stays up over night, it seems like my legs pushhes it down while Im riding. Ill have to pay more attention to it from now on.

 

[HomesteadOC]

I powerwashed the tractor today and uncovered some more zerk fittings on the boom and bucket, I greased those, but 2 were misding so Ill have to get those replaced. My powerwasher sucks so Im going to have to get in there with a scrub brush.

Heres a long long video of my piston and ring escapades.