A little rant

/ A little rant #21  
Moss road, not the customers job to supervise employees. I remember being in a fast food joint, it was slow and an off clock employee reached around and filled her own pop (that she had just paid for) to help the guy who was preparing her order.

An older guy in line who is a manager at a different business went ballistic about how unprofessional both of them were and was very loud and rude chastising them.

I felt it wasn't really his place to be trying to discipline employees that aren't his.
 
/ A little rant
  • Thread Starter
#22  
Sounds like you had a Lamb and Webster rodeo

Ev was the one who saw the post and forwarded it to the people responsible to get it taken care of. L&W seems like they have good owners but they can't control the managers and as others said on here, if they don't know about the problem they can't fix it. If they choose not to fix it then so be it but I do try to be fair to everyone and give multiple chances as I do know mistakes happen.

This current problem isn't a Lamb and Webster problem, its another Kubota dealer who sells Bobcat equipment and trailers. L&W is about an hour away and this other dealer is 35 minutes away. They started selling Kubotas a few years ago.
 
/ A little rant
  • Thread Starter
#23  
Moss road, not the customers job to supervise employees. I remember being in a fast food joint, it was slow and an off clock employee reached around and filled her own pop (that she had just paid for) to help the guy who was preparing her order.

An older guy in line who is a manager at a different business went ballistic about how unprofessional both of them were and was very loud and rude chastising them.

I felt it wasn't really his place to be trying to discipline employees that aren't his.

While I agree it isn't a customers job to supervise employees it doesn't usually hurt to inform the owner of the company about shady practices or just very poor expereinces. Some places actually have feedback questionaires just for that reason but if they don't then how else can you let the people who can fix things know? I look at it a little different, with ag dealers I really need them to do well as if they do well and are good to deal with it gives me a lot more choices when shopping for new/used equipment. If one gets out of control (like my local NH dealer) then I lose that dealership and that gives me one less place to deal with. So not only does it help the dealerships to get feedback, it does help me as well as either the owners fix the problem or I quit dealing with them. The upside of not dealing with them is I don't get taken (as in the case of a $13k repair bill for a $2500 verbal quote) but the downside is I no longer deal with them and as a result I now drive 30 minutes to the next dealership instead of 2 minutes.
 
/ A little rant #24  
So let's discuss that.

Why wouldn't you talk to the owner?

If I knew them personally I would. But, my comment was really directed more toward the comparison you made about the neighbors house on fire.

It's not even remotely like a neighbors house being on fire.
 
/ A little rant #25  
While I agree it isn't a customers job to supervise employees it doesn't usually hurt to inform the owner of the company about shady practices or just very poor expereinces. Some places actually have feedback questionaires just for that reason but if they don't then how else can you let the people who can fix things know? I look at it a little different, with ag dealers I really need them to do well as if they do well and are good to deal with it gives me a lot more choices when shopping for new/used equipment. If one gets out of control (like my local NH dealer) then I lose that dealership and that gives me one less place to deal with. So not only does it help the dealerships to get feedback, it does help me as well as either the owners fix the problem or I quit dealing with them. The upside of not dealing with them is I don't get taken (as in the case of a $13k repair bill for a $2500 verbal quote) but the downside is I no longer deal with them and as a result I now drive 30 minutes to the next dealership instead of 2 minutes.

Robert, it sounds like you do quite a bit of business and have been around a while in that area. I'm not familiar with the area and realize things could be done differently in that area than I am used to but it seems like with the volume you do that you would at least be on a first name, or better, basis with at least the GM at that dealership if not the owner.

It also sounds like the equipment you were dealing on is already sold and no longer available. Am I correct in that understanding?

I guess I can understand trying to feed competition and maintain additional sources and suppliers but if you've got viable dealers who are treating you right ........?? .......
 
/ A little rant
  • Thread Starter
#26  
Robert, it sounds like you do quite a bit of business and have been around a while in that area. I'm not familiar with the area and realize things could be done differently in that area than I am used to but it seems like with the volume you do that you would at least be on a first name, or better, basis with at least the GM at that dealership if not the owner.

It also sounds like the equipment you were dealing on is already sold and no longer available. Am I correct in that understanding?

I guess I can understand trying to feed competition and maintain additional sources and suppliers but if you've got viable dealers who are treating you right ........?? .......

I do know a few of the dealers personally and salesman at others. This dealership that I was trying to deal with is the only local company selling mini excavators. The next dealer is an hour away so I was trying to deal with someone close by and keep my money in this county if possible.

The problem is that not every dealer sells what I need. For a vineyard tractor that would work for me personally I am limited to either Kubota or John Deere. Messicks will take care of me with the Kubota narrow tractor so I have that figured out. The NH and Case-IH narrow tractors are too tight and ackward for me to get in and out of very much and there is no room to move and with my back I need to be able to twist a little to shift weight, move my legs and just stretch and its impossible to do in a CNH vineyard tractor. Implement wise there are certain implements I want and only certain dealers carry them. I wish I could just deal with one or two places but in this area you can't unless you settle for something. Rotary cutters and most 3pt equipment come from my Bush Hog/ Land Pride dealer. Vineyard equipment limits me to just a few dealers locally and one of them I won't deal with anymore. Ag tractors and haying equipment opens me up to different dealers since I generally can't walk into the local dealers since they mainly deal with vineyard equipment and not haying. And planting/harvesting equipment for field crops requires different dealers as well for my use/needs.

Its very difficult for me to deal with just one or two dealerships as I wouldn't be able to get what will work best for me and my operation. Yeah, I can get everything ordered in usually but I still need to talk to people that understand what I am doing and can help me. This area is a little odd as where I live along Lake Erie is all vineyard, go over the hill and its almost all dairy/haying, head north and you get into row crop farming so each area deals with something different and I am stupid enough to try bringing everything to my farm :laughing:
 
/ A little rant #27  
Hey Robert, I see the Landini Rex vineyard tractors around here a lot. Seem to be a nice little rig, ever run on of them? The cities buy them for side walk plows too. There is a gt version with the big wide rear tires for sale a little ways from me that is phyically the size of my L5030HSTC but double the hp and nice big radial tires. Tempting to take a look at it up close.
 
/ A little rant
  • Thread Starter
#28  
Hey Robert, I see the Landini Rex vineyard tractors around here a lot. Seem to be a nice little rig, ever run on of them? The cities buy them for side walk plows too. There is a gt version with the big wide rear tires for sale a little ways from me that is phyically the size of my L5030HSTC but double the hp and nice big radial tires. Tempting to take a look at it up close.

I haven't looked at those tractors too close. The only Landini dealer here also sells MF and he never has any inventory of either brand. Usually one or two new tractors but they seem to deal mainly with parts. Ever since the one owner passed away that place has gone down hill fast and I am scared to buy a new tractor from them as I don't expect them to be around much longer. I have bought a lot of parts from them over the last couple years and its discouraging going there as its so empty, almost everything needs to be ordered in special.
 
/ A little rant
  • Thread Starter
#29  
Hello Robert in NY;
I have had great luck with Construction Equipment For Sale at MachineryTrader.com: Dozers, Scrapers, Wheel Loaders, Excavators, Motor Graders, Caterpillar, Komatsu, Case, John Deere, Volvo. There is a huge selection of machines, you decide how far how many $$$ and what shape, size etc..you want. I looked at well over 100 excavators in our area and have been VERY happy with my results. I found machines with low hrs and was treated professionally by the different folks I went to. I'm not saying every single person on the site will be professional, but with the amount of choices one has it sure makes things much easier. Also you can see what an average price for a machine should be compared to many of the local stealers bull.

Thanks, I have been watching Ebay for the ideal machine and now I will keep checking Machinery Trader as well. Another TBN member also offered me his machine when he is done with it and if I have a choice (which I do:)) then I will help out a fellow TBN'er in the process.
 
/ A little rant #30  
If I knew them personally I would. But, my comment was really directed more toward the comparison you made about the neighbors house on fire.

It's not even remotely like a neighbors house being on fire.

O.K. You didn't like my analogy. I can live with that. :laughing:

My point was, the owner was losing business. You lose enough business, you lose your livelyhood. You lose your livelyhood, you lose your house.
 
/ A little rant #31  
O.K. You didn't like my analogy. I can live with that. :laughing:

My point was, the owner was losing business. You lose enough business, you lose your livelyhood. You lose your livelyhood, you lose your house.

I understand what you are saying. But it really isn't as dramatic as your neighbors house being on fire. :)

I can understand the OP's reason he might want to bring it up with the owner. Sounds like he has a vested interest in keeping dealers viable in his area.

But as a general rule I think it's just a waste of time. I understand some may think differently.

Remember, the fish rots from the head.
 
/ A little rant #32  
I would tell the owner.

Wife is trying to buy a car, has been for a couple of months. Salesman she "likes" called last week to say he had found a car at another dealership that met her specs. Wanted to know if we were serious about buying it before he had it moved. I gave him the amount I would pay and for him to send me a copy of the window sticker or the location of it since I drive all over Florida and could drop by there and look at it. After he got my offer, the car turned up sold... with no trace of where it had been, and he still isn't talking. He is about to loose a customer's spouse, and it's the one with the checkbook!! Before he called with the "car she wanted", I wouldn't discuss how much I was willing to pay, just find the durn car, then we will talk about how much. He figured out how to get his answer without finding the car. Cash used to talk, but now they want you to finance it so they can make more money in interest. I didn't want to talk about financing it, but he keeps on trying to get me to "save my cash". Go figure.
Salesmen can really tick me off at times.
David from jax
 
/ A little rant #33  
I was a management consultant in a former life and lectured on customer service. I ALWAYS contact the owner/CEO when I have an issue with bad service AND when I get great service. I know from personal and professional experience that even in a small organization, the owner/CEO doesn't always get customer feedback that he/she needs.

I start with the assumption that the owner's first concern is the bottom line. So anything that impacts that bottom line has to be of interest. Loosing me as a customer may not be a big deal, but what if I'm not the only one? I also respect and understand that there may be strong bonds and relationships between the employee I'm having problems with and the boss. So I try to state facts as I saw them that lead to the outcome of me being a dissatisfied customer without being emotional. That is often hard to do.

If I want some sort of problem resolution, I state that up front. If I'm determined not to do business with the company again, I state up front that I'm writing as one professional business person to another. I again assume the owner would want to know about and correct problems that impact his/her bottom line.

I've had more successes than failures with this approach. Professional, I've seen how customer feedback can really have an impact.
 
/ A little rant #34  
I understand what you are saying. But it really isn't as dramatic as your neighbors house being on fire. :)

I can understand the OP's reason he might want to bring it up with the owner. Sounds like he has a vested interest in keeping dealers viable in his area.

But as a general rule I think it's just a waste of time. I understand some may think differently.

Remember, the fish rots from the head.

I personally know two guys with two businesses that lost everything due to embezzlement by a business partner and a secretary respectively. They were good, honest, trusting guys and got robbed blind before they knew what happened. That's why I'd tell them.

And from my personal files... :laughing:

When I bought my IH2500B back around 1990 from a used equipment dealer I asked them to deliver it to our rural property. The salesman said it would take a few days to make arrangements. I said fine, just call me before they leave with it so I could meet them there. A couple days later I get a call from the police that a large tractor is sitting on my property too close to the highway and I need to move it! I go out there and the lady across the road says it has been there a couple days only a few feet from the road. There is no battery and I have no way to start it, move it, etc... The guy never called me, he just dumped it on the side of the road. :mad: I got a battery and got it away from the road. I called the dealer and kept getting the salesman even though I kept asking for the owner. It took several WEEKS to get a hold of the owner. I told him what happened and told him I wasn't too happy spending $5K on a tractor only to have it dumped on the side of the road. He asked "How Much???".... The salesman got fired immediately. ;)
 
/ A little rant #35  
One more example and I'll get off my soapbox. :licking:

We had one of those cabinet door and drawer refacing company salesmen out to give us an estimate on a 4 door cabinet that we wanted matched to some other cabinets in the house. My dad had used them and got something like 17 doors for $2300 or 23 doors for $1700... something like that, so I figured 4 doors would only be a few hundred. The guy tells us some crazy price if we sign tonight, it will go up a few hundred next week and even more after that!!! I had just finished dealing with a dying pet, some other stressful family items, and this clown gives me the hard sell in MY house! I about punched him in the mouth. My wife got him out of there. I did not call the owner. I just decided to let it go. Some time later, maybe months or even years, the owner calls me to make a sales call. Says he found our name in his files. I told him what happened and why they didn't get my business. He told me they never knew what the guy was doing and when they finally found out, they fired him. Now, the owner was struggling for business, his company had a soiled reputation in the communtiy and was going through the fired salesman's list of customers following up to see if he could salvage his reputation. I felt kinda bad for the guy as he obviously had no idea what the guy was up to until it was too late.
 
/ A little rant #36  
I personally know two guys with two businesses that lost everything due to embezzlement by a business partner and a secretary respectively. They were good, honest, trusting guys and got robbed blind before they knew what happened. That's why I'd tell them.

And from my personal files... :laughing:

When I bought my IH2500B back around 1990 from a used equipment dealer I asked them to deliver it to our rural property. The salesman said it would take a few days to make arrangements. I said fine, just call me before they leave with it so I could meet them there. A couple days later I get a call from the police that a large tractor is sitting on my property too close to the highway and I need to move it! I go out there and the lady across the road says it has been there a couple days only a few feet from the road. There is no battery and I have no way to start it, move it, etc... The guy never called me, he just dumped it on the side of the road. :mad: I got a battery and got it away from the road. I called the dealer and kept getting the salesman even though I kept asking for the owner. It took several WEEKS to get a hold of the owner. I told him what happened and told him I wasn't too happy spending $5K on a tractor only to have it dumped on the side of the road. He asked "How Much???".... The salesman got fired immediately. ;)

OK, I'll pay along since you insist.:D

In the first case it's nothing the same as the original question. If you had proof of flat out stealing then you should have reported it. And if these guys were your friends or someone you knew personally then, as I said to start with, you should have talked to them.

In the second case you don't say what the owner did to make the situation right but you seem to take more satisfaction in getting the salesman fired than anything else. Which, he sholuld have been if he just dumped a tractor you paid for on the side of the road without actually delivering it. Again, big difference in these two cases and the original post. But my question to you is what did you gain out of it? Did the owner make it right? How? I mean, if all e id was fire the salesman you still ave a valid complaint on that dealer because he should have done something for you because his agent put you in a bad situation. Still the facts you describe are far removed from the original issue posted.

Third case-Sounds like you may have some anger management issues? Just kidding. I've thrown plenty of people off my property or out of my offices or out of the office I was managing. But the thing is that I never felt it was my responsibility to manage somebody else's business for them if they weren't paying me to. In that case nothing you did at the tie or did not do was going to really change the situation because the owner was too disconnected from his bisines to see it. If all it too wa that one guy to sink his ship it must not ave been much of a ship and he should have been paying Bette attention to being the captain instead of whatever else it wad he was doing.

Now, all that said, I've voiced plenty of complaints to owners/managers of businesses. Recently I was at a Chilis restaurant and found the men's room so filthy it made me fear I would get sick from eating there. Spoke to the manager and a little while later before the food came but after pently f time had elapsed to clean it and stock it with towels and soap nothing had been done. I told the manager I would be speaking to someone about the issue. I wrote a detailed letter to the city health inspector and sent a copy f it to the corporate office. Got cals from everybody and a hundred dollars worth of gift certificates from the company. Mainly, the men's room was clean next time I went back. and, no I did not eat the food I had ordered or pay for it.

But that is still totally different than the original post where the OP got on a rant (by his own admission) about a tractor being sold out from under him. He may have had every right to be ticked off but really, stick with the facts as presented and tell us, realistically what the owner could do about that after the fact like it was?
 
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/ A little rant #37  
OK, I'll pay along since you insist.:D

In the first case it's nothing the same as the original question. If you had proof of flat out stealing then you should have reported it. And if these guys were your friends or someone you knew personally then, as I said to start with, you should have talked to them.

In the second case you don't say what the owner did to make the situation right but you seem to take more satisfaction in getting the salesman fired than anything else. Which, he sholuld have been if he just dumped a tractor you paid for on the side of the road without actually delivering it. Again, big difference in these two cases and the original post. But my question to you is what did you gain out of it? Did the owner make it right? How? I mean, if all e id was fire the salesman you still ave a valid complaint on that dealer because he should have done something for you because his agent put you in a bad situation. Still the facts you describe are far removed from the original issue posted.

Third case-Sounds like you may have some anger management issues? Just kidding. I've thrown plenty of people off my property or out of my offices or out of the office I was managing. But the thing is that I never felt it was my responsibility to manage somebody else's business for them if they weren't paying me to. In that case nothing you did at the tie or did not do was going to really change the situation because the owner was too disconnected from his bisines to see it. If all it too wa that one guy to sink his ship it must not ave been much of a ship and he should have been paying Bette attention to being the captain instead of whatever else it wad he was doing.

Now, all that said, I've voiced plenty of complaints to owners/managers of businesses. Recently I was at a Chilis restaurant and found the men's room so filthy it made me fear I would get sick from eating there. Spoke to the manager and a little while later before the food came but after pently f time had elapsed to clean it and stock it with towels and soap nothing had been done. I told the manager I would be speaking to someone about the issue. I wrote a detailed letter to the city health inspector and sent a copy f it to the corporate office. Got cals from everybody and a hundred dollars worth of gift certificates from the company. Mainly, the men's room was clean next time I went back. and, no I did not eat the food I had ordered or pay for it.

But that is still totally different than the original post where the OP got on a rant (by his own admission) about a tractor being sold out from under him. He may have had every right to be ticked off but really, stick with the facts as presented and tell us, realistically what the owner could do about that after the fact like it was?


It sounds like you don't want to help someone if there is nothing in it for you. :rolleyes:
 
/ A little rant #38  
It sounds like you don't want to help someone if there is nothing in it for you. :rolleyes:

Not at all. But, unless it affects me in a negative way, that can be resolved by some action, I am not going to take it upon my self to tell someone how to run their business. That is their job.

Since you offered your opinion of your evaluation of my motives I'll offer one.

It sounds like to me you just want to tell other people how to run their business and claim it's 'just being helpful' when you are really just a busy body tattle-tale.

But you never answered my question about what you would expect the owner of the business in the OP to do if he was told about the situation.

.
 
/ A little rant #39  
But you never answered my question about what you would expect the owner of the business in the OP to do if he was told about the situation.

.

I'd expect him to take it for what it's worth... customer feedback. Nothing more. Nothing less. How he acts upon it is entirely his business.
 

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