Xfaxman: I was referring to the width of the trail not the grapple, out in a field it wouldn't be a concern as your pictures show well. It would be an issue if it was in the bush where the trail is only as wide as the tractor. IE: 8 foot wide path and a 20 foot tree, it wouldn't work with a front grapple unless you could cut the logs down to be able to fit through the trail.
Best method for a tractor to move/haul/process downed logs?
- Thread starter plowhog
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roadhunter
Elite Member
I didn't say dedicated forestry equipment. You can get the same features in most construction type of equipment. Things like skid plates, protection for the engine, protection for the operator, heavier tires, etc... Even those little rental backhoes are built like a tank compared to modern CUT's.
Like I said earlier if you are going to do anything more than light duty stuff I'd look at somethign different than a tractor. There are no skid plates, tires are light duty, lacking protection for the operator, no protection for the engine unless you think that flimsy hood is going to do something, etc...
I think using a brand new tractor for somethign like this is just a bad idea but you never know these 24" logs that are 25+ ft long may be few and far between but that is big enough to give a CUT trouble, especially trying to carry with the loader. All that weight on those little tiny tires is a recipe for disaster unless it is really flat and really firm ground..
But I have no doubt that a tractor would work if you were really careful and the situation was not a snarled mess of huge trees knocked down laying in all directions with debris like sharp sticks laying all over the place on somewhat uneven terrain.
Here's a small sample of what I was dealing with.
Maybe similar to Plowhog's, but hopefully no root balls?
The only way to realistically access any of this was to pull out one "stem" at a time. The only way to do that with a tractor is to take advantage of its TRACTION to pull, either with a choker and chain or a winch. Even so, no way the root balls from blown-down trees were going to be moved without being able to get to them to cut the "stem" loose first.
No way to get in and do any of that with a grapple. An excavator with a grapple to do it from over head, maybe. But not from tractor level.
Maybe similar to Plowhog's, but hopefully no root balls?
The only way to realistically access any of this was to pull out one "stem" at a time. The only way to do that with a tractor is to take advantage of its TRACTION to pull, either with a choker and chain or a winch. Even so, no way the root balls from blown-down trees were going to be moved without being able to get to them to cut the "stem" loose first.
No way to get in and do any of that with a grapple. An excavator with a grapple to do it from over head, maybe. But not from tractor level.
DieselBound
Elite Member
Sometimes you have to do hand-to-hand combat! Geez, I'm old and I get out and swing my trusty machete. Chainsaw stuff!
Whenever you have a problem cut it down to size.
JPRambo, the "little" Kubotas are awesome. If you are really good you can make them work VERY hard. They can get into places where nothing else can go. My wife is now referring to our B7800 as the "toy tractor"- I am more than quick to snap back with: "it's NOT a toy!" (yes, she understands and says this jokingly, but I insist upon not treating it like a joke)
Whenever you have a problem cut it down to size.
JPRambo, the "little" Kubotas are awesome. If you are really good you can make them work VERY hard. They can get into places where nothing else can go. My wife is now referring to our B7800 as the "toy tractor"- I am more than quick to snap back with: "it's NOT a toy!" (yes, she understands and says this jokingly, but I insist upon not treating it like a joke)
52wej
Gold Member
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- Central Virginia
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- 2004 Century 2535 (3510 Branson equivalent), 2016 Kubota MX 5200
here one more comment to a fine list of comments. Give some serious consideration to using an older tractor like the 4610, 6600 series , or 7600 series. For one thing, the ground clearance is greater that some of the newer kubotas. Second they do not have as many hydraulic lines under the tractor as many of the newer tractors do. Hydraulic lines & brush = repairs. Though they are not as fancy, they will endure a lot of hard work and are much simpler to repair. Get a logging winch, you will be much more effective in tangled brush. I have a 30 hp tractor with a norse winch and and would not hesitate to hook it to a 26" log; though I would limit the length to about 12 ft because you will not turn a long log without a wide area to work in. 20 acres of mowing is only about 2 long days with a 7 ft bush hog. Good Luck. W. Jones
LD1
Epic Contributor
My point was.....none of the construction-type equipment you imply, or skid loaders, or anything else not on tires, is not gonna serve him well for the 20acres of field that will need mowed regularly.
As I understand it, cleaning up this small 8 acres of mess is gonna be a one time deal. So my suggestion. Is to buy what you will need for the future, and make it work for this one time cleanup.
You keep mentioning small front tires, guess that's all relative. Tractors, once you get much north of 50hp, don't have what I would call "tiny" front tires.
Actually, HP for HP, backhoes have about the smallest front tires you will see.
LD1
Epic Contributor
Just not true at all.
Ford 4610...............60HP.......4800#........14.9-28 tires........17.3" ground clearance
M6060 kubota.........60HP........5000#.........16.9-28 tires......18.1" ground clearance
Ford 6600...............79HP.......5880#..........13.6x38 tires......18" ground clearance
Kubota 8560...........85HP.......5800#..........16.9-30 tires.......18.7" ground clearance
Ford 7600..............93HP.........7440#..........16.9x30 tires......18.2" ground clearance
M9960..................100HP.........5950#.........18.4x30 tires.......19.7 ground clearance
roadhunter
Elite Member
You are certainly free to believe that a new tractor is the best way to approach 8 acres of logging downed 24" trees but I don't. I have gone over the reasons why I dont' think it is but its' clear that you see this differently and that is fine.
My experience comes from doing actual logging of material this size and running a full sized skidder. Loggers approach things differently than landowners do.
And yest CUT's have tiny small front tires which end up carrying most of the weight when doing loader work. That is a fact. I had a 45 HP tractor and the fronts were severely undersized for carrying loads. When you feel the back of the tractor get light you know that the majority of the weight on on the little front axle.
If you want to believe that backhoes front axles are undersized and the tires not fit to carry heavy loads you are entitled to your opinion. From my experience running construction equipment it is built to a different standard and designed to take a beating doing hard work much more so than a CUT.
A tractor is designed to pull heavy loads so if the OP goes with a tractor I would try to find a way to drag material out as opposed to carrying everything out. That will also allow more flexibility in getting close enough to hook up a chain or cable as opposed to having to drive right no to the downed tree to get it with a grapple. I would leave them whole and then cut them up and use the grapple once you get them out.
LD1
Epic Contributor
We arent gonna get any where arguing with each other.
1st, I never said a new tractor was the best idea. And never argued against a used tractor. A used tractor loader would be a good combo, especially if 4wd. But since day one of ownership of a new tractor, and a newer gently used tractor, mine has been in the woods with me cutting wood. So I have nothing against that.
2nd, I never said anything about axles. Your earlier comment was about tires. The M6060 the op has looked at, comes with 9.5-24" tires. Which is LARGER than anything you will find on a backhoe except for the the ones like JCB. I have a 18000# backhoe, I understand fully the difference in how construction equipment, and ag/utility tractors are built.
This isnt meant to be a debate between what is better at logging type work. Clearly, a skid loader, or other construction/forestry type equipment is king.
My point is, we are talking about a small 8 acres, one time, that is in no rush to get done. And there are a vareity of other tasks that he needs for his property. That $75 tracked skid loader with grapple is not gonna mow his 20 acres. A M6060, or similar new OR used tractor WILL. And it will ALSO handle his small 8 acres of clearing needs. Sure, not as well as other equipment. But whenever getting equipment to do multiple jobs, there are always trade offs and compromises.
If money were no object, I'd own about a dozen more pieces of equipment myself. But reality is different. For me, a tractor covers the broadest spectrum of tasks that I need accomplished. I feel the OP's situation is similar. In that if he were to get a tracked loader, either new or used......he would still need a tractor. And be left with a seldom used piece of equipment once the 8 acres is cleared.
check
Elite Member
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Very cool contraption!:thumbsup:
JPRambo
Platinum Member
After using my B7100 a few times the wife found a tractor she wanted. A B6100 no loader but came with a rear blade, and a finish mower.
The contraption is my home made version of a log arch I guessed at a 'I'll never need it to be bigger' width. In the 1st pic the last log on the ground has the bark removed on the end. I had to narrow the width to use the arch to move it.
The contraption is my home made version of a log arch I guessed at a 'I'll never need it to be bigger' width. In the 1st pic the last log on the ground has the bark removed on the end. I had to narrow the width to use the arch to move it.
Xfaxman
Super Star Member
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- Toolcat 5610 G - Bobcat V417 - TORO+Loader
Just for information only, you can mow with a skid steer:
Flail Mowers
I use a 7' brush hog on the V417:
Flail Mowers
I use a 7' brush hog on the V417:
roadhunter
Elite Member
LOL. There are ways to mow without a tractor.
Like I said you are entitled to your opinion based of your experience and so am I. YOU are the one trying to turn this into an argument so I am going to be the one to put an end to it and not even bother to write a lengthy response. Have a great day.
roadhunter
Elite Member
LD1
Epic Contributor
Id rather mow 20 acres of pasture on a tractor, and take my sweet time with it dealing with 8 acres of trees with said tractor
Than,
Buy a tracked skidloader and grapple for the 8 acres of trees, and try to maintain 20 acres of pasture with said skid loader.
DieselBound
Elite Member
I've run tracked stuff and while it's great doing focused things, I wouldn't want one for most of what I do. After spending days with an excavator recently I was more than happy to get back on my wheeled tractor. I also like to sit up a bit higher (not an issue with excavators, but with skidsteers...).
I don't, however, have any problems with renting specialized equipment.
This topic is kind of hard in that it suggests a longer-term use of equipment than just moving/hauling/processing logs. As I'd mentioned previously, one has to "cut" the problem down in more manageable sizes in order to be more effective. For the short-term more commercial equipment might be the way to attack the 8 acres issue; but, that commercial equipment won't be effective for the longer term (but, and no one has mentioned this, one can buy equipment, use it and then resell it- hoping, of course, that you don't run into major expenses, and tracked stuff can get very expensive here).
roadhunter
Elite Member
It's amazing how maneuverable and powerful tracked equipment can be in tight quarters. I"ve ran them cutting cedars and it is pretty amazing what they can do clearing trees. It's also much easier to see what you are doing with the grapple on a skid steer as opposed to a tractor where you kinda have to guess if you can't see. For loading wood into a chipper a skid steer is easy to rotate and load material in the chute as well.
If a person wants to make the best use of 20 acres of pasture letting a neighbor graze or bail that is much better than wasting time and fuel constantly mowing. I have enjoyed letting neighbors bring horses to graze my property and also let some other neighbors bail my land and keep all the hay as I had no use for it and was glad to see it get used. All without using any fuel or time as well as creating goodwill with neighbors.
DieselBound
Elite Member
I agree, mowing just to mow isn't exactly my intent. I'm wanting to bring in animals. It's a long process (a "way of life") for me.
Xfaxman
Super Star Member
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- Toolcat 5610 G - Bobcat V417 - TORO+Loader
I didn't say it was a good idea, just showing that it was possible.
I sold my tractor soon after I bought the first Compact Telehandler.
I would rather mow 20 acres of pasture with an out front mower on the V417, than on any tractor with a 3 point brush hog.
The V417 will go in the woods, where equivalent lifting capacity tractors won't fit.
