Bought MT2801D - 4DQ30C 1490cc 4cyl engine - ''Auto Laser" front loader - Mitsubishi R1613S rotary tiller

[bmaverick]

Dear maverick ,that excellent file was the first I read in Mitsubishi subforum.
The authors of this compilation of information deserves our greatest regards!

The original author for the PDF document release 1 had died. I worked with another Mitsubishi owner who hosts a website with many of the manuals. We updated the document a few times. It is one of the most valuable documents now for owners today.

 

[Spiros-GR]

Nealy all the Japan compact utility tractors use 10W30 for summer and 5W30 winter. For extreme heat above 86F / 30C, SAE 30 is ideal.

Do NOT use the 20W50. Diesel engines do not 'rev' like Japan motorcycles. Japan diesel engines are made to JIS standards and not SAE. Do not use thick viscosity oils in Japan diesel engines. This will retain hotter temps longer in the engine, increase soot levels and the poor engine has to work harder. All 3 of those can lead to a warped engine head.

I will write down a few local shade ambient temparature case studies . I think the equivalent climate conditions match that of south to central California. Coastal area 0.5-2 miles from coastline.

Lowest winter temp 28F

Summer hay cutting 86F - 104F

Spring bush hogging 77F

Fall plowing/tilling 59F

Winter plowing/tilling /FEL 41F - 50F



Stick to 10W30 winter (mineral? synthetic? ) and 30W (mineral ? ) summer ?
Or maybe a good synth 15w40 year round ?

 

[Spiros-GR]

The original author for the PDF document release 1 had died. I worked with another Mitsubishi owner who hosts a website with many of the manuals. We updated the document a few times. It is one of the most valuable documents now for owners today.

great job!

 

[bmaverick]

I will write down a few local shade ambient temparature case studies . I think the equivalent climate conditions match that of south to central California. Coastal area 0.5-2 miles from coastline.

Lowest winter temp 28F

Summer hay cutting 86F - 104F

Spring bush hogging 77F

Fall plowing/tilling 59F

Winter plowing/tilling /FEL 41F - 50F



Stick to 10W30 winter (mineral? synthetic? ) and 30W (mineral ? ) summer ?
Or maybe a good synth 15w40 year round ?

These small Japan diesel engines have narrow oil passages. Using 15W40 would cause several issues.

How to keep the soot away and ways to prevent having the engine head warp and crack on Japan diesel engines.

- Do not let the engine idle below 1200rpms for longer than 10mins max at a time. And the time is with 20mins between.

- Do use 10W30 summer and 5W30 winter for engine oil. Do not use the heavy thicker 15W40 as it will hold the heat longer in the engine. Japan made engines are to JIS standards, not SAE. So the cooling oil passages are narrower in metric.

- Do keep the air intake filter clean. Clogged filter makes the engine work harder and heat builds up with the engine.

- Do keep the radiator and the screen clean.

- Do check the coolant. Do not use extended life coolants in these vintage machines.

- Do start the tractor slightly above idle.

- Do not race the engine from slow to fast and fast to slow.

- Do slow the engine speed down gradually, idle for 15 seconds then turn the engine off.

Some of these tips are from Yanmar, Kubota, Satoh, Hinomoto, etc bulletins and some came from the Yanmar JP website before 2018.

 

[ptsg]

I don't know but I had a Kubota B7000 with a Z650 engine and I'm running a Kubota D640 on my homemade backhoe. Both small Japanese engines. All I've used in these engines is 15W40 oil. I have had absolutely 0 issues.

The B7000 had easily over 2000 hours, no issues whatsoever on the engine. The D640 on the backhoe has over 1000 hours, again no issues either. Also, both engines idle a lot in the 1000 RPM range and haven't had any soot issues or cracking heads.

Who knows how many hours these engines had before I got them and if I had to guess, they had 15W40 on them too since it's what most people use on these small engines.

Being that the OP is in Greece, which has a very similar climate to Portugal, I wouldn't hesitate a single bit on using 15W40.

 

[bmaverick]

I don't know but I had a Kubota B7000 with a Z650 engine and I'm running a Kubota D640 on my homemade backhoe. Both small Japanese engines. All I've used in these engines is 15W40 oil. I have had absolutely 0 issues.

The B7000 had easily over 2000 hours, no issues whatsoever on the engine. The D640 on the backhoe has over 1000 hours, again no issues either. Also, both engines idle a lot in the 1000 RPM range and haven't had any soot issues or cracking heads.

Who knows how many hours these engines had before I got them and if I had to guess, they had 15W40 on them too since it's what most people use on these small engines.

Being that the OP is in Greece, which has a very similar climate to Portugal, I wouldn't hesitate a single bit on using 15W40.

Those are really young engine hours. Should the machines reach 8,000 to 16,000 hours with no engine over-haul using 15W40, then I'll be all ears to hear your report.

 

[ptsg]

Those are really young engine hours. Should the machines reach 8,000 to 16,000 hours with no engine over-haul using 15W40, then I'll be all ears to hear your report.

Sure but if 15W40 was that destructive on these engines, I would expect a lot more failures, even at young engine hours. I have yet to see or hear about a single engine failure caused by using 15W40.

Also, an engine like this, would most likely have like 2 or 3 overhauls well before reaching those 8000 hours, regardless of the type of oil used.

 

[bmaverick]

Sure but if 15W40 was that destructive on these engines, I would expect a lot more failures, even at young engine hours. I have yet to see or hear about a single engine failure caused by using 15W40.

There are many documented failures, enough so the OE bulletins are published out there.

American made iron machines to SAE standards calling out 15W40 are just fine. And many of the newly made Japan tractors now use oil coolers to allow a faster warm-up of 15W40.

As the question was asked, could the person use 15W40 all year? Only in a few selected places in the nation is possible. As climate is very unpredictable in the south due to these polar vortex arctic blasts, when the MT2801Dis needed to power a PTO genset, it wouldn't be running so smoothly slugging the 15W40 around vs 5W30 in the season.

 

[Spiros-GR]

There are many documented failures, enough so the OE bulletins are published out there.

American made iron machines to SAE standards calling out 15W40 are just fine. And many of the newly made Japan tractors now use oil coolers to allow a faster warm-up of 15W40.

As the question was asked, could the person use 15W40 all year? Only in a few selected places in the nation is possible. As climate is very unpredictable in the south due to these polar vortex arctic blasts, when the MT2801Dis needed to power a PTO genset, it wouldn't be running so smoothly slugging the 15W40 around vs 5W30 in the season.

View attachment 871081

Internet is full of discussions on the oil matter.
Many domestic US tractors are equipped with kubota or yanmar engines. In every discussion I read, people consider 10w30 somehow a nerd theory.Instead Rotella t6 is their choice hands down. 15w40 the most and 5w40 for those with harsh winter.
In my opinion this common belief is established based on american and european tractors' recommendations and common practices.
Since you have experience on japanese tractors and according to your knowledge their engines are made with minor tolerances I will try to follow your advice .

5w30 for winter.
But will the 10w30 be a good option for summer?
In most user manuals 10w30 is recommended for temps up to +/- 90F
I wasn't sure why a single grade 30w would provide any better protection than 10w30 .
And then I discovered that single grade 30w is recommended for up to 122F !

New questions pop-up

Does japanese engine keep the tight tolerances for ever? A used grey market engine ,or any other used japanese engine doesn't loosen up after some hundred or thousand hours? If they indeed loosen up,maybe this is the reason ,users of old japanese engines have no complaints with 15w40 ?
Why a mineral 10w30 or 30w create less soot than a new generation full synthetic 15w40 ? And maybe someone may find synthetic 10w30 on the market, but single grade 30w ?

Right now my Mt2801 has mineral 20w50 standing in there for 6 years. As mentioned, fired up well, no black or white smoke,no bad smell.
Is there a chance to cause any trouble by replacing it with fresh synthetic 10w30 or any other synthetic? Synthetics say they have additives to unclog bad staff accumulated in the engine.

 

[Spiros-GR]

I don't know but I had a Kubota B7000 with a Z650 engine and I'm running a Kubota D640 on my homemade backhoe. Both small Japanese engines. All I've used in these engines is 15W40 oil. I have had absolutely 0 issues.

The B7000 had easily over 2000 hours, no issues whatsoever on the engine. The D640 on the backhoe has over 1000 hours, again no issues either. Also, both engines idle a lot in the 1000 RPM range and haven't had any soot issues or cracking heads.

Who knows how many hours these engines had before I got them and if I had to guess, they had 15W40 on them too since it's what most people use on these small engines.

Being that the OP is in Greece, which has a very similar climate to Portugal, I wouldn't hesitate a single bit on using 15W40.

Same here, my 3cyl B7001 with D750 engine is running in mineral 15w40. In fact mineral oil from Lidl about 20 euros/5 lt or 15euros special offer days.German made oil and the specs mention both for diesel and gas engines.
They also sell 10w40 semi-synthetic ,also german made,the one Opel/GM sells under their brand. 20 or 15 euros on LIDL brand for 5lt jug, 37 euros GM branded


* 5 lt = about 5.25 quarts