Flail Mower Bush hog or flail mower for field grass?

[Dustin]

We have been mowing about 10 acres of field grass (Timothy, Rye, vetch, garbage weeds, etc) for years. We have the opportunity to purchase an 88" Ford flail mower for $600-$700.

Compared to an 88" bush hog, is the same cutting width flail mower going to be able to handle 3-4' tall grass and weeds at the same speed? Will we have to go slower for the flail mower? Is the flail mower going to be able to handle the tall grass or are the belts just going to slip on it and everything get wrapped around the shaft?

We have some rocks that bang the heck out of the bush hog, so that's why we are considering changing what we cut it with.

Mowing with a 55HP, Kubota M5700 today.

 

[beenthere]

No good answer given the variables that you present. For some, the brush hog will work better and for others, the flail will work better. Depends on how low you want to mow (i.e. the rocks you mention), how often you mow (i.e. the length of the tall grass), and the time element. Plus some others to consider.

There will likely be much more maintenance with the flail, but there are variables there as well. Consider it expensive to keep 10 acres mowed, and I'm thinking a $700 mower won't go very far or last very long. Just a thought.

 

[LD1]

For 3-4' grass, I'd stick with the bushhog. I am no expert with a flail, but with my limited use, anything much above 20" and the bushhog can maintain a faster ground speed and leave a cleaner cut.

If there are any rental places near you, you may want to check into renting one for a day just to see if you will like it before you drop that kinda cash on one.

 

[greg_g]

It also depends upon what kind of knives are on the flail - and what kind of grass you're cutting. Some flails are set up for finish mowing, some for rough cut, and the extreme heavy duty have hammers instead of knives. I've got some patches of tall crabgrass that even bog down the bushhog (behind a 45hp tractor) to the point where I have to gear down and make 3-4 passes before it's all cut. Tall fescue ain't no joy either. Rocks ain't such a big deal, you might have to replace a flail knife once in a while. On my 74" Ford 917 flail, replacing a rough cut knife costs me about a buck and a half and 10 minutes labor.

I've got experience with both RCs and flails. So if you give a better description of what you're considering buying - and specifically what you're intending to mow with it - I can perhaps come up with a more definitive answer.

//greg//

 

[Dustin]

It's about 3-4 foot tall Timothy and Rye grass with some vetch (which will bog down the bush hog) and other weeds.

The flail I'm considering is a Ford 917 offset, though I couldn't say which flail knives it has. For the time and cost, I could replace them though.

When I catch a rock with the bush hog, the blades get banged up into the top of the mower deck. Eventually,they will cut through. That's why I've been considering the flail.

But the flail is only an option if I can mow at the same speed as the bush hog.

Does that info help any?

 

[LD1]

It's about 3-4 foot tall Timothy and Rye grass with some vetch (which will bog down the bush hog) and other weeds.

The flail I'm considering is a Ford 917 offset, though I couldn't say which flail knives it has. For the time and cost, I could replace them though.

When I catch a rock with the bush hog, the blades get banged up into the top of the mower deck. Eventually,they will cut through. That's why I've been considering the flail.

But the flail is only an option if I can mow at the same speed as the bush hog.

Does that info help any?

It sounds to me like something in the bushhog is worn out.

The blades shouldnt slap the deck if everything is good and tight.

I'd be looking at reparing or replacing the existing bushhog for 3-4' tall stuff.

 

[beenthere]

Don't understand why the blades should be getting up into the top of the mower deck. Are they loose on worn bolts?
What brand is the hog?

 

[greg_g]

It's about 3-4 foot tall Timothy and Rye grass with some vetch (which will bog down the bush hog) and other weeds.

The flail I'm considering is a Ford 917 offset, though I couldn't say which flail knives it has. For the time and cost, I could replace them though.

Yeah, your bush hog blades and/or pins are shot. When the holes and/or the pins get worn (egged-out) the blades can't stay on the horizontal anymore when they hit something solid.

As you've read, I have a 917 too, specifically the 74" 917H (heavy duty). I put the T-knives on mine for rough cutting (the single blades doubled on a hangar are for fine cut/finish mowing). My flail is as good as either of my rotary cutters, provided that I don't let the grass/weeds get out of control. But I still have to double or triple cut the few patches of crab grass that are left. That's stubborn stuff.

If your 3-4' grasses are thin, and you have the rough cut knives, you should be able to go through it. If not, get it bush hogged down once, then in the future try to get at it with the flail before it gets that long again. I usually try to tackle mine at about the 2' mark (or roughly knee high). Some of the thinner patches I can let go to the 3-4' mark.

//greg//

 

[dieselscout80]

Yeah, your bush hog blades and/or pins are shot. When the holes and/or the pins get worn (egged-out) the blades can't stay on the horizontal anymore when they hit something solid.

As you've read, I have a 917 too, specifically the 74" 917H (heavy duty). I put the T-knives on mine for rough cutting (the single blades doubled on a hangar are for fine cut/finish mowing). My flail is as good as either of my rotary cutters, provided that I don't let the grass/weeds get out of control. But I still have to double or triple cut the few patches of crab grass that are left. That's stubborn stuff.

If your 3-4' grasses are thin, and you have the rough cut knives, you should be able to go through it. If not, get it bush hogged down once, then in the future try to get at it with the flail before it gets that long again. I usually try to tackle mine at about the 2' mark (or roughly knee high). Some of the thinner patches I can let go to the 3-4' mark.

//greg//

Greg, are these the knifes that you are refering to for rough cutting?

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/attachments/118882-lets-talk-flail-mowers-98.html#post2070762

 

[leonz]

Greetings and salutations,

You have a scoop or shovel
type flail knive in the photo.

As long as you have sharp knives and
good bearings and belts you will not have
any issues with the Ford 917 flail mower
and parts are available.

As for power needs my father used a
John Deere 7 foot finish mower behind
behind a Ford Jubilee and it handled it fine
right to the sod.

About the rocks its only an issue with the
knife or knives that may come into contact with
the rock.

A rock that big should not be left for bait
anyway as broken rock is just as deadly as a
brush mower blade that may escape the mower
housing(there are plenty of stories on the forum
describing the damage and injuries that they
can cause.

And as mentioned by the previous esteemed members
you have major issues with that rotary cutter and need
to either repair it or replace it if you intend on keeping
a rotary cutter as you have worn bolts and or cutter
blades that have been left to long and should have
been replaced.


BUT once you see how nice the sod is after you go over
the ground at the lowest setting you will not go back to
a rotary cutter and the invasives will be much less of a
problem and the flail knives will destroy them very
effectively and keep them down.

The flail knives will effectively shred the brush it mows
and it it will shred it further if a second pass is desired
as the airfoil created sucks up the cuttings and slices
them again to very small clippings that compost quickly.


:thumbsup:

 

[greg_g]

Greg, are these the knifes that you are refering to for rough cutting?

Yup. What kind of knives are on it now? I ask, because rough cut and fine cut knives use different hangers.

//greg//

 

[leonz]

We have been mowing about 10 acres of field grass (Timothy, Rye, vetch, garbage weeds, etc) for years. We have the opportunity to purchase an 88" Ford flail mower for $600-$700.

Compared to an 88" bush hog, is the same cutting width flail mower going to be able to handle 3-4' tall grass and weeds at the same speed? Will we have to go slower for the flail mower? Is the flail mower going to be able to handle the tall grass or are the belts just going to slip on it and everything get wrapped around the shaft?

We have some rocks that bang the heck out of the bush hog, so that's why we are considering changing what we cut it with.

Mowing with a 55HP, Kubota M5700 today.

Any flail mower you buy is going to shred
everything you put in front of it the travel
speed is the issue as you can drive fast and
leave rooster tails with either brush mower.

If the brush is really tall you need to travel
slowly as the flail mower is most effective
when the mower is on the ground allowing
the roller to fully contact the ground while
mowing to minimise scalping.

If you drive too fast you will destory the
V-belts as has happened previously on the
forum here.

The flail mower has many advantages over
a rotary cutter. the biggest advantage is the
fact that the full width of the flail mower-
all 88 inches is cutting the brush or grass in
front of it at all times where only one half
of the rotary cutter is being used to cut
brush or grass.


The flail mower also uses less fuel as the flail
mower rotor rotates at a very high speed to
shred the material entering the mower at all
times as as long as you mow according to the
condition of the brush you will not have any
skipped areas.

The shorter you mow it the less time and fuel
it takes to keep ity under control and in the
process destroy the weed population and
the invasives.

 

[Dustin]

I don't think anything is worn out on the bush hog. This has happened to at least two others we've owned. I understand what you're saying about everything being tight, but if you clobber a 9" tall rock, the blade(s) can only go in one direction as you ride over the stone, and that's up. They go up and slap the top of the deck. We don't have rocky fields for the most part, but there are some if you get them just right (tractor is going up, forcing the bush hog down), then it'll happen. Most the good rocks are marked.

anyhow, what I'm hearing though is that a flail mower won't handle tall grass? What about what the state boys use for the sides of the road? They seem to go through some tall/nasty stuff without any issues...

I'd mow more often, but with gas/diesel over $4/gallon I'll only cut twice this year. (Glad I don't live in the EU).

Maybe a disc mower would work better? Don't rocks really screw those machines up though?

 

[leonz]

Flail mowers are fine for brush mowing
the operating speed you select is the
issue and you can back up and mow
over a spot if desired.

like anything else the longer you let
it go the longer it will take to mow
and it all depends on the end use of
the land.

You can mow quickly with a flailmower
when the brush is dead in the very late fall
and knock it all the way to the sod easily.


A disc mower will have the same issues as a
rotary cutter and you will have a lot fuel left
behind that may create more fuel for brush fires.


If you do not like the Ford 917 when operating at the
540 rpm engine speed(where it should be operated anyway)
some one else will buy it from you as large flail mowers
of this size approach $7-9000.00 U.S.D. new.

You have to keep a flail mower at The 540 R.P.M., P.T.O.
speed in order to cut well otherwise it will bog down the
mower and wad the belts over time.

Be sure to buy the Kevlar belts for it from NAPA or TSC or KAMAN
or Mcmaster Carr or others as the bellts will need to be replaced do
to ozone damage. Be sure to remove the belts before winter and
put them in a big ziplock bag to protect them from ozone degradation.


You will not be out that much money with new knives and
V belts and it will mow well also.

You just have to grease it with 4-7 pumps while mowing
every 4 hours or shorter and be sure to grease the fittings
and bearings behind the belt cover as well as the propeller
shaft U joint and the open bearing(s).

Be sure to grease the rear roller if this model has zerks and open end bearings
on the rear roller.

 

[LD1]

I don't think anything is worn out on the bush hog. This has happened to at least two others we've owned. I understand what you're saying about everything being tight, but if you clobber a 9" tall rock, the blade(s) can only go in one direction as you ride over the stone, and that's up. They go up and slap the top of the deck. We don't have rocky fields for the most part, but there are some if you get them just right (tractor is going up, forcing the bush hog down), then it'll happen. Most the good rocks are marked.

anyhow, what I'm hearing though is that a flail mower won't handle tall grass? What about what the state boys use for the sides of the road? They seem to go through some tall/nasty stuff without any issues...

I'd mow more often, but with gas/diesel over $4/gallon I'll only cut twice this year. (Glad I don't live in the EU).

Maybe a disc mower would work better? Don't rocks really screw those machines up though?

I'd probabally just consider moving them 9" rocks out of your pasture instead of letting the BH take a beating everytime because you "forgot" where they were

 

[greasemonkeyok]

Anyone here have experience with a flail mower going over 9" rocks?

I don't, but looking at a ruler it seems to me the flail is going to have problems with a rock that tall also.

You need some sort of bar to hang on the front-end loader with a bell to warn that a big rock is coming through.

 

[leonz]

Thats the great thing about flail mowers, you can break a few knives
and not cause any damage to the rotor if you hit a rock.


Our mutual friend Iron Horse has the perfect set up for his
work in Australia; he has a landscape rake attached to the
either the front or under the belly of his prime mover
-a row crop tractor to grab anything before it gets to the
tractors underside or the flail mower.

He has posted pictures of his unit here also as well as
the jungl type of brush he deals with.

 

[Dustin]

I'd probabally just consider moving them 9" rocks out of your pasture instead of letting the BH take a beating everytime because you "forgot" where they were

I wish we could. We dug all around just one of them and we could never move it. It was a granite chunk larger than the tractor itself. Just the tips of these things are sticking up. If I had a jackhammer, I'd consider breaking off what sticks above ground. No place to rent heavy equipment around here though.

 

[greasemonkeyok]

I feel your pain - we have the same problem with sandstone. You see this small tip of the iceberg and think "I have a tractor and that irritant is soon to be banished." Ninety minutes later when you see just how big the rest of the rock is, you begin to think about how much dirt you moved just to find out you can't budge the whole thing.

What about taking an old brush hog and replacing the blades and stump-jumper with a large circular plate with carbide teeth welded to the bottom side. A stump grinder for rocks so to speak. Anyone have any experience with this?

Sorry about the hijack of the thread if this post qualifies as a hijack.

 

[leonz]

I would venture to bet that granite boulders like that
would interest a more than a few stone cutters artists
and lanscapers and I bet it would be worth an add on
craigs list and phone call or two to a local university
and its arts department to see if anyone would want
them as the granite you have is just as valuable as
quarried stone(just easier to get).