Concealed Carry and Consequences

[Farmwithjunk]

What most people, I feel, don't think about when they get a carry permit.. is that.. once you have it.. and are carrying.. you have to make some choices. Those choices may or may not always keep you out of danger.. in some case. that may elevate your level of danger ( IE when coming to someone else's aid.. ). You have to be ready to make the choice and get off the 'fence' when the time comes. Also.. there will be times when it is still better to do nothing.. even if you are armed.

Soundguy

BINGO.....

As I was reading down through the latest posts, I was thinking almost the same exact words. Guns put most people on the defensive. Some people believe a good defense is a strong offense. The presence of a gun can (and will) take things to the next level.

I'm a lifelong NRA member who owns several guns. No issue with ownership. My issue with MOST of the people carrying guns today is their perception of how a gun commands respect. They DON'T in the eyes of MOST people. Most folks consider them (and the person carrying) a threat. Perception is often far greater than reality.

I carry a S&W 357. I doubt you'll find 5 people who know me that could tell you where it is, or that I even have it with me. People who I'd consider not to be a threat don't need to know I have it. A threat would be better prepared against me if they knew I had it and where it is.

 

[Soundguy]

Be aware that if you fire your weapon in self defense, you will be charged with Attempted murder and jailed. Your weapon will be taken and you will be marked as violent. The DA will review the case and the charges may or may not be persued. The political climate usually will weigh heavily on the outcome.
Before you display a weapon, think about other courses of action and rule them ALL out. Remember, if it can be proved that you did not practice avoidance and retreat then you will most likley go to prison.

Your comments are extremely myopic. Find a copy of any of the 3-4 NRA magazine publications and read the 'armed citizen' section. Pretty much 2 pages of news accounts of honest citizens using their firearm to defend themselfs.

Also.. your info may only be true for your locale. ( IE.. gun laws will be different state to state.. ) For instance.. in Florida.. we no longer have a 'duty' to turn our backs on a criminal and run.. thus exposing us to even more risk. We can stand our ground and defend ourselves if we are in a place that we would ordinarrily be allowd to be at.

Soundguy

 

[Slacker]

Your comments are extremely myopic. Find a copy of any of the 3-4 NRA magazine publications and read the 'armed citizen' section. Pretty much 2 pages of news accounts of honest citizens using their firearm to defend themselfs.

Also.. your info may only be true for your locale. ( IE.. gun laws will be different state to state.. ) For instance.. in Florida.. we no longer have a 'duty' to turn our backs on a criminal and run.. thus exposing us to even more risk. We can stand our ground and defend ourselves if we are in a place that we would ordinarrily be allowd to be at.
Soundguy

Myopic you say? OK, I'll admit to being short sighted and long winded- but never at the same time ;-)

Soundguy and Dan, I honestly think if a legitimate self defense shooting occurs in my town today, the ccw holder will be charged with a crime. It may be "discharging a weapon within city limits", "going armed to the terror of the public" or whatever else the LEO's can muster to keep the person in custody until the DA can review the circumstances.
I don't think John Q Lawdog would let the CCW holder walk without some kind of charge. It may be dropped by the DA after consideration, or it may not. Its impossible to fire a weapon within the town of Durham without breaking some kind of law. I can't back this up with specific examples, but knowing the local DA and LEO attitudes I would almost bet the farm charges would be filed.
My point is this: if you break leather and take a life to save your own be prepared to pay one way or the other. You will be scrutinized beyond what you thought was possible. Everything from the type of ammo you used to the training you have received to the type of holster you drew from will be examined.
Remember the ccw holder who carried his own reloads? He shot a person in self defense. Guess what picture the DA painted for the jury? Evil man creating extra bad bullets in his "reloading laboratory" shot poor thug causing undo suffering.
In reality he used Speer gold dots over a few grains of Vita, same load that is commercially called Speer Lawman- but the jury doesn't know the difference.

 

[Harvster]

This is from Claytoncramer.com in the self defense blog section: Durham, North Carolina From the Durham Herald-Sun of October 21, 2005 City closes illegal nightclub Authorities have ordered the closing of an illegal night spot where a robber was killed in a basement shootout a week ago, but no charges have been filed against the club operators or the man who killed the armed intruder. Durham Police Detective S.W. Vaughan said the multi-faceted probe is exploring, among other elements, whether gambling or other illegal activities were taking place at the club, operated by Daryl Taylor from the basement of the Holloway Service Store. The retail and grocery store at 1505 Holloway St. is owned by James L. and Joanne Boyette, who were issued an order from the City/County Planning Department to close the club on Tuesday. Attempts to obtain comments from James Boyette were not successful. The gun recovered from the slain 18-year-old, Brandon Brown of Lynn Road, is being traced for links to other crimes, Vaughan said, because Brown was only 18 and the legal age for a person to have a permit for a gun in North Carolina is 21. Police cited witness accounts that Brown entered the private club armed with a gun, then threatened and robbed 38-year-old patron Michael Henderson. When Brown turned and threatened to shoot other patrons, Henderson drew his concealed gun and fired two shots, injuring Brown's hand, police said. At that point Brown began firing random shots in several directions, and Henderson returned fire with fatal results, police said. Vaughan said Henderson had a permit for his weapon.

 

[texasjohn]

Interesting stories... and I appreciate them... comments from real experiences. I can see the need, although rare, as evidenced by Luby's, recent events, etc.

I've been considering getting a ccw permit but have hesitated because I'm uncertain how uncomfortable it is to carry a pistol hidden. (I know, it's uncomfortable getting shot, too) I assume that it would have to be in a holster between the beltband and my skin since in Texas it is almost always too hot to be wearing a coat. Also, wouldn't it have to be worn in front? Seems to me that on the side would hit a hip bone. And to the rear would be hard to sit down and lean back.

Anybody have comments on that? Where do you wear your weapon?

 

[972500]

being only 18 most people would see me and think i dont know the first thing about guns. but ive actully been shooting seens i was 5 so suprisingly i do know. in fact when i was 14 it was just my brother and mother and i at home cause dads a truck driver. i had just went to bed and mom and brother were watching tv in the living room, i hear and window shater (just like in the security company commercals). i grab my 9mm next to my bed and head to teh top of hte steps. mom and brother just hit the top step as i get htere so i know its clear down stairs, cept for whoever isnt supposed to be there. guard the steps for the few seconds it take my brother to get his 45 and get back there. we head down the steps and i turn the corner at the bottom, rooms clear. brother and i go to clear second room and theres 2 guys with shotguns standing there. brother and i both yelled drop the weapons, like dad who used to be a cop trained us too. it must have startled the intruders cause they raised thier guns and my brother and im both double tapped them, each takin our side. the guy i shot died instanly due to being on blood thiners. my brother and i actually kept the other guy alive till the medics got there and he survived even though both lungs were punctured. suprisingly neither of us were ever arrested or on trial or antyhing like that because we were minors with our mother so they didnt even question the self defense. and what everyone is saying about it changing u, well ya it did but i dont feel bad for it cause i know i would have gotten shot and god knows what would ahve happend to my mother. so thats my story just thought i would share it.
Mark

 

[weldingisfun]

I carry religiously, drawn it a couple of times but never had to use it.
Odds of ever needing it are rare, but I can't think of anything worse than sitting in a Luby's eating with your family when some nut cuts loose and murders them before your eyes. Or attending class when some nut cuts loose. I probably have a better chance of winning the lotto than ever needing to use a gun, but I would die a thousand deaths if a situation arose and I lost a loved one because I was helpless to protect them.

There it is. No one could have ever spoken my own thoughts better than what RedRocker did. No one will ever harm my wife or one of my family and walk away unscathed if I am still breathing.

TexasJohn, Take a look at this Concealment Holsters and I think you will find what you want. I have the Deep Concealment model. Just buy your shirts a little larger than normal and no one will ever know you are carrying. And, as you already know, in Texas, you are breaking the law if you have a CHL and your weapon is visible. That wasn't for your benefit friend, it was for those guys who think we get a CHL to feel superior. They'll never undersatnd, but we are obligated to try and help them anyway.

 

[Soundguy]

All I can say is that I'm glad i don't live in your communist city/town/state... I like it here in fl... the rights are still 'for' the law abiding citizen.. at least for the time being..

Soundguy

Myopic you say? OK, I'll admit to being short sighted and long winded- but never at the same time ;-)

Soundguy and Dan, I honestly think if a legitimate self defense shooting occurs in my town today, the ccw holder will be charged with a crime. It may be "discharging a weapon within city limits", "going armed to the terror of the public" or whatever else the LEO's can muster to keep the person in custody until the DA can review the circumstances.
I don't think John Q Lawdog would let the CCW holder walk without some kind of charge. It may be dropped by the DA after consideration, or it may not. Its impossible to fire a weapon within the town of Durham without breaking some kind of law. I can't back this up with specific examples, but knowing the local DA and LEO attitudes I would almost bet the farm charges would be filed.
My point is this: if you break leather and take a life to save your own be prepared to pay one way or the other. You will be scrutinized beyond what you thought was possible. Everything from the type of ammo you used to the training you have received to the type of holster you drew from will be examined.
Remember the ccw holder who carried his own reloads? He shot a person in self defense. Guess what picture the DA painted for the jury? Evil man creating extra bad bullets in his "reloading laboratory" shot poor thug causing undo suffering.
In reality he used Speer gold dots over a few grains of Vita, same load that is commercially called Speer Lawman- but the jury doesn't know the difference.

 

[Soundguy]

Actually.. small of the back is one of my favorite carry places for my sig p230 and bromeland paddle holster. Tucks in neatly.

. And to the rear would be hard to sit down and lean back.

Anybody have comments on that? Where do you wear your weapon?

 

[Kendall69]

A gun can protect you in many ways without killing someone.

My gun has saved me from four "potential" bad incidents. Two just by showing the gun the trouble was eliminated.

Always keep th first shot as a blank black powder, in my gun. I know it's a blank, which does two things, one - I use it as a "take notice" shot, all I want is the noise. Number two, if the first shot is ever an accident then no problem, you will only get burned. If a real bad guy or Bear is charging me then I fire two shots instantly, one a blank and milliseconds after the blank the real deal.

Anybody that hags around after the first shot is not going to get a second warning.

Living out in the boonies one night my dog was going nuts, and it sounded different than other times, so I cracked the window and listened, then I heard heavy rocks being thrown at the dog to shut him up from the other side of the fence. I shot off a blank round in the air and the next thing I heard was two guys screaming "OK WERE LEAVING" - we'll never know what would have happened, but I do know nothing DID happen.
Same situation in the boonies camping, while someone was messing with the door handle of the camper - again a shot off through a window, and feet scampering and screaming OK OK OK in the dark, and a large crash, obviously they couldn't see in the dark - nothing happened that night either.
I can honestly say I averted some serious trouble in my life by having a weapon.

And as far as the persecutor etc. Etc. - the saying I'd rather be judged by 12 than carried by six is quite apropos