Creating a Lake

[EddieWalker]

Vern,

Looking at the pictures and reading of your goals, I have to admit that it's more then just a bit overwhelming. I agree that the pond needs to be cleared out and dug down in the middle, but having dug and moved four acres of dirt when creating Lake Marabou, I know it's doable. Just a matter of time and money.

You probably don't know what your budget is yet, but even in your wildest estimates, it will be more. The good thing that might keep you sane in knowing that whatever you buy, you will be able to sell for close to the same amount when you are done. I keep telling myself this all the time!!!!! hahaha

I see two ways of doing this, and both have their pros and cons. Getting a trackhoe, dump truck and small dozer is one way. Getting across to the middle would be simple enough with those machines and then it's just a matter of digging, loading, dumping and spreading. With wet material, you might have some drying issues, but the good thing is that it will compact better if you keep working it with the moisture in the soil. The dam is also kind of thin in my opinion and a good location to add material to the sides. This will kill the trees and plants growing on the dam, but they shouldn't be there anyway. Roots have a habbit of working their way through a dam. Sometimes while alive, but always after they die, the roots will rot away and you will have a tunnel for water to work it's way through the dam. Adding material the the outside of the dam after the trees are gone would eliminate this from ever being an issue in the future. The downside is that it's going to be expensive to buy all three pieces of equipment. You can easily run each piece of equipment yourself, I've moved thousands of yards with just my backhoe and 5 yard dump truck. It's just a matter of time and keeping everything running.

The other way, and maybe the cheaper way, would be to buy a big dozer with a straight blade. Something in the D6, 200hp range that can handle 7 yards or more of dirt at a time. Take out the dam at the lowest point and let it dry out. Then take out everything on the dam down to bare dirt and push it far, far away. Then do the same thing inside the pond. Now it's just a matter of time, fuel and maintenance to push the dirt out of the middle. You can build up the house pad with most of the dirt, but then add to the dam with it too. Just keep pushing until it's all out of there. The drawback to this is that a big machine is either expensive, or a project to keep running. Getting it stuck would also be a big concern, especially when you first start messing around with it.

My dozer isn't the best choice for digging a pond since it's blade is also for finish work and grading. I probably could have had it done twice as fast with the right dozer, but then I wouldn't be able to grade my roads and pads with it. With the right dozer and the time to do it full time, you should be able to get it done in less then a year depending on the weather and breakdowns. T

Be sure to start a new thread when you get started. As you've seen from this thread, there's allot of interest in creating ponds here.

Eddie

 

[EddieWalker]

1$ a yard ?
That seems high.

I agree, but when I got to figuring out how many yards I was moving with my dump truck and how much I was spending on fuel for the dozer, backhoe and dumptruck in the same day, it was fairly close. This was over the summer and at the peak of the fuel prices. I was also moving the dirt a pretty good distance across my land, so I wasn't moving as much dirt in a day as I did while on just the dozer and pushing the dirt up onto the dam.

For basic figuring and getting a budget, I'd use that $1 a yard number for planing. If you do it for less, that's awesome, but if you figure on doing it for less, then don't be suprised if you go over your budget.

Eddie

 

[john_bud]

I agree, but when I got to figuring out how many yards I was moving with my dump truck and how much I was spending on fuel for the dozer, backhoe and dumptruck in the same day, it was fairly close. This was over the summer and at the peak of the fuel prices. I was also moving the dirt a pretty good distance across my land, so I wasn't moving as much dirt in a day as I did while on just the dozer and pushing the dirt up onto the dam.

For basic figuring and getting a budget, I'd use that $1 a yard number for planing. If you do it for less, that's awesome, but if you figure on doing it for less, then don't be suprised if you go over your budget.

Eddie

Fingers in ears


LALAALALALALALA I can't hear you LALALALLAAALLAA



Sometimes it's better to not know....

 

[EddieWalker]

Sometimes it's better to not know....

John,

I agree. If I knew beforhand what I was getting into, I don't know if I would have made the same decisions that I did. In the end, it came out better then I'd ever hoped for, but I had no clue as to what it would end up costing me, how long it would take or how much effort it would be.

It's like hunting in Alaska. It's the most miserable experience that I've been through on a hunting trip. Every day is pure torchure and a test of what you can endure. Then after you get home, you can't wait to go again.

I have another spot picked out for my next pond, but I'm waiting to see if I need the dirt or not. I have two pretty big quarry sites right now for dirt and will only dig it if I need the dirt. I want to dig it, but then again, I don't.

As for the price, I'm in total denial on that one and don't know if I'll ever add up the receipts. I honestly don not want to know what I put into it. Of course, it's worth every penny, and ALLOT MORE, but I know it was also very expensive too.

Eddie

 

[3RRL]

It's hard to put a price tag on self satisfaction.
I think that's the driving force that causes each of us to buy tractors, implements, cars, watches, guns etc. to the level we do. I know there are a lot of things I build or fix up that become more expensive, but yet I still do it all the time. Why?
Like John said, sometimes it's better not to know...

 

[vpond]

Looking at Nebraska test lab results, these machines can burn some serious fuel.
NE Tractor Test Publications

Eddie
Thanks for the advice.
Started reviewing equipment specifications.
Hadn't thought about trees on the outer bank before.
The bushes and trees growing back on the banks front side are a real problem. Roundup will kill stumps but don't know if roundup may affect the fish. Is there anything that can kill the small trees and bushes without harming the water life?

Widening the bank sounds good and will also provide a safer tractor path. Due to property lines (yellow lines) some banks must be widened on the pond side.

We are planning on the lake being a longer term retirement project, taking 3 to 5 yr. Hot summers are reserved for RV traveling/vacationing (north) maybe even Alaska. Let the snakes have a summer feast. Hopefully a sun burn

Thanks for all the points, helps me improve our plans.

Still trying to get over some bad food or bug.

Vern

 

[EddieWalker]

Here's a few pictures that Steph took of the pond during a nice sunset. She really enjoys taking pictures and of course, I love going for walks with her on our land while she takes those pictures!!!! Having Lake Marabou has really changed our lives and added to the enjoyment of living on our land to a degree that's beyond measuring.

Hope you like the pics!!!

Edddie

 

[denmansoft]

There really is something magical about the Sun on the horizon over the water. I'm glad we didn't have to build our own lake but would be tempted to if we didn't have the salty kind right there.
In the summer we get some neat displays. I like this one with the dun dogs and vapour trails.

This time of year the sun sets behind the ridge and trees and we only get to watch sunrises.


Ian

 

[philbuilt]

Very nice pictures !!!!!

 

[farmboy12]

Is this the longest thread?

 

[EddieWalker]

Ian,

Beautiful pictures. Your views are amazing!!

Phil,

Thanks. How's the pond coming along? You still digging?

Kyle,

Yes, it's probably the longest lasting thread on TBN. I just keep adding to it when something interesting comes up. I still have three significant projects that I'll be doing to the lake that I feel are important before I'll call it done. There are also some other things that I need to do to fix a few problems and finish off the last part of the dam.

Eddie

 

[denmansoft]

You're costing me money Eddie....
No I'm not going to buy a dozer or dump truck but,
I just got my stealth-cam so I can see what really roams around our property.
I'll post some pics on your other thread 'things we see on our land'...

 

[weldingisfun]

God sure came up with a beautiful way to end a day. Thanks for letting us all see how He did it at your places.

 

[jinman]

Eddie and Ian, those are some nice shots. We sure see some nice sunsets here too. The ones over the water that include a reflection are always the most spectacular.

Eddie, I've got to ask you a question about your lake. When you bought that acreage, the pond area was a big swamp that drained into the creek. Now, your lake catches gallons and gallons of water that used to flow down the creek. What do you think was the effect downstream of your building a lake that catches a lot of the surge flow on the creek? Have you ever talked to neighbors downstream to see if they notice a difference?

Many years ago I needed to do some repair work on a dam in Denton, Tx that was being destroyed by trees and beavers. There was a natural runoff ditch (just a muddy swale) going across our property and the neighbor's property before going into a city creek. We had been in a dought and I didn't even think about the downstream effects. I cut the pond dam using a backhoe and drained the contents of a 100' x 60' x 5' deep pond. The water just gushed out of the pond and ran down the swale like a 1' deep tsunami. My brother and I laughed at the beavers as they tried to dam up the cut in the dam. Somewhere, I have pictures of two beavers frantically carrying logs to the opening while we were standing not more than 10' away.

As the pond emptied its last gallons, my brother left and headed for home. When he got home, he called to tell me that he had witnessed a funny sight on the way home. The city had a repair crew doing some work in the bottom of that creek and they had to abandon the job because they suddenly were standing in water a foot deep. My draining the pond had flooded their project. Oops! Don't you know those guys were surprised when that dry creek suddenly had a foot of water rushing down it? I guess I should have checked, but I never even thought about it.

 

[EddieWalker]

Jim,

While I'm holding ten million gallons of water when full, I'm also shedding more water when it rains from the land I've cleared. In allot of areas, if you clear the land, it is required by law that you create a catch basin to handle the increased water shed. Trees hold allot of water, grass sheds it. The amount of water that I'm adding to the runoff is beyond my calculations, and since I'm still a farm, not commercial, I don't fall under those rules. Of those RV Parks that I've been to that had to create a catch basin, it's big money to figure this out and build the tank large enough to hold that water, then slowly let it drain into the creek as to not affect it's flow significantly. Basicaly it's a big hole that they dig and put a certain sized culvert in it to drain out the water. The size of the culvert determines how much water will drain and how fast. The ones that I saw all had 12 inch culverts in them, but I only saw this at a few RV Parks. They did the same thing at the new Lowes in Lindale, near my place, but I never looked to see what sized pipe they used. Of course, that's a paved parking lot, so it's gonna shed even more water.

In my case, I sort of did the same thing. I'm catching the increased water shed in my pond. When the pond is full, I'm not able to catch all the water, but I still have several feet of dam height that holds water as it drains through the spillway. At four acres of surface water, I'm holding a fair amount. If it came to figuring it out, I wouldn't have a clue as to how much or what effect it has, but I am catching some and slowly letting it drain into the creek. The concern is in dumping more water into the creek and causing damage downstream. But again, as a farm, it's perfectly legal to clear the land and turn it into a pasture without creating a catch basin, even though that pasture adds to the water shed and potential damage caused by increasing the amount of water that goes through the creek.

The creek flows pretty much year round, but during the second year of the drought, it did stop flowing, but still had pools of water in it.

If my dam ever failed, I would expect it to add some water to the drainage, but since most of the water is dug into the ground, I would only be dumping about a quarter of the water into the creek or less, depending on where the dam failed. The only time I would expect it to fail would be after a very significant rain that caused major flooding. It would have to be something that wore away the sides of the dam over a period of time. When it's flooded in the past, the water comes up to the dam, but there is no flow along the dam. It's perfectly calm, but rushing along in the midddle where the creek is. I didn't expect this, but was relieved to see it. If it did break during one of these floods, I don't think it would add any measurable amount of water to the flooding. Tens of millions of gallons are flowing by every minute, it's an amount of water that is really beyond my ability to calculate.

That's a funny story about the dam in Denton. I wonder how ofter that happens to those guys doing work on bridges? I'm sure they have some good stories to tell!!!!

Eddie

 

[philbuilt]

Eddie,
Any progress? Ha Ha Ha
__________________
My Goals for 2008

1. Fishing and Hunting with my kids.
2. Build my storage Shed.
3. Put my outside access bathroom together.
4. Fence in a quarter acre for Turkeys.
5. Build my gazebo for my front pasture.
6. Finish back pasture and plant it in Bermuda.
7. Start my food plots.
8. Build a comfortable deer stand for two.
9. Build a wood burning fireplace in my home.
10. New flooring in my home.
11. Build a pasture sprayer.
12. Get my old jeep running.

Phil

 

[EddieWalker]

Hey Phil,

Done allot of fishing and hunting, so that's good. The shed has the footings dug and the forms are almost done, but I just don't seem to get around to finishing them. The bathroom ran into a snag on the design. I just can't made up my mind on some of it. I abandonded the turkey plan after meeting with a biologist and PHD who's working on it. They pretty much convinced against it. The gazebo isn't getting anywhere. The pasture is done and planted, so that's done. Food plots are growing and looking good. The deer stand should be done in a few weeks and usable for Thanksgiving. The fireplace and wood floors will start after Christmas. We have it planned out and have decided on what we want, it's just a matter of waiting until the holidays are over to start. We're also tiling the kitchen, hall and changing the tile in the bathroom. I just bought a 275 gallong tank for my sprayer, so that's a start on that. The jeep project is officially dead. After six years, I just don't have any interest in working on it. I've started giving parts of it away and will scrap the rest of it.

Thanks for asking.

Eddie

 

[philbuilt]

Eddie,
congrats on taking the time to hunt and fish. Life seems to come fast and taking time to slow down and enjoy just seems impossible at times . My favorite time was the evenings that I could get down to the pond and feed the fish and just stare at the water it's just settling. I did by some kayaks but only was able to get out 2 times.Maybe next summer I will find the time. I still enjoy all the postings on this site.
Phil

 

[FortClatsop]

Thanks for asking him Phil. And thanks for answering him Eddie. Reading Eddie's goals has been both inspiring and guilt provoking. I used to put pen to paper more often and write stuff like that down. I have made several time management changes this year and I have started looking at some of my projects like Eddie's goals. I am making progress and am enjoying some things more. There is a lot of good stuff, and good people, on this site. I seem to learn something every time I read it. Thanks for sharing.

This morning when my wife opened the bedroom shades there were 50 elk in our lower field next to the slough (I wish I had a pond). It made her morning to watch them.

Five years ago that swampy bog was blackberries and scrub trees 10-15 feet high. As little as three years ago the steep slope down to it was covered in brush and limbs. Two weeks ago it was three feet deep with a seasonal flood. The other day there were hawks hunting it.

Sometimes it seems like were not getting anything done. Then one morning we open the shades and behold the beauty that is right outside the window. Keep it up.

 

[hobie]

Eddie, I'm new here, and have surfed around a little exploring the site. Gotta say I love the "Projects" threads! You are an absolute inspiration! I already read this entire thread, as well as the one about the driveway/fence/lights/sign, and the one about Rob's barn and house. I can't imagine working on the scale you do. Really do enjoy seeing your accomplishments. Since Steph is such a good shot, I have to ask who does the cooking? I would think one of those boars would make quite a few fine meals! Love seeing pics of the kids in the paradise you created. I feel I had a very privileged childhood, my folks bought a barn on 5 acres, and turned it into a house as they had kids. We had a nice 1 acre pond a stone's throw away, and 3 acres on a saltwater "river" an hour drive from there. Spent a lot of time in, and on the water. The barn is someone's mansion, but there is a small house we built on the river now. Thanks for sharing. Brian