Educate me on having cattle

[kenmac]

Right now is a bad time to get into cattle farming in TX. Hay is at an all time high, rain is at a low (although in the last month we have been getting some reprieve). Fertilizer is at an all time high. Beef per pound at the market is quite low. Steel is very expensive right now, so a pen and squeeze chute system will be a premium. Its near a perfect storm.

My advice is to keep enough cows to build the herd back up after you get some experience. Bull, maybe 6-10 additional females. Sell the rest.

we too have had very little rain. Had a little saturday but that's the first we have had in about two months. I really wouldn't call what we had saturday as rain.
My pond for watering cattle is down about 8 ft.
I sure hope we have a rainy winter season.

I will also advise him to be careful around those cattle. He may be a stranger to them, and it don't take much for a 1200# mama cow to hurt you accidently !

 

[EddieWalker]

I'm leaning strongly towards getting rid of over half of them. I like the idea of selling all the Herford bulls and steer. Then getting rid of some of the cows. I think that if I keep six cows and the Angus bull, I should have a good starter herd. I also think that the six that I keep will all be pregnant, which should increase the size of the herd quickly.

Thursday I'm going to see if I can talk to somebody at the Livestock Exchange. I doubt that I can make anything happen by this weekend, but I'm hoping that I can get things started.

This picture shows a fenced in area of about 50x50 that I've been feeding the cattle some 20% Creep. They come a running when they see me. They are very easy to get into this pen!!!

 

[Jchonline]

I'm leaning strongly towards getting rid of over half of them. I like the idea of selling all the Herford bulls and steer. Then getting rid of some of the cows. I think that if I keep six cows and the Angus bull, I should have a good starter herd. I also think that the six that I keep will all be pregnant, which should increase the size of the herd quickly.

Thursday I'm going to see if I can talk to somebody at the Livestock Exchange. I doubt that I can make anything happen by this weekend, but I'm hoping that I can get things started.

This picture shows a fenced in area of about 50x50 that I've been feeding the cattle some 20% Creep. They come a running when they see me. They are very easy to get into this pen!!!

View attachment 769597

Not only that, but you get experience on a smaller scale. Looking after calves is time consuming. Much better to have 6 than 20 your first year doing it.

 

[MossRoad]

.... They come a running when they see me. They are very easy to get into this pen!!!

Reminds me of every time we go to a zoo. The animals are standing around not doing much, then someone in a green shirt walks by and they all follow that person. They know who feeds them.

 

[OldMcDonald]

I think that if I keep six cows and the Angus bull, I should have a good starter herd. I also think that the six that I keep will all be pregnant, which should increase the size of the herd quickly.

You cannot justify keeping a bull for 6 cows. Why do you say it will be a good starter herd? You are going to produce crossbred calves from a bull of very doubtful quality. As I already posted, he is all front end and no back end. Definitely not what an AA should look like. Apart from sentimental reasons why do you want to keep such an animal? Have a look at the AA website www.aberdeen-angus.co.uk to see what an AA bull looks like. On this tiny island of Mainland Orkney there are several herds of outstanding AA. Worth a visit for anyone interested in the breed. Anybody arriving on a cruise ship can walk west for a few hundred yards and see a big number of excellent cows and calves grazing - subject to the time of year.

From what you posted it seems you intend to breed any heifers from that AA/Her cross. Again, as already posted, you are looking years ahead - and it is not unfair to call such second crosses mongrels. It most definitely is not a way to increase the size of the herd "quickly".

What bull are you going to use on them? You cannot use their father, and you cannot just keep the existing half dozen cows and breed from them for the next 10 years or so. That would probably reduce the size of the herd "quickly". If your intention is to run down the herd to no cattle, then go ahead as you posted. When do you cull the cows? When do you sell the bull? How old is the bull? How old are the cows?

The cows look good from the photographs. Why not put them to a Hereford bull and really have "a good starter herd"? Surely there is some availability of AI in your area? You get to breed your cows to the best of bulls. Hereford is not my favourite breed, but that is what I had in Australia because that is what sold best in the saleyards within a 100mile radius. You ask for advice, you get advice, but the final decision is yours. I am firmly of the opinion that what you have decided to do will end up with you having poor quality mixed breed cattle that will be of doubtful sale value.

 

[kenmac]

I wish I were close to me. I would buy those herefords. I love my herefords.
They're pretty easy to handle compared to the others I've had.


I don't know about your area but Black, or black baldy cows, steers sell for more than anything else at the stock yards here.

If you are selling private, you can get more for registered stuff but not at the stock yards here. they couldn't care less about that sheet of paper.

Here, If they're selling for 1.30 per# the one with papers will also sell for 1.30 per #

 

[EddieWalker]

You cannot justify keeping a bull for 6 cows. Why do you say it will be a good starter herd? You are going to produce crossbred calves from a bull of very doubtful quality. As I already posted, he is all front end and no back end. Definitely not what an AA should look like. Apart from sentimental reasons why do you want to keep such an animal? Have a look at the AA website www.aberdeen-angus.co.uk to see what an AA bull looks like. ...

What bull are you going to use on them? You cannot use their father, and you cannot just keep the existing half dozen cows and breed from them for the next 10 years or so. ...

You bring up some great points that I hadn't considered. All I know about the Angus bull is what they neighbors have said, and they are telling me what my brother said to them. My brother was an alcoholic that never knew what he was talking about and never finished anything he started. Even worse, if he got something wrong, he would double down on it over admitting his mistake.

The neighbors told me it was a great bull that my brother paid $3,500 for. Now that I'm thinking about it, odds are very good that he made up what he paid for the bull, and he just lied to them to act like a big shot.

I'm guilty of believing what they told me, and not knowing anything about cattle. Thinking about this, I don't see any reason to keep the bull. I've been struggling to figure out where to keep him, and how to separate him from the cows on my place. That's just more work that I don't need to deal with, and another mouth to feed that isn't going to do anything for me in return.

I appreciate your honesty and willingness to be blunt.

 

[EddieWalker]

Now I'm questioning what cows to keep? What should I be looking for in deciding which ones are better then the others? Younger seems like it would be better then older. How do I know their age without papers? Is bigger better, or is their an "ideal" size? Any characteristics to look for that would be bad?

I was thinking that I would keep the ones that are most obviously pregnant. My thinking is that they are proven breeders, and I won't have to deal with breeding them for awhile. Good or bad logic?

Since I don't have any facilities to deal with cattle yet at my place, and my brother never built any at his place, am I opening a can of worms in having calves sooner then later?

 

[dieselscout80]

The first calf from a heifer (we called them 1st calf heifer) can have more birthing problems at than the second time around.

 

[ponytug]

Now I'm questioning what cows to keep? What should I be looking for in deciding which ones are better then the others? Younger seems like it would be better then older. How do I know their age without papers? Is bigger better, or is their an "ideal" size? Any characteristics to look for that would be bad?

I was thinking that I would keep the ones that are most obviously pregnant. My thinking is that they are proven breeders, and I won't have to deal with breeding them for awhile. Good or bad logic?

Since I don't have any facilities to deal with cattle yet at my place, and my brother never built any at his place, am I opening a can of worms in having calves sooner then later?

If you don't have a local cattle expert that you trust, it might be worth having a vet stop for his/her $0.02 on which ones are "keepers". Our local brand inspector was very helpful when we started; she kept an eye out for the two breeds of cattle that we were looking for, and ensured that we didn't get strong armed out of the auction.

For a little perspective: you are looking at two of the most common types of beef cattle in the US. (Angus/Hereford) So, you could sell all of your brother's cattle, and buy back equivalent cattle quite easily. As noted above, cattle with and without papers go for the same $/lb. My point being, if your brother's cattle are forcing your hand in some way, sell them. At some point in the future, when you are ready, you will be able to easily buy the heifers / two year old cow-calf pairs / older cows / bull that you want. Keep a cow or two from your brother, if you want a memento; we still have the original two cows we bought in 2007. They may be old, but they are still calving and happy; we are happy to see them happy.

All the best,

Peter