ELECTRIC GRAPPLE

[bama7]

I have a JD 955 with the 70A Loader. I am thinking about getting an Electric Grapple. I would like some helpful comments on brands, cost. and durability. I don't want a hydraulic grapple. Thanks

 

[sea2summit]

I don't have any experience with an electric grapple but from the tractor side, I'd probably put in a separate battery for it to run off of then run a charger from your main battery charge the grapple's batter as SLI batteries don't like those kinds of loads and tractor alternators even less (running at low RPM most of the time etc).

 

[Midniteoyl]

Talks about a couple different ones: https://www.youtube.com/c/GoodWorksTractors/search?query=grapple

 

[bama7]

I found what I consider to be a good deal on a new Worksaver ESCG-48 Grapple. I was looking to buy a used one, but the guy sold it to someone else. More money maybe? I only have 2 1/2 acres and it will only be used for limbs and smaller tree debree and the like. My 70a Loader conversion should be here within two weeks. Really looking forward to getting some work done and enjoy my tractor more.

 

[LD1]

Whats the cost difference between one of them and a hydraulic grapple. How does the clamp force compare?

Everyone makes hydraulics out to be rocket science but its pretty simple. I'll stick with hydraulics....I just wonder about the long term longevity of one of those. ANd the repair cost if the linear actuator ever fails....it isnt gonna be a $100 generic cylinder you could go to TSC and be done

 

[bama7]

Whats the cost difference between one of them and a hydraulic grapple. How does the clamp force compare?

Everyone makes hydraulics out to be rocket science but its pretty simple. I'll stick with hydraulics....I just wonder about the long term longevity of one of those. ANd the repair cost if the linear actuator ever fails....it isnt gonna be a $100 generic cylinder you could go to TSC and be done

Cost would totally depend upon which one will do what you need it to do. There is also the cost for the 3rd function kit as well as time/cost needed to install the kit. If you were using the grapple continually a hydraulic grapple, I am sure, would be the way to go. In my case the electric grapple should work just fine. The clamp pressure is 1000 lbs on the electric grapple. Clamp pressure for hydraulic grapples would be dependent upon the tractors pump and what else is being used at the same time. Will the hydraulic grapple curl, close, and lift at the same time? I don't know, but it would limit the clamp pressure I would think.

According to the owners manual there is a 6 month warrenty for the motor or 60 days when used for commercial use. The frame is warrented for 12 months.

 

[LD1]

With a 3rd function....$500 or less will set the hydraulics up and yes you "can" do all functions at once though in reality it is not really an issue. And you arent limited to just a grapple with the hydraulics. You can fun a front post hole digger, rotate the chute on a snow blower, angle a snow plow, run a little hydraulic pruning saw, 4n1 bucket, etc etc etc.

for me it would be cost. If id be into a electric grapple for more than $1500-$1800....its cheaper and better to go hydraulic.

I just hope it will do what you expect and not be a disappointment. Im just not a fan of linear actuators on anything, be it side-by-side dump boxes, SSQA attach pins, yard carts, etc. Just too many failure points and too expensive compared to hydraulics

 

[ericm979]

Typical CUT open center hydraulic systems don't do well at curling lifting and closing at the same time. But you don't really need that. I'm still running my grapple from a valve mounted on the fender close to the loader joystick. I can't close/open the grapple and move the loader at the same time, and I don't miss it much. I plan to make a 3rd function for it but it's not been a high enough priority to do it.

Linear actuators are slow compared to hydraulics. You'll get tired of waiting for the lids to open.

1000lbs is not a lot. I regularly pick up 2000lb+ logs that the loader can't curl. But I can still carry them with the grapple pointing down. The hydraulics will hold that. The clamping force does not change when I operate the loader.

 

[bama7]

I wasn't looking for comparisons to hydraulics. I was looking for helpful comments about the electric grapples on the market. Thanks for the opinions, but I plan to stay with the electric grapple.

 

[Sportsman762]

I do not have experience with electric grapple, but do have experience with electric actuators, and grapples. I will assume we are looking at the Worksaver electric grapple. If there are more on the market please post up. I find innovation interesting and an electric grapple is innovative. Below are my thoughts on an electric grapple. Since I am unaware of any other grapples other than the Worksaver I will use a hydraulic grapple as a comparison. There are plenty of posts on what people achieve with hydraulic grapples so you can calibrate your expectations of what can be achieved with a electric grapple.

The wire coming out of the linear actuator looks like it could be snagged easily, wires are not as durable as hydraulic hoses and should be protected better. The 5 seconds it takes to go from open to close is significantly slower than most hydraulic grapples <3 seconds. I would be concerned about the durability of the linear actuator. When grabbing from a pile it is not uncommon for the lid to come in contact with the brush, or log while the tractor is still moving forward, this might cause damage to the linear actuator as it is not going to be as strong as the hydraulic cylinders normally used. An electric actuator that is able to apply 1000 lbs of force is going to be weaker than a 2" cylinder used on compact grapples that can apply 6000 + lbs of force. If you are going to use the grapple much, there might be problems with the 30 amp requirements, as the John Deere 855 is only equipped with a 35 amp alternator. Most hydraulic grapples have a 1 year warranty on the entire unit, the Worksaver has a 1 year warranty on the grapple frame and clamp, but the linear actuator only has a 6 month warranty. The 2505834 replacement actuator is currently $894.55. Also if you let the grapple sit outside it might have issues with water intrusion, especially after getting bumped a few times by brush.

Now we are going to go into my qualitative opinion. The Achilles heel of an electric grapple is the linear actuator. It is darned light, and easy to damage. The manufacture realises this and has shortened the warranty due to the knowledge that it is the weak link. In addition it has significantly less capability (1,000 lbs) and speed than the alternatives in the market. I believe that the lack of responses from owners of electric grapples is because there are so few of them. Worksaver is a good company, and will stand behind their product, however I would not advise getting an electric grapple. I would get a hydraulic one, or one that does not require a third valve such as the Brush Crusher.

Universal skid steer brush crusher | Tractor Attachments | Westendorf

Browse the Universal skid steer brush crusher and other Brush Crusher in the Brush Crusher at Westendorf.

www.loaders.com

An electric grapple would work and might provide years of trouble free service, however the major weakness is darned expensive to repair, and the capabilities are a fraction of the alternatives limiting what you could do, for a similar or less cost.

 

[bama7]

I do not have experience with electric grapple, but do have experience with electric actuators, and grapples. I will assume we are looking at the Worksaver electric grapple. If there are more on the market please post up. I find innovation interesting and an electric grapple is innovative. Below are my thoughts on an electric grapple. Since I am unaware of any other grapples other than the Worksaver I will use a hydraulic grapple as a comparison. There are plenty of posts on what people achieve with hydraulic grapples so you can calibrate your expectations of what can be achieved with a electric grapple.

The wire coming out of the linear actuator looks like it could be snagged easily, wires are not as durable as hydraulic hoses and should be protected better. The 5 seconds it takes to go from open to close is significantly slower than most hydraulic grapples <3 seconds. I would be concerned about the durability of the linear actuator. When grabbing from a pile it is not uncommon for the lid to come in contact with the brush, or log while the tractor is still moving forward, this might cause damage to the linear actuator as it is not going to be as strong as the hydraulic cylinders normally used. An electric actuator that is able to apply 1000 lbs of force is going to be weaker than a 2" cylinder used on compact grapples that can apply 6000 + lbs of force. If you are going to use the grapple much, there might be problems with the 30 amp requirements, as the John Deere 855 is only equipped with a 35 amp alternator. Most hydraulic grapples have a 1 year warranty on the entire unit, the Worksaver has a 1 year warranty on the grapple frame and clamp, but the linear actuator only has a 6 month warranty. The 2505834 replacement actuator is currently $894.55. Also if you let the grapple sit outside it might have issues with water intrusion, especially after getting bumped a few times by brush.

Now we are going to go into my qualitative opinion. The Achilles heel of an electric grapple is the linear actuator. It is darned light, and easy to damage. The manufacture realises this and has shortened the warranty due to the knowledge that it is the weak link. In addition it has significantly less capability (1,000 lbs) and speed than the alternatives in the market. I believe that the lack of responses from owners of electric grapples is because there are so few of them. Worksaver is a good company, and will stand behind their product, however I would not advise getting an electric grapple. I would get a hydraulic one, or one that does not require a third valve such as the Brush Crusher.

Universal skid steer brush crusher | Tractor Attachments | Westendorf

Browse the Universal skid steer brush crusher and other Brush Crusher in the Brush Crusher at Westendorf.

www.loaders.com

An electric grapple would work and might provide years of trouble free service, however the major weakness is darned expensive to repair, and the capabilities are a fraction of the alternatives limiting what you could do, for a similar or less cost.

Yes the one I am looking at is the Worksaver. I don't know if it makes a difference, but I now have a 955 now. Maybe Jesus will come before the actuator gets torn to pieces. Thanks for the info.

 

[Fallon]

With a 3rd function....$500 or less will set the hydraulics up and yes you "can" do all functions at once though in reality it is not really an issue. And you arent limited to just a grapple with the hydraulics. You can fun a front post hole digger, rotate the chute on a snow blower, angle a snow plow, run a little hydraulic pruning saw, 4n1 bucket, etc etc etc.

for me it would be cost. If id be into a electric grapple for more than $1500-$1800....its cheaper and better to go hydraulic.

I just hope it will do what you expect and not be a disappointment. Im just not a fan of linear actuators on anything, be it side-by-side dump boxes, SSQA attach pins, yard carts, etc. Just too many failure points and too expensive compared to hydraulics

I 100% agree a linear actuator isn't appropriate for a grapple. However I think they are reasonable for things like power SSQA. I built a power SSQA setup before & it was $60-$160 total depending on which actuator I used. They are a lot cheaper than hydraulics if you don't have a 3rd function or spare valve. WAY cheaper if you don't have any hydraulics. Electrical wiring & switches are massively cheaper than hydraulic hose & valves.

Linear actuators won't be nearly as fast, strong or durable as hydraulics. But some applications like power SSQA don't need much force or speed.

I'm debating on going the electric route on my upcoming snowblower. I only have 1 spare QD on the rear. I either have to get a diverter setup on that spare QD to change between rotate & deflect, disconnect my top or side link. Or go with a linear actuator & motor. I feel all are viable options.

 

[k0ua]

My Hydraulic grapple lid will open or close in about than 1 second. It just depends on cylinder volume and flow rate of your pump. I have a single small cylinder and the flow rate of my Kioti is very high for the size of tractor it is. A little over 9 GPM. So it opens and closes with a bang. However since it is hydraulic it can also be easily feathered by the valve. Best of both worlds. I realize the OP wants an electric grapple with an electric actuator. I just don't really understand why.

I 100% agree a linear actuator isn't appropriate for a grapple. However I think they are reasonable for things like power SSQA. I built a power SSQA setup before & it was $60-$160 total depending on which actuator I used. They are a lot cheaper than hydraulics if you don't have a 3rd function or spare valve. WAY cheaper if you don't have any hydraulics. Electrical wiring & switches are massively cheaper than hydraulic hose & valves.

Linear actuators won't be nearly as fast, strong or durable as hydraulics. But some applications like power SSQA don't need much force or speed.

I'm debating on going the electric route on my upcoming snowblower. I only have 1 spare QD on the rear. I either have to get a diverter setup on that spare QD to change between rotate & deflect, disconnect my top or side link. Or go with a linear actuator & motor. I feel all are viable options.

I agree for a snow blower chute turner, for the SSQA hookup, Linear actuators seem like the way to go. For a grapple lid? Um.. not so much. Will work after a fashion, with all the drawbacks already given, but certainly not ideal.

 

[Vigo327]

The problem with electric actuators isn't really that they're electric actuators, it's that on vehicular applications we're always trying to run them off a tiny electrical system. Volts X Amps = Watts, 746 Watts = 1hp. Just to ballpark some stuff.. If you have a 35a alternator on a 12v charging system, the maximum work you can (continuously) do electrically on the front of your loader is less than taking a household space heater and putting it on its lowest setting and hanging that on your loader. Most small actuators are actually rated to use less than 30a, so we already know they are <500w devices when run on 12v. The main limitation there is just speed. One of the main concepts of tractors is that you can use a small amount of power to push/pull really hard on something, you just trade all your speed for torque in the process by using a whole lot of gear reduction. Electric actuators do the same thing. They have a very high internal gear ratio to get a low-power electric motor to create a large force. Does the job, just slowly.

You CAN make electric actuators that are both fast and strong, but you can't run them off an electrical system weaker than a hair drier. And because they do all their 'force generation' onboard the cylinder with the motor/gearing, they will end up huge. With hydraulics you generate the force somewhere inside the tractor and then just pipe it out to the cylinders which stay fairly compact.

If anyone is looking for an example of a strong AND cheap electric actuator, look at electric trailer tongue jacks. Usually 2-3000lbs and $100-200. Very slow..

One of the big advantages of hydraulic cylinders in 'clamping' applications is they can hold even more force than they can generate. Whenever they're not being moved, the control valve isolates the cylinder from the pump, leaving only the hoses and cylinder seals to deal with 'bouncing' loads, usually no problem. With the electric actuator if you bang or bounce something on it that force backfeeds through the threaded geartrain to the motor. Still not a problem in most cases, but they will ultimately be less durable than hydraulics when banging/bouncing things off of them.

 

[bama7]

I really do appreciate all the info. I have been going over and over in my mind about the Electric Grapple. Someone had mentioned the Brush Crusher as a viable option. I thought they were hydraulic, but of course they are not. I sent a message to Westendorf about cost of their universal skid steer model. I have a feeling it would take some time to learn to use it well, but no worry about leaks or electrical actuator problems. Would it be a better choice? I am just working on moving brush and logs to a burn pile on 2 1/2 acres, not a farm or real wooded area.

 

[Vigo327]

One of the best quotes I ever heard was "dont let the perfect be the enemy of the good". Meanwhile, my style of wisdom is more like "good enough is good enough!" Same concept, right?!

I think an electric grapple would be good enough. I would just hate to spend an amount of money that could have got me a hydraulic grapple instead, just because I'd hate to 2nd guess my decision. If the electric option is cheaper and you're doing 'occasional' work on 'only' 2.5 acres, a cheaper option that's good enough is plenty good to me!

 

[bama7]

One of the best quotes I ever heard was "dont let the perfect be the enemy of the good". Meanwhile, my style of wisdom is more like "good enough is good enough!" Same concept, right?!

I think an electric grapple would be good enough. I would just hate to spend an amount of money that could have got me a hydraulic grapple instead, just because I'd hate to 2nd guess my decision. If the electric option is cheaper and you're doing 'occasional' work on 'only' 2.5 acres, a cheaper option that's good enough is plenty good to me!

My old pastor used to call me cheap. I told him I am frugal. I can get the new electric grapple for $1,700 and it is about 10 miles from my house. I am waiting to see the cost of the Brush Crusher and if any are close to me.

 

[LD1]

My old pastor used to call me cheap. I told him I am frugal. I can get the new electric grapple for $1,700 and it is about 10 miles from my house. I am waiting to see the cost of the Brush Crusher and if any are close to me.

At that cost, I don't think you are saving any money over hydraulic if you are capable of sourcing parts and plumbing it yourself.

If you have to take it to a dealer to install a diverter or a 3rd function I can understand.

I have less than $350 in my hydraulics, and somewhere around $1000-$1100 in a grapple

 

[bama7]

At that cost, I don't think you are saving any money over hydraulic if you are capable of sourcing parts and plumbing it yourself.

If you have to take it to a dealer to install a diverter or a 3rd function I can understand.

I have less than $350 in my hydraulics, and somewhere around $1000-$1100 in a grapple

Come do mine! I would gladly pay that plus a profit for you.

 

[LD1]

Come do mine! I would gladly pay that plus a profit for you.

I don't think a plane ticket to Florida would be cost effective.

If you can turn wrenches, I'd be happy to try and guide/advise you.

A diverter is easier. Just need the valve, a momentary contact switch, and the fittings, hoses, and couplings.

I have a detailed post of doing my diverter linked in my signature. Though I'm not sure how to access people's "signature" lines anymore on mobile. Might have to go to my profile