Engine oil

[Peacock]

Oil needs to get hot enough to keep condensation down. I'm sure that 250+ is not an issue.

I think it's more of a problem with localized hot spots that cause coking.

I remember when the Mazda 2.3 came out in the Ranger in '03 or so. Used a ~230* t stat that had a small heating element that was used to control the t stat down to 190 or so. The idea was to optimize fuel economy and engine cooling for different scenarios.

 

[Thomabear]

To make a statement that ''oil is oil' Well, why not just use the the oil from the hamburger joint down the street ?

The oil is oil statement was made relative to a vehicle lasting its useful life and nothing more. Now it's repetitive use is really starting to expose the maturity level one gentleman who can't relate. I'm
kind of starting to get a laugh out of it to be honest. I didn't think anyone here was that slow...

So Kenmac. I have one question for you. Do you think synthetic oil is required to take a healthy (not out of whack) vehicle out past its useful life? If you answer no I rest my case. If you answer yes I think you would be saying that the SAE can benefit from your vast knowledge.

 

[Thomabear]

yea - hot oil temps are one of the places synthetics rule, anyone remember the early print and Tv ads for Mobile one.
where they placed dino and synthetic in fry pans and heated the oil, within a short time the non synthetic turned to sludge and you could still pour the synthetic, I think the same is true for really cold weather, no comparison for my old Ford tractor when running the 5-40 synthetic rotella verses the regular 15 - 40 Rotella cranking speed is much improved.

API tests conventional oil at 302 degrees Fahrenheit.

 

[Z71]

Just like any other product you buy, lubes are built for profit at a certain price. Some use cheaper ingredients so they can sell for less and some user better ingredients and sell for more. Which is more expensive, paying more for a better product up front, or paying for a repair that may have been avoided by using the expensive product?

 

[Peacock]

So Kenmac. I have one question for you. Do you think synthetic oil is required to take a healthy (not out of whack) vehicle out past its useful life? If you answer no I rest my case. If you answer yes I think you would be saying that the SAE can benefit from your vast knowledge.

In the average, older vehicle...NO.

In many current, past high performance or future vehicles....YES.

The OE's don't fill their crankcases with more expensive synthetic oils just because they read about it on the internet. They use the cheapest stuff that will meet their requirements.

 

[Thomabear]

Now, you try to clarify yourself to get out of the hole you have dug. "I didn't think anyone here was that slow"" NOW , isn't that calling the Pot calling the Kettle Black

Well I suppose after 32 years in the refining and marketing industry of the products within your area of expertise I think it's laughable that you think I consider conventional and synthetic oil the same. No, actually I guess I'm trying to "get out of the hole I dug". LOL.
FWIW, I think everyone here figured out my point within a couple of posts with the exception of you sir. My apology for that! I think you single handedly wore out my oil is oil quote while others actually contributed valid cases in which I AGREE (with some) there would be benefit realized from using synthetic oil. I can spell that out "Real Slow" if you'd like...
However, if I said synthetic oil wasn't a waste of money in the majority of cases in which it is used, I would be going against the education and raw data I've acquired throughout the majority of my life. I think I'll hold on to that historical and current fact.v
Actually, I predicted you would do a little bobbing and weaving instead of addressing my Yes/No question. Even brushing on "I know you are but what am I" mentality comments. I guess I got what I expected on that. Well anyway, the floor is still open on that one so please do provide an answer. If there's something you know that I may not I'm always willing to learn.

Other than that all I can conclude is that maybe the grass is a little greener on your side of the fence. Likely due to the abundance of fertilizer over there...

Enjoy your weekend..

 

[Thomabear]

In the average, older vehicle...NO.

In many current, past high performance or future vehicles....YES.

The OE's don't fill their crankcases with more expensive synthetic oils just because they read about it on the internet. They use the cheapest stuff that will meet their requirements.

Required... Really?

My wife's corvette was also delivered with synthetic oil but the manual doesn't call out for its use. When I return Monday I can scan and post that if you'd like. It calls for convention oil meeting the normal GM spec. If it was suggested for reliability or warranty I don't think the general would leave out that important piece of information. Future, well I guess only the future will tell.
BTW, the vette's been running dino. She has only about 45K but but UOAs are outstanding. Wear metals are well below u averages and nitrates are indicating the absence of sludge and varnish. At 10k recommended OCIs TBN is still 6-7 ish. Using castrol and I'm very pleased with the result.

 

[kenmac]

She has only about 45K but but UOAs are outstanding. Wear metals are well below u averages and nitrates are indicating the absence of sludge and varnish. At 10k recommended OCIs TBN is still 6-7 ish. Using castrol and I'm very pleased with the result.

That's the thing about the net. One can post my UOA's are this and that without posting the facts ! Let's see the facts of this great dino oil you speak of. Not just what you say. On my side of the fence ( where it's greener), we deal in real facts.You haven't said 1 thing that's believable. Get your facts and come back

 

[WilliamBos]

I have seen this site many times. My E's father has used it to show me why brand X is better than brand Y many times. I can not tell you what makes one better than the other but looking back on it there is major differences in the additives. As Peacock mentioned, they all do the same job. And as I mentioned there are better products for the same dollar instead of just going with the brand that has the biggest advertising budget and brand recognition like McDonald's. Chris

I hear you loud and clear. Gonna side track for a minute... Warn vs Superwinch: people think warn is the best ever because of their monster advertising budget, yet Superwinch is just as good, if not better. But because they do not advertise the way Warn does, people think they are inferior. Not true!! Aside from Rotella, I do not see any other brands of full syn at Chinamart, could be a reason for this?! Hence why I rarely shop there!!

 

[Thomabear]

That's the thing about the net. One can post my UOA's are this and that without posting the facts ! Let's see the facts of this great dino oil you speak of. Not just what you say. On my side of the fence ( where it's greener), we deal in real facts.You haven't said 1 thing that's believable. Get your facts and come back

:number1:
LOL, things are now starting to become real apparent. Keep it coming....

Just curious but what facts are you after? A UOA isn't fact??? Would you like to come over and pull the samples out of my vehicles then deliver them in some type of safe so they can be validated. Geeesh!

 

[mikehaugen]

LOL, things are now starting to become real apparent.

Yes, there are 3 things you can't discuss on a tractor forum... politics, computers, and oils. :laughing:

 

[Peacock]

Required... Really? My wife's corvette was also delivered with synthetic oil but the manual doesn't call out for its use. When I return Monday I can scan and post that if you'd like. It calls for convention oil meeting the normal GM spec. If it was suggested for reliability or warranty I don't think the general would leave out that important piece of information. Future, well I guess only the future will tell. BTW, the vette's been running dino. She has only about 45K but but UOAs are outstanding. Wear metals are well below u averages and nitrates are indicating the absence of sludge and varnish. At 10k recommended OCIs TBN is still 6-7 ish. Using castrol and I'm very pleased with the result.

Ok. Now try Dino at the recommended interval and drive the car as intended. Not as a daily driver. That's where synthetics are gonna shine. Take the car to the track and beat the piss out of it as GM intended you to.

Nobody is debating that Dino's work fine for your uses. What we are saying is that when the vehicle is used to the limits it was intended for that's where synthetics come into their own.

 

[Thomabear]

Yes, there are 3 things you can't discuss on a tractor forum... politics, computers, and oils. :laughing:

LOL, Very true!

I think I'm about done with this one anyway. At the end of the day everybody should use the oil that makes them happy. Who knows, if the price gap continues to close on synthetic and dino I may just hmmm, better not say that. For now I'm going get some family time with my grand kids.

Anyway, it's been fun...

Bye Kenmac!:wave::drink:

Here's my oath that my vehicles are doing just fine. ath:

 

[Thomabear]

Peacock, a little off topic but does porting your chain saws give them a good bit more power. I just purchased a brand new Stihl MS291 (I think that's the number) and your sig just caught my attention.

BTW, I agree track use would be a good time to use synthetic. Not sure if GM intended for the Vette to be at the track but my wife isn't that hard on it. Other than the occasional Mustang brawl.

 

[kenmac]

:number1:
LOL, things are now starting to become real apparent. Keep it coming....

Just curious but what facts are you after? A UOA isn't fact??? Would you like to come over and pull the samples out of my vehicles then deliver them in some type of safe so they can be validated. Geeesh!

Facts would be posting UOA results on said oil. I can say anything. My synthetic oil is fine after 50,000 miles . The TBN levels at 50,000 miles are stable at 13. Honest, believe me,,,I'm telling the truth. Just like ""Castrol is Liquid Engineering "" I love those Castrol commercials. I guess it works,,you believe them

 

[Peacock]

Peacock, a little off topic but does porting your chain saws give them a good bit more power. I just purchased a brand new Stihl MS291 (I think that's the number) and your sig just caught my attention. BTW, I agree track use would be a good time to use synthetic. Not sure if GM intended for the Vette to be at the track but my wife isn't that hard on it. Other than the occasional Mustang brawl.

Yes. Much more power. Careful attention paid to port timing and squish will really untap some incredible power.

I can't imagine ever running a stock saw again.

 

[Midniteoyl]

Yes, there are 3 things you can't discuss on a tractor forum... politics, computers, and oils. :laughing:

Add religion and you have the four things you can discuss on ANY forum..

 

[kenmac]

Just think about Thomabear. Even if you didn't learn anything here. You at least went from a new member to member just on 1 topic

 

[Soundguy]

Required... Really?

My wife's corvette was also delivered with synthetic oil but the manual doesn't call out for its use. .

how about those applications that list both.

Now mind you i'm dipping into some lawn and agricultural area here.. not auto.. but I have at least a few pieces of equipment that list specs for both a dino oil AND a syn oil based upon use, climate.. etc..