figure this one out

[pagliaccio matto]

My pt 2425 won't move. It is a new machine I purchased last November. It now has 400 hrs. and has been running very well. All the other hydraulics work but the wheels won't turn. I checked at the side port and oil does come out when I turn over the engine. I also checked the pressure at this port. It was about 80 or 90psi. I think it should be more like 300psi. I did not find any obstuctions in the hoses or fittings between the pump and the pedals. It is as if the tram pump circuit is working, but just barely (not much pressure). It gave out on a steep incline with no way to brake. I was very lucky to have stoped it with the bucket. The lack of brakes in this situation is a very serious design flaw. I use this machine commercially and it is costing me alot when it breaks down. Does anybody know what might be causing this and how I can fix it? Any help would be VERY greatly appreciated.

 

[woodlandfarms]

My1850 did the same thing... It was a clogged oil filter... But it went slowly so I am not sure it applies...

 

[pagliaccio matto]

Thanks
I will replace the filter this morning and see if it works.

 

[pagliaccio matto]

I changed the filter and can see no difference. The pressure at the port is still 80 to 90psi and it still wont move. I'm starting to worry that the problem is with the pump itself. I just replaced a defective pump 200 hrs ago. The last pump failure caused the tractor to become stuck in forward drive (also a very dangerous situation). Although I am happy with the performance of the pt, both events have cost my business alot of money. I have had several other problems with the machine all of which have been resolved. I am begining to wonder about power trac's quality controll on their pumps.

 

[KentT]

Does your machine have a hydroback cable or does it use a hydraulic valve on the treadle?

It could be something as simple as a linkage problem -- or it could be the pump, as you fear.

 

[pagliaccio matto]

kentT
My pt has the valve at the pedal.

 

[Bob999]

Have you checked the towing valve to ensure that it is closed? If this valve were opened (or partially opened) to the tow position the sympton you describe might occur.

The low charge pump pressure you report could occur if fluid is not being drawn through the hydraulic filter and into the variable displacement pump in adequate volume. Since you changed the filter I suggest you check for a pinched hose in this circuit.

I assume you have checked the fluid level in the hydraulic reservoir and that it is normal.

 

[Rivco]

kentT
My pt has the valve at the pedal.

I have the up most respect for my fellow PT'ers but I would suggest that you contact Terry at power trac to resolve this matter--- as NJ Bill put it ( do not believe what your owners manual states with regards to --hydraulic flow, part#'s etc.... ) They ( power Trac ) have a serious problem with keeping on top of things regarding updating the manuals for current models. My PT180, Bob999's or KentT's power trac will have a completely different setup than what you have, ( trust me !!!). Power Tracs toll free number
is 1-800- The Yard

 

[pagliaccio matto]

Thanks to all for the help. I checked the tow valve and it was closed. I spoke with Terry on Friday. I called him immediately after it happened and he walked me through some diagnostics. First we checked the hoses between the pump and the pedal for flow and debris and found everything to be o.k. Next, Terry asked me to get a pressure gauge to check the pressure at the side port. It took a couple of hours to find a gauge and come back and chek the pressure. Unfortunately, by that time (4:00 e.s.t.) the Power Trac offices were deserted. Terry did not give me any insight as to what the problem might be. I hoped that you guys on the forum might be able to give me some answers and that maybe there was a chance I could have it fixed by Monday. I have a feeling that I will be spending most of Monday removing the pump and sending it to Power Trac again (at my expense). Has anyone else had to replace a pump?

 

[Rivco]

Thanks to all for the help. I checked the tow valve and it was closed. I spoke with Terry on Friday. I called him immediately after it happened and he walked me through some diagnostics. First we checked the hoses between the pump and the pedal for flow and debris and found everything to be o.k. Next, Terry asked me to get a pressure gauge to check the pressure at the side port. It took a couple of hours to find a gauge and come back and chek the pressure. Unfortunately, by that time (4:00 e.s.t.) the Power Trac offices were deserted. Terry did not give me any insight as to what the problem might be. I hoped that you guys on the forum might be able to give me some answers and that maybe there was a chance I could have it fixed by Monday. I have a feeling that I will be spending most of Monday removing the pump and sending it to Power Trac again (at my expense). Has anyone else had to replace a pump?

I'm sorry to hear about your problems, BUT, before you start pulling apart the pump contact terry and discuss the options first!!!. Terry is a very smart guy ( he knows the PT's inside and out ) and he might be able to work something out.... considering you have only owned the 2425 for 1 +/- years. If the rest of us were PT engineers... Terry would be out of a job... and I don't see that happening any time soon!!

 

[NJBill]

Mr Matto,
As you suggested " figure this one out " so, just a thought.

You indicated that the previous failure had you stuck in forward position.
When we do not push either pedal, we do not move. Therefore if the pedal valve decides to fail the same problems could occur. Unfortunately this would be difficult to diagnnose without lifing all four wheels off the ground.
On my schematic I called the Variable Volume Pump, parts one and two, maybe part two is actually a valve body, controlled by the pedal valve. The oil is pulled into the part two, and unused oil leaves part one to the tank. The used oil is diverted to the wheels through part two.
Bill
Hope my schematic will help your thinking

 

[NJBill]

forgot to mention another bit of figuring, I've had in mind for quite a while.

There have been quite a few comments by owners about the sensitivity of the reverse pedal. In the attached pic. the small threaded shaft with lock nuts in the lower left corner, because of it's close relationship with the two hoses coming from the treadle, must be a means of adjusting the pedal. I have not touched mine because of a left leg problem, I use only the right pedal. I removed the floor panel on the left side to prevent an accidental movement of the left foot towards the pedal.

Once again I hope I have added useful thoughts.

Bill

 

[jfh28]

He has a 2425 so actually he can get all 4 wheels up. Drop the rear legs and then the front bucket. I've done this myself several times....not necessarily intentionally mind you!

Jack


Unfortunately this would be difficult to diagnnose without lifing all four wheels off the ground.

 

[pagliaccio matto]

Thanks for your input. Unfortunately, Terry had me remove the pump today and send it in for him to look at. He was convinced that the problem was with the pump itself due to the fact that the pressure output was so low.

 

[NJBill]

Mr Matto

If at all possible could you take pictures of front and back of the new pump, and its location in your 2425, I'm more than a little curious. Thank you Bill

 

[toy]

Thanks to all for the help. I checked the tow valve and it was closed. I spoke with Terry on Friday. I called him immediately after it happened and he walked me through some diagnostics. First we checked the hoses between the pump and the pedal for flow and debris and found everything to be o.k. Next, Terry asked me to get a pressure gauge to check the pressure at the side port. It took a couple of hours to find a gauge and come back and chek the pressure. Unfortunately, by that time (4:00 e.s.t.) the Power Trac offices were deserted. Terry did not give me any insight as to what the problem might be. I hoped that you guys on the forum might be able to give me some answers and that maybe there was a chance I could have it fixed by Monday. I have a feeling that I will be spending most of Monday removing the pump and sending it to Power Trac again (at my expense). Has anyone else had to replace a pump?

Have you checked the pin where the treadle pivots to make sure it is hooked up right something there might have came loose and not letting the treadle work properly, or something might be catching the treadle pedal and not letting it go all the way down.

 

[pagliaccio matto]

I sent the pump in and it turns out that they sent me a second defective pump! I still havn't received a replacement because they neglected to send it next day UPS as I asked. I realy like this machine when it works but this time it has cost my business more than I care to think about.

 

[ldabe]

You are right on PM.
When it is working it is a hard machine to beat.
But when it is not working, it is a machine I want to 'beat'.

 

[NJBill]

Mr Matto,
I realize you must be busy trying to catch up on delayed assignments, but did you ever get any kind of satisfaction from Tazewell ??
Did a replacement pump arrive and dit it correct your problem ?? I hope your problems are more permanently solved. Best wishes.
Bill

 

[pagliaccio matto]

NJBILL
I finally got the new pump from P.T. I put it back in and now it runs great. I have a feeling that it won't be the last time that I have to replace the pump. On the plus side, I am getting faster at taking them out and putting them back in!