Flail Mower usage questions

[GinNB]

Mulching depends on a number of things. The main ones are tractor ground speed, blade type, sharpness of blades, cutting height, knife tip speed (tractor rpm, gearbox ratio, sheave diameters, and knife tip rotation diameter dependent), internal design of mower, cuttershaft rotation direction (some gearboxes change easily), and rear trapdoor position. Keep the blades sharp, mow lowwww, close the rear trap (if equipped), drive slow, and pick a dry cold (frosty) day. Most of my mowing is done at below a half inch of height with rock knives (short heavy Y blades on a clevis or d-ring of some kind), but not with the specific purpose of mulching leaves. You might get a bit of suction with scoop-type blades but I don't use those. I don't mow lawns, but I'd never expect to go through heavy organic material and not have at least a carpet of mulch on top of what I had just mowed.

 

[leonz]

My new Chinese EFG175 medium duty fail mower will be delivered tomorrow. I really wanted the Caroni, but Agri Supply is out of stock until mid-January and I need it by the middle of this month. I would have preferred the EFGC175 heavy duty model, but they are out of those until January. It seems these two retailers order a fixed amount once per year and when they are out, they are out until the following calendar year. I always try and avoid sending my money to China, but our manufacturers and government have made this very difficult.

The mower comes standard with the 56 mower grass blades and I also ordered the 28 mulching hammers. Initially it will be used to mulch a huge amount of oak leaves that are beginning to fall on my current 4 acres and there will be some sticks mixed in also. Then it will be used to clean up overgrown shrubbery, which will probably require the hammer blades.

Would it be best to leave the grass blades attached for mulching leaves or change over to the hammers for this task before I start either of the two planned tasks?

Thanks.

I have the same mower. I have yet to find a job where the mulching (hammer) blades work well. I leave the grass blades on all the time. The grass blades seem to "cut" much better than the hammer blades. Maybe the hammer blades would work well on a pile of branches ---- I don't know cause I never have a pile of them to deal with ---- most of what I use the mower for is brush/tall weeds. For that task --- use the grass blades.

It's also possible to mow "too short" --- I set the roller in one of its highest positions and then adjust the 3 pt. to get my preferred height.

It's a decent mower --- good luck with it.

Thanks a lot bruceatlam. This is exactly the information I am looking for and will leave the grass blades on until I get into larger stuff. How are your grass blades lasting? Much wear on them in a short amount of time?

The grass blades actually last quite long ---- I would order a few spares. I think you can buy groups of six. I would also buy a set of belts and find some replacement shear bolts at the hardware store. I don't have a good answer for you on those shear bolts.

My grass blades get dinged up from rocks and cement chunks before they wear out --- you can also turn them so you get to use the second side before you replace them --- don't forget to do that.

Keep in mind that these mowers "rip and shred" more than they "cut". So, a nice sharp blade isn't really critical.

I have a set of belts coming, along with the hammer blades and a spare set of 6 of those. Will stock up on shear bolts as soon as I find out what size they are. And may get a slip clutch. Will see how the first couple of leaf and stick mulchings go with the grass blades and may order a spare set of grass blades.

BTW: When I ordered my unit the salesman said he thought the blades were pretty standard and could be picked up at tractor supply places. And I am sure the belts can be purchased at any auto supply place, especially NAPA.

Thanks for your advice. You saved me a lot of time and trouble as I was planning on switching the grass blades for the hammer blades before testing. Will not be wasting that time now And for the roller adjustment and using the 3PH for the height. This will also save me some time.

Let us know how it mulches leafs. I didn't have much luck with mine. Unless the the grass is tall and they are sittingon top it just kind of floated over them. It didn't suck them up and shred them like I hoped it would.

Oh man, this is disheartening to hear... as this is the primary reason I ordered it now. Will update this thread when I have tested after a few more leaves have fallen, enough for a reasonable test. I plan on having the cutting height ~ 2" or so.

How were you using it to cut?
What type of blades/cutting?
What mower do you have?

I posted pictures of sample cuts using the grass blades in post #47 (user name Kybound) in
anyone used ebay's flail mower - Page 5

I have since gotten hammer blades due to all the saplings that I have left to cut. Grass blades did fine, but hammer blade do much better for what I have to cut. Both mulched the material just fine. BTW, mine is the EFGC 48inch cut

Thanks. I read that whole post but you are the only one who posted their model number. I would have preferred the EFG"c" model but it was not available. Looks like yours cuts well and glad to hear both blade types mulch well.

I will have to try mulching some leaves this Sunday, if time allows and I have the mower assembled. Fed-X is supposed to be here today.

Primary reason I got one too. I'd asked that question in the "Let's talk flail mowers" thread and got a few "should work great" but I don't know if any of those opinions were from people who used it for this purpose. Maybe it is just my mower/technique as I've also read comments that a flail will shed longer grass into bitty pieces. In my experience, once pass just cuts long grass once and you have to go over it again to chop the cuttings finer. Even then, mine doesn't have "suction" to pick up cut grass or leave/debris that is below blade height. Maybe mower/operator dependent that is why I anxiously await your experience.

I used it with leaves on top of long grass and short grass/bare ground. Long grass it pretty much blows them out the back unmolested. Short grass/bare ground it pretty much just rolls over them and without even lifting them off the ground.

I did have some luck reducing the volume of leaves by blowing them into tall windrows with a blower and then running over the piles with the flail but it only got the top and there was still too much to pick up by hand.

If you look in the last picture of the first post in this thread (link below) you can see that most of the leaves coming out of the back are relatively untouched. He is using the flail mower to spit them out into a collector, not mulch them and leave them in place. In my experience it won't do that. I tried various combinations of mower height, speed, with or without trash deflector, etc and nothing really worked. I have an older Mott 6' with grass blades.

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/attachments/294911-using-flail-mower-pick-up.html

Maybe mower/operator dependent that is why I anxiously await your experience. But again, looking at the picture in the thread above, I don't see a flail excelling at mulching leaves to the point that you don't have to collect them.

Mulching depends on a number of things. The main ones are tractor ground speed, blade type, sharpness of blades, cutting height, knife tip speed (tractor rpm, gearbox ratio, sheave diameters, and knife tip rotation diameter dependent), internal design of mower, cuttershaft rotation direction (some gearboxes change easily), and rear trapdoor position. Keep the blades sharp, mow lowwww, close the rear trap (if equipped), drive slow, and pick a dry cold (frosty) day. Most of my mowing is done at below a half inch of height with rock knives (short heavy Y blades on a clevis or d-ring of some kind), but not with the specific purpose of mulching leaves. You might get a bit of suction with scoop-type blades but I don't use those. I don't mow lawns, but I'd never expect to go through heavy organic material and not have at least a carpet of mulch on top of what I had just mowed.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++



The issue of using longer side slicers and smaller diameter flail mower rotors is
and I quote ME " A drive me crazy item equal to flailmowers not having
removable trash doors as standard equipment!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


The longer side slicers cannot be effectively used to create suction because

1. the side slicers do not have a slotted mounting hole.
2. The knive hangers are not wide which would allow the side slicers to become airfoils
which CREATES SUCTION.
3.it costs more money to make a larger diameter flail mower rotor.

The lower the cutting hieght and the rpm speed set for 540 rpm PTO speed is best
and having dry leaves also helps


My 48" towed and motorised Mathews lawn Genie finish flail mower with a cubic yard collection basket uses
4 rows of 3 inch side slicers creating 64 pairs and 4 single side slicer mounting stations using 132 side slicers and 64 dethatching blades

The large flail shredders have 6 inch plus diameter flail mower rotors and SHORT scoop or side slicer KNIVES

 

[sdef]

Let us know how it mulches leafs. I didn't have much luck with mine. Unless the the grass is tall and they are sittingon top it just kind of floated over them. It didn't suck them up and shred them like I hoped it would.

Well, I had a similar experience as you. If I am cutting/mulching with the grass blades and am going through some shorter, dead grass, with leaves mixed in, it cuts and mulches fine. But if I am just trying to mulch some leaves in a relatively bare area under my many hardwood trees, it seems to have very little affect.

I tried it at the delivered height of about 1.5" and then I lowered the skids to their lowest position and moved the roller up, which probably gave me about 1/2" cut, to no avail. Also raised the 3PH a bit and the increased height did not help any.

I see no reason to try the heavier mulching blades just for leaves. I think as a regular grass and brush mower this will be fine, but this is not the main purpose I ordered it for. With as many trees as I have, grass is not a large issue.

Due to the length of my hydraulic top link, I am not able to angle the front of the mower up any at all and it sits at a slight down slant. Later this week I plan on replacing the top link with the stock, manual link as it looks like I may be able to adjust it longer and hope to be able to tilt the front of the mower up a bit. Will try another cut like this. And if this does not help mulch, I am out of things to try and will just have to spend the many hours on the garden tractor mulching leaves again this year.

Will post my results from this next and final test soon.

 

[leonz]

Could you possibly upload a few images of your flail mower???


About your top link, you need to be sure your flail mower is LEVEL
from front to back.

If you have a small bubble level place it across
the top of the flail mower from front to back and
adjust it the top link in that manner.



The other issue is wet leaves a flail mower will not
work well trying to shred wet leaves when they
are soaked or still have a lot of moisture in them.

 

[sdef]

Could you possibly upload a few images of your flail mower???


About your top link, you need to be sure your flail mower is LEVEL
from front to back.

If you have a small bubble level place it across
the top of the flail mower from front to back and
adjust it the top link in that manner.



The other issue is wet leaves a flail mower will not
work well trying to shred wet leaves when they
are soaked or still have a lot of moisture in them.

Uploading a few pics. Note the skids are pretty much flat on the ground (pic 294). You can't tell by the photo but the rear of the skid is elevated about 1/8". But the top surface of the unit is at a larger angle down indicated by the level.

I am going to either replace the top link with a longer manual one I have for a test or trying raising the front of the skids.

The leaves were very dry during the testing yesterday but are a little damp today from a bit of overnight rain. I will wait until tomorrow to test again.

 

[sdef]

The leaves dried very nicely and were pretty much bone dry by late afternoon.

I changed the top link to a longer one to make the top of the mower shroud level, although I am not sure that portion is designed to be level as the side skids were pretty level anyway. In the original configuration I posted, I was able to get the cutting height down to ~ 3/4" with the roller and the side skids at their lowest positions and the skids ~ flat on the ground.

When I lengthened the top link so the top surface of the mower was level, it raised the front of the skids 1 1/2" off the ground and the rear ~ 1/2" off the ground and was just sitting on the roller. This made the lowest cutting height ~ 1 3/4". So I think the level skids are probably a truer indication of the level point and the original setup was probably cutting fairly level. And when the top link is shortened and the skids are more flat on the ground and the blades lower to the ground, I can hear more noise within the mower housing of stuff being flung around, than I can when the top link is lengthened.

The leaves are not too thick yet, maybe 1/2" - 2" in height. I tried various skid height positions and changed the angle by moving the top link in each direction without any significant change in the leaf mulching pattern. At BEST, I can see maybe 25% at MOST are cut in some manner by the mower, but certainly not what I would call mulched. And not even close to the mulching my 46" Craftsman garden tractor has been providing for the last 15 years.

In my mind, the absolutely only thing left to try would be to swap out the grass blades for the brush blades. And I see no purpose in this. But maybe the full width of the brush blades can help create a vacuum. I really do not know. But do know I do not want to leave any stone unturned that could improve this matter, so will probably swap the blades this weekend. But first I need to properly do the first of 3 or 4 mulchings using the garden tractor before the leaves gets too thick.

Will post how the mulching blades turn out within a week or so. But I really think this mower is not designed to mulch leaves unless they are mixed in with grass or laying on top of grass.

 

[Jack Yuan]

EFGC model flail mower was designed by Denmark engineer maybe 6 or 8 years ago, he is my customer and friend, this type flail mower is very welcome in Europe market, and well widely sold. Most of EU customer choose to use Hammer blade, till now this year I didn't sell any EFGC mower with grass blade, all are with Hammer blade.
So I personally think hammer blade is better than Y grass blade. Maybe US condition is a little different than EU, I don't know.

These years, EFGC flail mower come to US market by some importer such like: value leader, bestco, KPXtractor, etc.

I don't know why US customer prefer finishing mower than flail mower, quite strange.

Anyway, EFGC is a mature product. You only need to inspect the belt tension after many days use, and stock some belt, side gear oil seal, some blade. Then you can use it by many many years.

 

[SI2305]

itching burning question,

How do you adjust the mowing height of your flail? I know that they have a rear roller, but what about the front of the flail? Does it ride on a skid plate. Your picture looks like it has side skid shoes just for this, but I can not be certain. Can the skid shoes be adjusted also? Congrats on your purchase. I hope to one day join the flail nation.

SI2305

JD2305, 200CX, LX4, 5' rear blade, 4' box blade. subsoiler, 60" RFM----and officially jealous of flail mower owners!

 

[sdef]

itching burning question,

How do you adjust the mowing height of your flail? I know that they have a rear roller, but what about the front of the flail? Does it ride on a skid plate. Your picture looks like it has side skid shoes just for this, but I can not be certain. Can the skid shoes be adjusted also? Congrats on your purchase. I hope to one day join the flail nation.

SI2305

JD2305, 200CX, LX4, 5' rear blade, 4' box blade. subsoiler, 60" RFM----and officially jealous of flail mower owners!

The height and angle of the mower is adjusted by the side skids and the rear roller, and used with the 3PH all of the way down and floating so the skids are following the contour of the land. Plus you can lift the 3PH to support the mower and mow like that, depending upon your conditions. According to the manual, rocky conditions require the mower to be supported by the 3PH.

 

[sdef]

EFGC model flail mower was designed by Denmark engineer maybe 6 or 8 years ago, he is my customer and friend, this type flail mower is very welcome in Europe market, and well widely sold. Most of EU customer choose to use Hammer blade, till now this year I didn't sell any EFGC mower with grass blade, all are with Hammer blade.
So I personally think hammer blade is better than Y grass blade. Maybe US condition is a little different than EU, I don't know.

These years, EFGC flail mower come to US market by some importer such like: value leader, bestco, KPXtractor, etc.

I don't know why US customer prefer finishing mower than flail mower, quite strange.

Anyway, EFGC is a mature product. You only need to inspect the belt tension after many days use, and stock some belt, side gear oil seal, some blade. Then you can use it by many many years.

Thank you Jack for your comments. I am new to flail mower usage and purchased this EFG model primarily for mulching leaves in the fall. I am trying to get it setup to do this but am not having any luck. Not having any experience with a flail mower, I am trying out the blades that came with it first, which are the grass blades. I also ordered the hammers for larger brush, which is not my issue at the moment.

As a last resort I am going to try the hammers but was under the impression these were for larger brush. I would have thought the grass blades would have mulched the leaves. At this point I still do not believe the hammers will do any better on very lightweight leaves, but will try them.