Grappling fun - A Picture Thread....

[IslandTractor]

Okay. I thought it might be high enough. Never mind.

I should have mentioned that I have a sunshade so the view from a camera mounted under the ROPS would simply duplicate exactly the perspective I already get.

 

[Piston]

I would MUCH prefer to have both a standard bucket and a grapple than a single 4n1

I agree with this statement as well. I have operated full sized loader/backhoes with the 4 in 1, and I find it much less useful that even my small tractor with grapple.

but if you are trailering to a job site and cannot take two implements, a 4n1 can certainly be very handy.

On the rare occasion that I need my bucket on a job, I carry it inside the grapple. It doesn't take up any more space than the grapple alone. Even considering the time it takes to swap buckets/grapple when needed, it's still far more efficient than the 4 in 1.
The 4 in 1 really is helpful when trying to get that last bit of material however.

Unfortunately, no pics of it loaded on the trailer.

 

[GreatWhitehunter]

I agree with this statement as well. I have operated full sized loader/backhoes with the 4 in 1, and I find it much less useful that even my small tractor with grapple.




On the rare occasion that I need my bucket on a job, I carry it inside the grapple. It doesn't take up any more space than the grapple alone. Even considering the time it takes to swap buckets/grapple when needed, it's still far more efficient than the 4 in 1.
The 4 in 1 really is helpful when trying to get that last bit of material however.

Unfortunately, no pics of it loaded on the trailer.
View attachment 401972

x2 on this, the 4in1 doesn't even come close as a grapple. It's really not a super useful tool on a tractor IMHO. The only job I found the 4in1 a real asset for was picking up spoils after Harley raking. But with the cost of the bucket a standard bucket and hand shovel would have been a much better financial choice.

Matt

 

[AKfish]

x2 on this, the 4in1 doesn't even come close as a grapple. It's really not a super useful tool on a tractor IMHO. The only job I found the 4in1 a real asset for was picking up spoils after Harley raking. But with the cost of the bucket a standard bucket and hand shovel would have been a much better financial choice.

Matt

Ditto...ditto - here. That's why I sold my 4in1: and kept my grapple!

AKfish

 

[IslandTractor]

Hi Piston:
I have a question, what are the costs of a unit like yours and what is entailed with installing it, more hydraulics, price etc.

Thanks
Wayne

From your signature it appears your tractor is already set up for a backhoe so I presume you have existing rear remotes. If that is true then the cost of installing a grapple is essentially the cost of the grapple plus two lengths of 3/8" hydraulic hose and fittings. I used rear remotes to control the grapple on the tractor in my avatar and liked that system very much. I currently have a diverter valve that would add about $700 to the cost and frankly it is not worth the upcharge. No better functionality at all over simply using the rear remote control lever. A 48" light duty grapple (all you need) similar to the one in my avatar will cost you about $1100-1300 these days. The hydraulic hoses and fittings from a discount internet supplier (Surplus Supply) would be about $100-150 or maybe up to $200 from a local hydraulic shop. I bought my grapple many moons ago and the manufacturer is out of business but if I were buying today for a L3800, I'd look real closely at the Everything Attachments 50" (?52") light duty grapple. Very nicely designed and built and perfect for a midsized light tractor like yours.

 

[Msamt]

Thank You Island Tractor for the very useful information!!

Look around at auctions, i picked up an orphaned "new" versatech 66" for 800$ and its been a brute

 

[IslandTractor]

Look around at auctions, i picked up an orphaned "new" versatech 66" for 800$ and its been a bruteView attachment 403030

He has the LA524 loader and would probably be better off with a lighter duty grapple unless he finds a CL bargain like you did. I think the versatech weighs something like 500 lbs or more which would put a pretty big crimp into his net lift capacity. As I recall the LA524 lifts only about 1200lbs to full height so is about half the lift capacity of the Kioti. The EA light duty weighs less than 300lbs. My Millonzi light duty 48 weighs about 300lbs and is currently mounted on a Kioti DK40se. I've always used it appropriately in the sense of lining up the load so as not to twist either the grapple or FEL but other than that precaution, I've beat the snot out of my grapple and it is going strong after 8 years. Some battle scars yes, but fully functional and my favorite implement.

 

[Piston]

I agree with Island Tractors comments regarding the grapple. I think the everything attachments 50" would suit you real well.

Do you actually have rear remotes? Or just power beyond for your backhoe? That will make a difference in cost and what is involved but regardless even having just the power beyond makes it much easier to add rear remotes.

I didn't have any hydraulic valves at the back (I didn't need them for my grapple, I had other needs) and it was a fair amount of time and money but a great learning experience for me to add my own. If your interested in what I did, click the link in my sig below.

Another way to operate the grapple, is you can add a diverter for your FEL joystick and use the joystick to operate the grapple open and close. A third option is to install an electric solenoid third function switch, which is what I did.

I've operated all three, and I like either the diverter setup, or the third function. It's more money but in my opinion a much better setup. It's not needed, it's just nice!

A lot of the setup depends on personal preference, what you like and prefer, might be different than what we like or prefer.

I'm not sure what part of NH your in, but if your near Alton Bay I'd be happy to let you operate my tractor and mess around with the grapple sometime. I know we are in the wrong season right now but I use the grapple year round so it doesn't matter much to me.

 

[Msamt]

He has the LA524 loader and would probably be better off with a lighter duty grapple unless he finds a CL bargain like you did. I think the versatech weighs something like 500 lbs or more which would put a pretty big crimp into his net lift capacity. As I recall the LA524 lifts only about 1200lbs to full height so is about half the lift capacity of the Kioti.

Great point, was only thinking price, mine is probably a little less than 500 lbs, 3 of us put it in my silverado, guessing 400 lb, but lift would still be impacted on tractor in question.

This is why TBN is so great, all angles are covered by a broad community!:drink:

 

[Xfaxman]

Thank you IslandTractor, Msamt, & Piston, these forums are a tremendous help as is all of your input. In looking at different Grapples some have one upper grip and others have two. Do any of you know the pro and cons of them? I like the idea of trying to find a great deal at a function like an auction, ( the more money saved the more to buy later ) but my wife, ( you gotta love her ) says she prefer that I buy new because of warranty and " tech support ".
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Thank you all again.
Wayne

Here is a good thread from last year on grapples: http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/attachments/295014-need-help-deciding-grapple.html

 

[TomSeller]

Thank you IslandTractor, Msamt, & Piston, these forums are a tremendous help as is all of your input. In looking at different Grapples some have one upper grip and others have two. Do any of you know the pro and cons of them? I like the idea of trying to find a great deal at a function like an auction, ( the more money saved the more to buy later ) but my wife, ( you gotta love her ) says she prefer that I buy new because of warranty and " tech support ".

Two lids on an L grapple offer some advantage over a single lid with odd shaped loads, but I have not seen many loads that can't be held on the grapple with a single lid. All the lid does is hold the load while you transport unless you have a rake grapple where the lid is wide, with multiple teeth and the lid is used for back raking. I have multiple grapples but If I only had one, it would be a narrow L style, lightweight with one lid. Heavier grapples can lift LESS than lightweight grapples.

As far as used goes, grapples are low tech. If the cylinders are in good shape and the grapple is not bent, you can get a good deal used. Even if it is bent you might be able to just bend it back. The hinges should be looked at but they are low cycle so they should not be worn. Maybe look for cracks or out of alignment. Good luck.

 

[IslandTractor]

Two lids on an L grapple offer some advantage over a single lid with odd shaped loads, but I have not seen many loads that can't be held on the grapple with a single lid. All the lid does is hold the load while you transport unless you have a rake grapple where the lid is wide, with multiple teeth and the lid is used for back raking. I have multiple grapples but If I only had one, it would be a narrow L style, lightweight with one lid. Heavier grapples can lift LESS than lightweight grapples.

As far as used goes, grapples are low tech. If the cylinders are in good shape and the grapple is not bent, you can get a good deal used. Even if it is bent you might be able to just bend it back. The hinges should be looked at but they are low cycle so they should not be worn. Maybe look for cracks or out of alignment. Good luck.

I agree. I don't think I've ever had trouble getting a load secured in my grapple with one upper jaw. Maybe if you were carrying lots of cut split firewood two jaws would be better (but a standard bucket would be better too). The other two negative issues with double jaws are 1) weighs more so net lift capacity is less and 2) always costs more.

There are a few truisms about grapples. The first is that everybody is happy with whatever grapple they have. Second is that any grapple is better than no grapple. Third is that I've never heard of anyone selling their 48" single jaw light duty grapple in order to buy a bigger one.

 

[Piston]

Wayne,
We're happy to help you spend your money

Regarding the hydraulics to operate a grapple, it sounds to me like you have a "power beyond" circuit and no rear remote valves. This is just my assumption based in what I've read, and I may have missed something.

A "power beyond" function, won't give you a way to operate the grapple.

There are a few options like I mentioned before, the electric over hydraulic solenoid, the diverter, and then using an already existing valve, if you have one. You can also add one or more, and it wouldn't be too difficult to do since you already have power beyond.

There is a member on here who sells some kits and is extremely helpful and really great to work with. When you are ready, I'd recommend getting in contact with Brian, his company is Fitrite Hydraulics, and his forum name is mtnviewranch (I'm guessing he has a ranch, with a view, of possibly some mountains )
He can certainly help you choose the right setup based on your preferences and needs. I've bought through him numerous times and have always been happy. There are other companies too, WR Long sells grapples and valve kits, very easy to install and this is the style I have. Also Everything Attachments sells both as well. They are all good.

Regarding the grapple.
I won't tell you what grapple to get, because you might have some unique needs that calls for something specific.
I had very specific uses in mind when I bought mine, I wanted a perfectly flat bottom, not curved, and I wanted something wider as I carry a lot of firewood with my grapple, so I wanted a wider one. I actually wish I got the 72" model but I would never recommend that to others unless they are doing mostly firewood and have more lift capacity. I don't believe a wider grapple will let you carry anymore brush than a narrower grapple. Don't sell the narrow ones short.

I do agree with others that (because of your loader capabilities) I would stick with a smaller grapple. If you don't have specific needs for a bigger one, or a flat bottom, I'd really look hard at that Everything Attachments 50" grapple. I'd be inclined to say just buy that one, but I don't know your real needs so I can't say that.


I'll try to let you know if I'm up that way over the next few weeks.

Wayne, if you work in the woods, I'm not kidding you, a grapple will CHANGE YOUR LIFE!
(Okay maybe a little dramatic but it's seriously amazing how much more useful your tractor becomes)

 

[TomSeller]

my families outdoor opportunities. Such as reclaiming an old apple orchard,

Fodder for a separate thread, but this is one of my hobbies as well. I have an old orchard dating back to 1880 that I have been furiously grafting the old varieties onto new rootstock to save them, some of which are not identifiable. Apple replant disease forced me to relocate the new trees.

 

[lostcreekranch]

Once you get a true 3rd function, with control switch to open / close grapple right on the FEL joystick, you will never want to try to use a rear remote and have to move your hand from joystick to the remote handle. Both of our tractors have the WR Long 3rd function now.

 

[IslandTractor]

Wayne,

Don't worry about 38 vs 35 HP. Your loader is "light duty" and Kubota tractors are light too. I wouldn't hesitate a minute to get the EA light grapple if it were my decision.

Piston raises an excellent point regarding hydraulics at the rear of your tractor. You need to clarify if you have a rear remote or power beyond for the backhand . Is there a lever you need to set to on/official from the operator station? A rear remote allows multiple implements to be attached and controlled. Power beyond is useful only for implements like a backhoe that have their own control valves. Either could have been used for your backhoe.

As noted, there are three options to control grapple hydraulics. There are a number of threads here that discuss those options. Each has benefits and costs. Using an existing rear remote is cheapest. Adding a new rear remote is second (?500). Diverter valve is next (?600-700) and electric over hydraulic is most expensive (?900). Each has fans, all work. I cannot imagine tractoring without at least one rear remote so I am a bit biased

 

[94BULLITT]

Once you get a true 3rd function, with control switch to open / close grapple right on the FEL joystick, you will never want to try to use a rear remote and have to move your hand from joystick to the remote handle. Both of our tractors have the WR Long 3rd function now.

I never used a grapple without a 3rd function but I can't imagine using one with a remote. A remote would not be as user friendly or productive.

 

[TomSeller]

A remote would not be as user friendly or productive.

Only slightly less. But MUCH less expensive. I have made 1000s of grapple picks and see no reason to change from using my remote.

 

[94BULLITT]

Only slightly less. But MUCH less expensive. I have made 1000s of grapple picks and see no reason to change from using my remote.

What is a remote on a Kubota like the guy is asking about, $500? Then a couple hundred for a hoses to run up the loader. A WR Long 3rd function is $750ish.

Edit: I just looked a remote retails for $855 for a L3800.

 

[IslandTractor]

I never used a grapple without a 3rd function but I can't imagine using one with a remote. A remote would not be as user friendly or productive.

If you've never used a remote to control a grapple, how can you make that statement.?

I've used a remote and I currently have a diverter valve. I actually preferred the remote. No way I would pay $600-1000 for the a diverter or electric over hydraulic today.

If you can drive a four on the floor transmission, using a remote is trivial.