How many have concealed carry permit to carry a gun ?

[/pine]

Independent scientific research organizations would be fine. NRA funded "research" is not. The government does do a lot of research we all accept. NIH is a good example. There is enough openness in organizations like NIH and CDC that it is pretty hard to systematically bias research. NRA went after CDC not because of malfeasance by CDC, but simply because they didn't want the public health impacts of gun ownership to be brought to light.

A couple of facts (home safety) from the CDC:

Americans are 51 times more likely to die an accidental poisoning death versus an accidental shooting death.

Americans are approximately 10 times as likely to die from accidental suffocation vs. an accidental shooting and almost 6 times more likely to die via accidental drowning (non-boating related) than accidental shooting.

 

[KiotiKowboy]

 

[MossRoad]

On the other hand, if you had "exercised your Right," you'd likely still be going through a court battle and hopefully winning and paying the cost of defending yourself for many years. Plus the knowledge of taking a life. Plus the trauma caused to your family.

The idea is to be able to return home. As it was, you didn't end up needing to kill someone just to satisfy a need to prove you had a Right.

Killing someone must always be a last resort. I have carried legally (living in Oregon) and both legally and illegally (a business owner) in CA for over 30 years. Been accosted, never needed to kill. Only because I was able to use good judgement and avoid doing so. But put me in a place where I needed to, I'd have to deal with the aftermath but still be alive.

What you didn't share is what happened when you reported the assault and gave LE the license plate of the 225 and descriptions of the perps. Personally, that disturbs me more than the assault to think you let it end there. Seems like you might have exposed others that might not have faired as well. Or possibly had exposed yourself and your friend to a second event in a less populated area.

I'm just saying. We need to defend ourselves and our friends and family in an immediate need. We are not hired or trained in law enforcement.

As I mentioned, I was 16 years old at the time. I know the responsibility of carrying a firearm is great. My personality traits do not coincide with being a responsible concealed firearm carrier. Therefore, I do not carry a concealed firearm. Out of high school, I looked into law enforcement. Again, my personality traits do not coincide with being a responsible law enforcement agent, either. I also looked at conservation officer... nope. That's law enforcement too. At least I recognized it long ago and sought a career that didn't involve dealing with people while armed. And the world's probably better off I made that choice, eh? hhahahaa

Anyhow, nothing ever came of it. I nor my parents never heard a peep about it again from the police. I did keep an eye out for that car for the next several months and never saw it again. But what you going to do? No cell phones back then. Today its much easier to report suspicious activity. And it seems I do see something out of place in that neighborhood that requires a call to the police about every 4-5 weeks. Last month there was a car with its lights off and doors open directly in front of an auto parts store front door at 3:00am. That's not suspicious!!! hahahaha I call the police and keep on driving.

With that said. I believe the benefits of armed citizens far outweighs the drawbacks. I also believe in background checks for ALL firearm purchases, both retail and private. However, the records should then be destroyed. It would be nice if it could be done at a federal level so that all states would have the same set of rules. I live 5 minutes from Michigan and an hour from Illinois and Chicago. Hour and a half to Ohio. Five sets of rules. Crazy.

 

[MossRoad]

We probably ought to keep the politics out of this thread since it's not in "Friendly Politics"

That applies to both points of view, BTW

I just took a hearing test about 20 minutes ago... thanks!

 

[MossRoad]

Research shows that homes without guns are safer.

The health risk of having a gun in the home | MinnPost

Having a gun in your home significantly increases your risk of death and that of your spouse and children.

And it doesn稚 matter how the guns are stored or what type or how many guns you own.

If you have a gun, everybody in your home is more likely than your non-gun-owning neighbors and their families to die in a gun-related accident, suicide or homicide.

Furthermore, there is no credible evidence that having a gun in your house reduces your risk of being a victim of a crime. Nor does it reduce your risk of being injured during a home break-in.

The health risks of owning a gun are so established and scientifically non-controvertible that the American Academy of Pediatrics issued a policy statement in 2000 recommending that pediatricians urge parents to remove all guns from their homes.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/03/opinion/sunday/dangerous-gun-myths.html

Guns in home increase suicide, homicide risk The Chart - CNN.com Blogs

http://www.jhsph.edu/research/cente...policy-and-research/publications/IPV_Guns.pdf

Firearm Access and Intimate Partner Homicide
Compared to homes without guns, the presence of guns in the home is associated with a 3-fold
increased homicide risk within the home. The risk connected to gun ownership increases to 8-fold when the offender is an intimate partner or relative of the victim and is 20 times higher
when previous domestic violence exists.6


Does anyone feel that a gang of 20 young people (10 - 16 years old) or a group of schizophrenic, recently discharged mental patients have a Constitutional right to carry any weapon they desire or do you agree that right is not absolute?

There is more than one Constitutional Right and each has been balanced by our courts.

Loren

Having a knife in your house significantly increases your chances of being injured with a knife.
Having a bathtub in your house significantly increases your chances of being injured in a bathtub.
Riding in a car significantly increases your chances of being injured in a car.

With all things, risk is involed.

 

[IslandTractor]

IT, do you wake up wondering how you can be even more annoying than the day before? Like most libs, you pull out the old NRA whenever you need a whipping boy to help you avoid facing the facts about our Constitution. To, once again, further your education; Yes, the NRA is essentially a firearms oriented organization. What you don't seem to realize is by their defense of that single right, they are perhaps the strongest advocate for the rule of law - The United States Constitution. The NRA also provides education and training for youth and law enforcement. And, because you need as much help as possible, here is another tidbit ... The 2nd Amendment is 2nd for a reason. It is placed behind the basic reiteration of your rights in the 1st Amendment to reflect its importance in sustaining those rights. In effect, it reinforces the need/duty/right for citizens to remain freely armed as a means to protect themselves and the nation from tyrants and fools. Although the NRA, in my opinion, has made some serious mistakes by being too agreeable to bad legislation - I am PROUD to say I have been an NRA Life member since 1989

Why does a gun organization lobby to prevent the world's leading public health research organization from studying firearm deaths and injuries? Isn't the point of bearing arms to protect? Public health research is also aimed at understanding risks and identifying strategies to lower risks to health and life. NRA should support research that could help make firearms safer. Or, perhaps that is not their current agenda.

 

[IslandTractor]

A couple of facts (home safety) from the CDC: Americans are 51 times more likely to die an accidental poisoning death versus an accidental shooting death. Americans are approximately 10 times as likely to die from accidental suffocation vs. an accidental shooting and almost 6 times more likely to die via accidental drowning (non-boating related) than accidental shooting.

Reference please. Those numbers seem a bit high (accidental poisoning especially unless that includes medication). More to the point, the only way we can collect and understand that sort of data is by doing research. So why does the NRA block CDC from doing research on firearms?

 

[/pine]

As I mentioned, I was 16 years old at the time. I know the responsibility of carrying a firearm is great. My personality traits do not coincide with being a responsible concealed firearm carrier. Therefore, I do not carry a concealed firearm. Out of high school, I looked into law enforcement. Again, my personality traits do not coincide with being a responsible law enforcement agent, either. I also looked at conservation officer... nope. That's law enforcement too. At least I recognized it long ago and sought a career that didn't involve dealing with people while armed. And the world's probably better off I made that choice, eh? hhahahaa

Anyhow, nothing ever came of it. I nor my parents never heard a peep about it again from the police. I did keep an eye out for that car for the next several months and never saw it again. But what you going to do? No cell phones back then. Today its much easier to report suspicious activity. And it seems I do see something out of place in that neighborhood that requires a call to the police about every 4-5 weeks. Last month there was a car with its lights off and doors open directly in front of an auto parts store front door at 3:00am. That's not suspicious!!! hahahaha I call the police and keep on driving.

With that said. I believe the benefits of armed citizens far outweighs the drawbacks. I also believe in background checks for ALL firearm purchases, both retail and private. However, the records should then be destroyed. It would be nice if it could be done at a federal level so that all states would have the same set of rules. I live 5 minutes from Michigan and an hour from Illinois and Chicago. Hour and a half to Ohio. Five sets of rules. Crazy.

The posts/experiences you have related in this thread are admirable...:thumbsup:

 

[MossRoad]

So the "common sense" police make the call. Who are they? Where does their authority come from? HS

I guess you have to answer the question youself instead of asking others to answer it for you... when does society as a whole, decide what laws need to be enacted? So far, society has agreed that convicted felons are not to be trusted with firearm ownership. Nor are mentally ill people. Other than that, most folks agree that firearm ownership is O.K. and acceptable.

THEY are US.
THEIR athority comes from US.

US are the common sense police. The key word there is "common", meaning average. You are on one fringe of common and Island Tractor is on the opposite fringe of common. The more you two keep arguing, the less people will listen to either of you. Both of you are beating a dead horse.

 

[MossRoad]

The posts/experiences you have related in this thread are admirable...:thumbsup:

Thanks. Sometimes I can be a d***, though. I try not to be.