Hydraulic motor on rear blade

[TractorBluez]

Has anyone tried setting up a rear blade with a hydraulic motor for 360-degree rotation? Or does this fall into the "dumb idea" category.

 

[Peter 315]

Might work but you need a way to lock the blade..

 

[CalG]

Think of the forces if you snag a corner!

 

[oldnslo]

would potentially work with motor that is large enough to with stand torque demands or like Peter states some mechanical lock or brake to hold position.

 

[4570Man]

That’s exactly how the blade on an actual road grader rotates. The downside is the cost to build something like that would be substantial.

 

[D&D]

Has anyone tried setting up a rear blade with a hydraulic motor for 360-degree rotation? Or does this fall into the "dumb idea" category.

It’s possible

360* Rotating Back Blade Project

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[workinonit]

You would have to build it like a turn table on a track hoe. Which is probably like a motor grader is made.

 

[TractorBluez]

Has anyone tried setting up a rear blade with a hydraulic motor for 360-degree rotation? Or does this fall into the "dumb idea" category.

Thank you for your comments everyone. I had a feeling the forces on the hydraulic motor could be an issue. D & D, I hope your project turns out well after all the thought you've put into it. Like you, I'm tired of getting on/off the tractor to adjust the blade. Would be really nice to adjust it in each direction and angle from the tractor seat when snowplowing driveways.

 

[CliffordK]

How often do you need 360° rotation? Are you switching between pushing and pulling a lot?

90° rotation (+45°, -45°) would be easy enough with hydraulic cylinders. Then a pin would allow you to reverse it, but that would require leaving the seat.

There are probably a few ways to achieve the 360° rotation. Perhaps a large rotating table plus a large ring and pinion gear.

I'm not sure what would be able to donate a ring and pinion. A typical starter motor ring and pinion likely wouldn't be sturdy enough. Are there drive gears for a small dozer?

Perhaps head to a tractor recycler and see what strikes your fancy. Good heavy duty hub + the ring and pinion.

I like the idea of looking for a scrap small grader, or scrap mini excavator.

 

[CliffordK]

Somebody posted a link to TractorHouse a couple of days ago. Quite a resource.

https://www.tractorhouse.com/listings/dismantled-machines/mini-up-to-12000-lbs-excavators/1033

Parting out mini excavators. They may have the parts you'd need.

 

[ptsg]

Another way could be using the motor for rotation, then adding a small cylinder that would push a pin through a hole on a round plate full of holes. This cylinder would lock the blade in position.

A crossover relief valve could be added to the motor in case you forgot to lock the blade, so it would just let go before causing any damage.

If you're limited by number of remotes, a diverter valve could be used to switch the control valve between motor and cylinder.

This way does require "finding" the right position so the pins goes in the hole but still better than leaving the tractor all the time to adjust the blade in my opinion.

Also, I say small cylinder, as in small diameter, so it doesn't have enough force to bend stuff if the pin is not aligned with the hole.

 

[4570Man]

How often do you need 360° rotation? Are you switching between pushing and pulling a lot?

90° rotation (+45°, -45°) would be easy enough with hydraulic cylinders. Then a pin would allow you to reverse it, but that would require leaving the seat.

There are probably a few ways to achieve the 360° rotation. Perhaps a large rotating table plus a large ring and pinion gear.

I'm not sure what would be able to donate a ring and pinion. A typical starter motor ring and pinion likely wouldn't be sturdy enough. Are there drive gears for a small dozer?

Perhaps head to a tractor recycler and see what strikes your fancy. Good heavy duty hub + the ring and pinion.

I like the idea of looking for a scrap small grader, or scrap mini excavator.

I was thinking go with the much easier hydraulic cylinder angle plan and put a cutting edge on both sides of the blade so it wouldn’t need to spin 360.

 

[jyoutz]

I was thinking go with the much easier hydraulic cylinder angle plan and put a cutting edge on both sides of the blade so it wouldn’t need to spin 360.

A cutting edge on the backside of the blade would defeat the purpose for spinning it around. The purpose is to use the smooth non-cutting side to move snow or smooth gravel without cutting into the gravel roadbed.

 

[CliffordK]

Another way could be using the motor for rotation, then adding a small cylinder that would push a pin through a hole on a round plate full of holes. This cylinder would lock the blade in position.

A crossover relief valve could be added to the motor in case you forgot to lock the blade, so it would just let go before causing any damage.

If you're limited by number of remotes, a diverter valve could be used to switch the control valve between motor and cylinder.

This way does require "finding" the right position so the pins goes in the hole but still better than leaving the tractor all the time to adjust the blade in my opinion.

Also, I say small cylinder, as in small diameter, so it doesn't have enough force to bend stuff if the pin is not aligned with the hole.

I was thinking of something similar. My new brush rake has a series of holes and a pivot. All manual. It seems to be easy enough to orient. But the thing is also a bit flimsy if one was to use it a lot. Nonetheless, it works quite easily. And, even more or less spins 360 degrees.

Is the tractor open cab or closed cab? If open cab, then then one could use a series of notches and a spring loaded lever to catch the notch with a string up to the cab.

Anyway, by putting all the strength into the notches and levers, the operation force would be off of the rotation mechanism (ring and pinion).

 

[TractorBluez]

Yes, unfortunately I do switch from pushing to pulling a lot as I'm doing multiple small driveways in a subdivision without a lot of room to maneuver. I like your ideas about a large ring and pinion gear setup, but I'm most intrigued by D & D's heavy duty worm gear setup. Wouldn't the forces from the blade be on the worm gear and not transfer to the hydraulic motor?

 

[Sportsman762]

Another option would be to use a hydraulic rotary actuator. They are made to have much more torque than motors and provide a controllable rotation. Most do not have 360 degree rotation. To get the torque you need you would most likely need a double rack unit.

 

[CliffordK]

Thinking of another way to stop rotation would be with a brake. Hydraulic Disc or Drum?

You'll need some kind of a hydraulic on/off valve, and a pressure regulator to get the pressure down to something the brake system can deal with.

 

[bcp]

360* Rotating Back Blade Project

I hope you find this an interesting story and project, it has many different paths along the way that lead to an incredible friendship and collaborative effort. If it were not for an interesting turn of events, the results of what you are about to see would not have been possible - This will...

www.tractorbynet.com

Bruce

 

[4570Man]

Yes, unfortunately I do switch from pushing to pulling a lot as I'm doing multiple small driveways in a subdivision without a lot of room to maneuver. I like your ideas about a large ring and pinion gear setup, but I'm most intrigued by D & D's heavy duty worm gear setup. Wouldn't the forces from the blade be on the worm gear and not transfer to the hydraulic motor?

The worm drive setup is pretty common on cranes and wreckers. They use it because it will lock the rotation without a secondary brake. Most vehicles windows use a worn drive setup to roll them up and down because they lock the windows up and you can’t force them down.

 

[redman135]

Some back blades have teeth all the way around on the blades angle setting. Combine this with a mid sized excavator(3-8 ton) slew motor.
1) how would it be mounted?
2) do you have the hydraulic flow to drive the slew motor.
Good luck