hydraulic oil leak near left front wheel

Kaon99 · Feb 7, 2018

Hi Guys,
Looks like the wheel motor bolts are REALLY stuck. The box wrench works fine but now I am afraid I will shear off the bolt head if I use stronger torque. I have been researching what others have done with stuck/rusted on bolts. I will try some of the more conservative methods. Definitely do not want to make a bad situation worse. Also read up on penetrating oil and have ordered some Kroil oil which supposedly is better than PB Blaster. Can't buy it from a store like NAPA. I ordered it on Amazon and will get it this coming Monday. Also, I have a welding shop friend I will consult with. If you guys know of any "magic" methods, Please let me know. Thanks - Ken

SpringHollow · Feb 7, 2018

If they are blocked by the hub, is the hub removable so you can use an impact wrench?

Ken

woodlandfarms · Feb 7, 2018

I have a ton of tricks. Do you know what size head the bolts are on your machine? What part of the world are you in? Kroil is brilliant if you have patience. What I am heading toward is either crows feet or a specialty wrench as your first line of defense if you cannot get the hub off. Crows foot, socket and a breaker bar will get those bolts loose.

Heat is your next best friend. If you can get apocket torch on to the back end of the bolt (I assume it is exposed) put a bunch of heat on the bolt. Then use wax, like clear candle wax, and that will seep up the threads and break off the rust. My feeling is, though, your issue is leverage.

Crows foot would by my first plan, if you break it you can go to a offset socket. But try for a crows foot on a socket and then a breaker bar.

Oh and make sure you are going the right way. The bolts on the left go down, the bolts on the right go up to loosen... (faceing the tub).

Kaon99 · Feb 7, 2018

Hi Guys,
Thanks for holding my hand on this. Take a look at the photos I posted on 2/4/2018. The third one on the right shows the top 2 of the 4 bolts that hold on the wheel motor. The bolts just below the hydraulic fluid lines and behind the notched metal disc that serves as a brake. The bolts are 3/4" and I assume they back out going CCW. The is not much space between the notched metal brake disc and the wheel motor. I can get a box wrench in there but not much else (my socket wrenches won't fit in the space).

I'm pretty much a non-mechanic and don't know what a crows foot is. I assume a breaker bar is something to increase the leverage on a standard length wrench. Is that right? I am considering heating the metal surrounding the bolt with a propane torch, but don't know how safe that is with all the oil in the wheel motor. What do you think? As I said earlier, I am afraid to just use more torque for fear of shearing of the bolt head. My research says the main job is to break of the crystallized rust bond between the bolt and the grooves in the wheel motor housing. Some suggested just tapping on the bolt and wheel motor housing might help to breakup the rust bonding. Has anyone had any success with that? Again, thanks for your comments and suggestions. - Ken

woodlandfarms · Feb 8, 2018

IMO you are reasonably safe torching an oily piece of metal. It will smoke, might even burn, but won't go very far. now catch your hose on fire and, well, thats going to be a stinker. I am suggesting you hold off on flame. Its one of those things that can get away from you if you are not well versed in the needs of your project.

Here is a Crows Foot. It goes on a socket wrench.

SAE Crowsfoot Wrench Set - Crows Foot Wrench Set - Amazon.com

a breaker bar is totally necessary tool with a PT. Either they put the bolts on too loose or too tight but I swear no one usese a torque wrench at the factory. (the one I grabbed fom amazon seems pretty short, it is just for reference)

Capri Tools 3/8 Inch Drive Extension Breaker Bar, 159 ft-lb, 12 inches - - Amazon.com

So there are a few more tricks. Do you have box wrenches (Adjustables are not a great idea for what you are trying to do). If so, you can "daisy chain" box wrenches. Not 100% adviseable but I see pros do it all the time.

Two Wrench Leverage Trick. Using 2 wrenches to increase leverage on a tight nut or bolt. - YouTube

Huh, Just found this bad boy... its an idea.

Wrench Extender is an Elegant Cheater Bar

Look, one thing you need to be prepared for is breaking a tool. I doubt you will but you might have to go that far. If this was my project, I would use a crows foot, my breaker bar and put a pipe on the end of the breaker bar to extend the leverage. And as I am pushing this around, keep my face and other body parts out of the firing line if the wrench should break. My BIL who is a mechanic is a burly dude, doesn't know his own strength. He breaks tools constantly so it happens.

SpringHollow · Feb 8, 2018

I have never had any luck using wax even though I know a bunch of people that swear by it. So is the worst case that you snap all of the heads off? Then the motor would come off and you could then use left hand drills, easy outs etc? Or am I missing something?

Ken

woodlandfarms · Feb 8, 2018

Me neither on the wax but guys swear by it. Heat is a good go to but in the end it is just muscle. Tools can take quite a bit.

SpringHollow · Feb 8, 2018

Well, I get to look forward to these issues since my muffler is paper thin. I ma not looking forward to removing the bolts from the head. I have PB Blaster but i should probably get kroil. I do not remember if you can get an impact in there or not.

Ken

woodlandfarms · Feb 8, 2018

The tops will come off with a shallow socket, maybe a gimbal socket extenstion and a long socket. The bottoms where a different nightmare. Had to use a wrench with the poor mans extension (another wrench) but they came off. Yup, hit with Kroil or PB and let soak overnight would have helped my situation but I was impatient.

As an FYI, the Deutz specialist said that everyone puts the intake and exhaust on the head first before reinstalling on the machine.

ponytug · Feb 8, 2018

Man, I am glad you guys shared your wax stories. I couldn't get it to work, and I am surrounded by guys who swear by it. Go figure. Yes to Kroil and PB from me.

Do try to put the penetrating oil on, hit it with heat, preferably very focused (MAPP/ Oxypropane), and then more penetrating oil when it is hot. I will hit the holt bolt with a hammer to help try and fracture things loose. The idea behind the heat is that you want to heat the bolt differently from the frame. In this case, better to heat the bolt, and have the heat move to the frame.

If you can, and it looks like you might be able to, use an impact wrench with an extended anvil to get onto the sockets. The impact wrench is a huge, huge improvement on just torquing the living daylights out of it.

Your hub is probably as frozen on as your bolts, but it may be the long run easiest way to go. i.e. remove the hub, then use an impact wrench on the bolts.

Just my $.02

Good luck!

All the best, Peter

woodlandfarms said:
As an FYI, the Deutz specialist said that everyone puts the intake and exhaust on the head first before reinstalling on the machine.