Hydraulics partially not working at high RPM

[Th french mechanic]

Hello
I'm French and I own a 69' Ford 3000 tractor made in Belgium. I've recently mounted a Quicke 2200E front loader on it.
The hydraulic spool valve has a remote joystick. From the beginning, I've been having a weird problem, at idle, the loader works normally but is quite slow (30 sec from down to up), and if you press the pedal a little to increase the RPMs, the loader stops working but the lift operates normally. Last Saturday, I borrowed a hydraulic pressure tester to check if the "security valve" was opening at the right pressure. It was a little low, it is now set to approximately 165 bars (2400 psi).
Every time I increase the RPMs a little, the loader stops working but the lift operates normally.
Hydraulic oil was drained 10 hours ago, the return filter has been changed, and the spool valve is brand new and is manufactured by Badestnost. On the right side of the tractor, there are 2 hoses, the little one was cut when the clutch was replaced. The closest to the pump end goes to the Pressure plug, the other end goes to the carry-over plug. A return line was installed.
Please tell me if I'm correct, If the RPMs are higher, there should be more flow and so the loader should operate faster.
Do you have any idea about what is going on?
Thanks

 

[Gordon Gould]

I can't help you but here is another thread posted about a week ago with a slow problematic Quickie Loader.....Maybe the two can get it figured out.

Quickie loader, very slow. WHY?

On a 1997 Kubota M5400 with 800 hours. Curl up/down is slow, lift is slow, lower is normal speed, breakout force seems weak too. No leaks or leakdowns. Changing fluid/filters didn't help. I just inherited this very clean tractor and don't know a lot about hydraulics. I presume I should...

www.tractorbynet.com

gg

 

[Harry in Ky]

Your diagram as drawn looks like it SHOULD work. However, in the photos I can't see the three lines from the loader valve to the tractor. The "carry over" line you mentioned. Is that a power beyond fitting mounted in the N port of the valve? Second question. I only see one work port being used on the first spool of the loader valve. Is that because that circuit has only single acting cylinders? If so, the valve is no doubt set for double acting cylinders and only using one port will cause problems. Another question. The relief valve you adjusted (assuming that's what you called a security valve). Was that the one on the loader valve or the one in the tractor?

 

[oldnslo]

What happens if you increase the engine speed and move the lever to raise the loader very slowly? If it raises slowly move the lever to raise loader faster. If suddenly stops moving I would suspect one of the quick disconnects is faulty.

I presume the “lift” is the 3 point arms on the rear of the tractor. Do these work if you try to raise the loader at the time as the lift?

 

[Th french mechanic]

Your diagram as drawn looks like it SHOULD work. However, in the photos I can't see the three lines from the loader valve to the tractor. The "carry over" line you mentioned. Is that a power beyond fitting mounted in the N port of the valve? Second question. I only see one work port being used on the first spool of the loader valve. Is that because that circuit has only single acting cylinders? If so, the valve is no doubt set for double acting cylinders and only using one port will cause problems. Another question. The relief valve you adjusted (assuming that's what you called a security valve). Was that the one on the loader valve or the one in the tractor?

The photo is old and at that moment i missed a fitting. Now the 3 lines are connected to the valve. I do have a spécial fitting for the Carry over, which i bought with the valve. The cylinders which go up and down are single acting. The "thing" in the valve was changed for a simple acting one.
It is the one on the valve. It has a little orange cap on the photo.
Thanks for your help.

 

[Th french mechanic]

What happens if you increase the engine speed and move the lever to raise the loader very slowly? If it raises slowly move the lever to raise loader faster. If suddenly stops moving I would suspect one of the quick disconnects is faulty.

I presume the “lift” is the 3 point arms on the rear of the tractor. Do these work if you try to raise the loader at the time as the lift?

I'll try that on Saturday.
The female quick couplers are brand new. The mâle are the loader's original ones.
They do not work when using the joystick. I think it is normal because the valve takes all the flow from the pump, stopping the flow from the Carry over port.

 

[oldnslo]

Is there a vent or air bleed on the rod end of the lift cylinders? If no is there a plug you can remove to see if that end of the cylinder is full of oil potentially stopping or slowing the lift?

 

[Th french mechanic]

Is there a vent or air bleed on the rod end of the lift cylinders? If no is there a plug you can remove to see if that end of the cylinder is full of oil potentially stopping or slowing the lift?

I don't think there is a vent, I'll check that on Saturday. The dumping double-acting cylinder also seems to act slowly, so the lift cylinders shouldn't have that problem.

On the Quicke parts view, I cannot see any kind of bleeder

 

[Th french mechanic]

I've done some calculation about the theoric lifting speed.
The cylinder has a stroke of 58cm the diameter is 7cm
The hydraulic flow is supposed to be about 22 l per min (5gal/min)
There are 2 cylinders
2*58*3.5*3.5*3.14= 4.5 liters
4.5/22*60=12.5 seconds. For the moment it takes 30 secs to go from down to up
With the loss, it should be between 15 and 20 sec at high rpm.
The doc says 4.8 gpm at 2000 rpm
At idle (1000 rpm), 2.4 gpm = 10 l/min. =At idle, it should take about 30 sec. The hydraulic pump flow is correct.

 

[oldnslo]

Your math all seems correct on calculated lift times. But if I am understanding correctly you still cannot raise the loader with engine RPM above idle. Is that correct?

If yes can you install your pressure gauge in the pressure line to the loader valve. Watch the gauge as you raise the loader with engine at idle and then with increased engine RPM.
Doing this will let you you know if something is suddenly flow shifting and blocking flow to the loader.

Try same test with curl dump to see if they operate in similar fashion.