If you're causcasian you're in big trouble

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   / If you're causcasian you're in big trouble
  • Thread Starter
#61  
Re: If you\'re causcasian you\'re in big trouble

It wasn't Iowa Chuck it was the law. They initially won the case and it was appealed. It went all the way to the Supreme Court who upheld it.
 
   / If you're causcasian you're in big trouble #62  
Re: If you\'re causcasian you\'re in big trouble

<font color=blue>One thing, we need to get rid of is the UN ...Screw the UN</font color=blue>

Can someone please explain to me where the UN derives it's moral authority to impose "law and order" on any nation? The ambassadors are not elected by the nation they are supposed to represent and usurp the authority of our Congress (and the authority of other nations )by making international laws that run counter to our national beliefs. Every nation has the right to self-determination. While the UN claims a peaceful mandate, they have repeatedly shown their willingness to impose their will on non-complying nations with occupation armies (peacekeepers).

The US foots the majority of the expense for these illegal occupations and then Kofi Annon has the [censored] to threaten to remove the US from the Security Council for failing to pay our "dues". I'm with 3 Crows, screw the UN. If the US walked away and told them all to get the heck out of New York (maybe they could be headquartered in Africa somewhere) the UN would be exposed for what they really are, a house of mirrors.

While we're at it, screw the EU too, can't trust anyone but the Canadians. /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif
 
   / If you're causcasian you're in big trouble #63  
Re: If you\'re causcasian you\'re in big trouble

<font color=blue>If Iowa made this really stupid settlement, the officals responsible should be recalled. No new law is needed.</font color=blue>

The law will hopefully prevent future frivolous law suites from occuring. BTW, the teachers union fought this law to the end. Why? If students need bi-lingual education, that requires more teachers. But remember, they are doing it for the children (excuse me while I puke).
 
   / If you're causcasian you're in big trouble #64  
Re: If you\'re causcasian you\'re in big trouble

Cowboydoc,

I tried to find that Supreme Court ruling. The only thing close I found was Alexander vs Sandoval, where a woman In Alabama apparently sued because she couldn't pass a driving test in English....I didn't read the whole thing so I could have that wrong. However, the court ruled against her, basically supporting your view that English should be required. Are you sure about the Iowa ruling?

Chuck
 
   / If you're causcasian you're in big trouble #65  
Re: If you\'re causcasian you\'re in big trouble

tres crows, My work has taken me to England. I have talked to several "English" although mostly military and military industrial complex types (Royal Navy, British Aerospace, etc.) and universally their #1 complaint is that there are no English people in England anymore. Lots of British subjects but fewer and fewer English. Sure they all have pet peeves but the intersection of their discontent virtually always was or contained concern that they (the English) had lost or were losing their own country. The parallel chilled me.

******
Someone said, "The only ones that are hurt by not speaking english are the ones not speaking english."

Is it true that the only ones hurt by not wearing seatbelts are the ones not wearing seatbelts? Do taxes collected from only non-seatbelt wearers go to pay for medical costs incurred by non-seatbelt wearers? I DON"T THINK SO!

Are only law breakers taxed to pay for the cost to society of laws being broken?
******
Given the socialistic pressures contained in our various taxation schema, various forms of public assistance, and welfare, anyone or any group that produces less for any reason gets subsidized by the more effective prolducers. Who thinks being non-English speaking in the US is a monetary advantage?
*****
I am not happy to talk to computers instead of live folks but it really incenses me to have to "a tocar uno para Engles" or whatever it is in Espanol.

****
I'm not anti hispanic but I am anti free ride. I know there is severe poverty in Mexico and other parts of Latin America and the world and that like in the song, "Everything free in America, for you and me in America." Welfare in the US is often much higher than the average wage of working folks in impoverished nations. This is a magnet. Our liberal friends want to tax the productive members of society to be able to "MAKE IT OK" for everyone. It won't work. The US is viewed to be a lifeboat and everyone struggles to climb aboard with our liberal frieds helping pull folks aboard oblivious to the outcome being different from their intentions. Like a live boat if everyone tries to climb aboard it could sink, a bad outcome for everyone.

*****

I would be pleased to have someone set forth a logical, communicable, and concise argument/explanation of what is the positive benefit to the US of A of having Spanish be a co-language. Defend, if you will why it is better to foster the innabilitiy to communicate among citizens of our nation as opposed to having one official lanlguage, English.

It isn't a matter of majority rule and when there are more hispanics we should do business in Spanish. Right now English is the "lingua franca" of the world, the language of international business, air traffic control etc. Esparanto (sp?) was tried as a neutral jingoism free universal communicator and failed. From a practical standpoint English is it. Most of us are lucky it is our first language. Why encourage a segment of our population to be cut off from the benefits of speaking English? Why permit the costs to be encurred because we try to accomodate everyone. We can welcome everyone and offer everyone opportunity to work like the rest of us and speak English in the workplace like the rest of us. We were supposed to be the great melting pot not the great smorgasbord.

I have no dificulty with immigrants retaining a cultural flavor of their herritage or of some of that herritage being absorbed into "the great melting pot" and effecting new generations of Americans. We will improve as a culture by retaining the strengths of our constituent ingredients as an alloyed blend but by remaining separate. An alloy is often better in many ways than any of the ingredients alone. In some circles this is sometimes refered to as hybrid vigor and is a good thing.

I don't want my country to deny anyone the right to free speach in any language they care to use and would never condone the outlawing of a language like the English did to the Irish or the Americans did in the past to indians BUT I see no benefit in the long run to accomodating other languages as a permanent adjustment. What is so damned special or retarded about hispanics in their language ability that they can't do what most immagrants did and learn English? We could all be communicating in English, except for new arrivals, within 6 months to a year if we had the will to stop trying to accomodate everyone and let everyone adjust to America.

Why must we be like the proud mother viewing her son's group on parade at boot camp graduation when she said, "Gee isn't Johnny marching real good, too bad all the rest of the Army is out of step!" Why should we have to try to get in step with any/all immigrant groups when they came to OUR COUNTRY and should get into step with us. What is wrong with this picture? Non-English speaking folks come to our country and demand that we offer them economic opportunity, political freedom, religious freedom, and on and on and that we do everything for them in their language. Pretty good deal, huh? How far would I get as a guest at your house if I expected you to do everything for me AND communicate with me in my language for my convenience because I just want the hospitality and protection of your household with no effort on my part to fit in. How about if I want to play with your routine and have you sleep in two four hour periods, one from 7 toll 11 AM and the other from 8 to 12 PM with 5 meals a day on a rotating schedlule.

If you don't want to be an American, don't come. If you don't want to have to deal with the English language, don't come. Part of being American is communicating with your fellow Americans, IN ENGLISH! On my patio we can have natchos and muchas cervesas frias but at the office lets talk English to our customers some of which are trying very hard to be good American citizens and learn to conduct business in English and being from somewhere else in the world, like Eurpope, Asia, near east, or whatever don't speak Spanish.

Patrick
 
   / If you're causcasian you're in big trouble #66  
Re: If you\'re causcasian you\'re in big trouble

If English has become the de facto language of air travel and business, without the U.S. declaring by law that English is our official language, don't you think we might manage to squeek by for a while without having to learn Spanish or some other language, and still be able to function in this country without such a law? Huge problems. Terrible crises. Outrageous this and that. Relax. Have a homebrew. Drive your tractor....perhaps not in that order.

Chuck
 
   / If you're causcasian you're in big trouble #67  
Re: If you\'re causcasian you\'re in big trouble

Richard, I followed up on Chuck's post with a Lexis search on the terms "Iowa," "Mexican," "English," and "education" in a database which includes all federal cases (trial, appellate, and Supreme Court) and came up dry. Maybe you got some bad information here?
 
   / If you're causcasian you're in big trouble
  • Thread Starter
#68  
Re: If you\'re causcasian you\'re in big trouble

Did you check the Iowa supreme court? I don't even know where to go look for this stuff so I can't tell you for sure on it. This information came from the Senator about how the bill got started in the first place.
 
   / If you're causcasian you're in big trouble #69  
Re: If you\'re causcasian you\'re in big trouble

Iowa cases on same search pertain only to whether a criminal defendant with language barrier could participate in his own defense.
 
   / If you're causcasian you're in big trouble #70  
Re: If you\'re causcasian you\'re in big trouble

Chuck, I missed your point. What is the advantage, economic or otherwise, to not having English as the official language of the US? The rest of the world were driven to English by the overwhelming force of the market place and their perception of how using English was to their economic advantage. It is precisely because no one catered to them in all of their different languages that they would adopt one as being better than many. Having a common language is what counts not which one but English was preeminent because of our presence in the marketplace.

Here inside the US we do cater to folks with other languages, especially Spanish, removing much of the incentive that would encourage the use of English and make their segment of the population more economically viable. To a degree our helpfulness is exceedingly poor paternalism since if they learned to communicate in English it would improve their economic outlook.

Catering to folks so they don't have to go mainstream guarantees a linguistically crippled underclass that is marginalized. Who benefits? Why would/should we want that?

What is there about legally securing America's communications with the market place of the world that you don't like? What is the downside of declaring English the official language of the US or any part therein? No one is suggesting concentration camps for non-English speakers or sterilization, or economic penalty beyond that imposed by the inability to communicate in the mainstream of the country they claim to desire to be a part of. Unfortunately the economic penalty does not just fall on the non-English speaker but all of the tax paying society.

Patrick
 
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