Is Kioti introducing larger models than DK65?

[Mac624]

I´m not sure why You complaining about the badness of bigger Kiotis. But we don´t only change opinions. If we ask the Guys in NZ or OZ about the facts we´ll get ´em.
When I´m going around in my area, and see more and more JD tractors and more Fendt like in former years...is that a fact or an opinion?
When a friend of mine, who is a CNH dealer tells me, that he lost sale to JD and Same-Deutz-Fahr, is this a fact or a opinion?
for facts try this:http://agmachinery.proboards1.com/index.cgi?action=login2
go there and ask Your question, the guys there will help You out with the facts, even they´ll give Your the sources, where to find them.
or are You afraid, that the facts won´t fit to Your opinion?
Smaller asian tractors, not matter what brand, aren´t bad.
But they aren´t that sucsess in other countries, then in asia and US. And that is a fact...and not an opinion.

 

[KiotiJohn]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( I´m not sure why You complaining about the badness of bigger Kiotis. )</font>
It wasn't I who complained about the "badness" of large Kioti tractors. One really should read the posts to know what's going on. John

 

[Woodbeef]

I think what Mac624 is trying to say is our sources are credible. Are they published no,but not everything is these days not even on the internet. I'd put alot more faith in my sources then what is on the web anyday!! Did you ever check with the Kioti Importers in NZ about these problems?

 

[jdkid]

Hi ya's
Long time between drinks with ya's ,now i got asked to come here and see whats being said ..true the daedong tractors "kinda!" sold well here same as the other asian brands ,Yes some probs in the bigger sizes manly with FEL's and axle probs as for reports on probs I don't know any outfit case, JD etc etc who will go online and say they have a prob ..we had a recall on a 160 Hp JD years ago was it a full page ad NO it was a letter to say some one will be coming to fix it same with case and claas guys just rung up and said they will be coming to fix a small prob ..the asian tractor builders in the smaller sized tractors are in alot of cases miles ahead of the big guys BUT 90 Hp + you are in a diffrent ball game .also a point to note !!! the tractors in japan ya see many FEL's on them ? or see many in hevey load work ?
cya's
JD Kid

 

[KiotiJohn]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( Yes some probs in the bigger sizes manly with FEL's and axle probs as for reports on probs I don't know any outfit case, JD etc etc who will go online and say they have a prob .. )</font>
Yes, you're right, and I never thought that any company is going to do so. However, we all know that ALL brands have problems with some of their tractors, and there will be problems with "some" front ends, no matter what.
I doubt seriously though that any company is going to have problem after problem and not change the design if it's not working.
As for Woodbeef asking if I've contacted the importers to find out about these problems, why would you think they'd tell me that? They're the importers who are hoping to make money on the tractors. I don't think it would behoove them to pass along bad news, do you?
While the companies won't tell of the problems, there are usually some publications, reviews etc. that do publish issues with tractors, and I haven't seen any on this problem, search as I may. I don't think it means there aren't problems, but just not to the extent that Woodbeef seems to advocate.
Presenting chat room or forum talk as fact is the problem I've had with this whole post. Fact is indisputable evidence, not the observations of people who get together and discuss their common interests. A better way to have brought up this subject would be to say that it has been said that the Kioti's have problems with their front end tractors while using FELs, not to state it as a fact that one can't prove besides bringing in other people to say the same thing. It would probably be fact to say that all tractor makers have problems with some of their tractors, and some have more problems than others. That doesn't mean that someone shouldn't buy from any particular manufacturer, just that one should be careful and investigate before buying. John

 

[jdkid]

Hi ya
well put ..ya will find if asked a lot of dealers will get the butter will not melt look on there faces a good one may say "don't buy a pre 97 or a MK 2 as these had probs " (just useing a date and model not meaning any thing in this forum)..i think bottom line is some brands or the way they are set up are more prone to have probs ..and in some cases with loader work there have been cases of this brand haveing probs while useing FEL's ..the fact's woody used i know are from a guy who has seen this first hand not hear say being passed on ..i have owned another brand tractor and seen the front end fly to bit's at 1000 hours (130 Hp) it dose happen and over loading the front with FELs doing hard work seems to be the common factor in all cases
catch ya
JD Kid

 

[LedgeMagnet]

There are so many variables in any empirical study of tractor reliablility that we are not likely to get the answer that way, even with so complicated study that no one would fund it. If you look at it mechanically, the side load in a bevel gear setup could be a weak point. That load finds its way to the bearings. This may well not matter in practice in many circumstances, but under greater loads and with more hours, it just might. A bevel gear setup with worn bearings is more at risk mechanically than a planetary setup, and the greater the bearing wear, the greater the forces that tend to wear the bearings. All bearings wear from the time they are put into use, and design issues that may mean nothing with new parts may matter a great deal as parts wear. From that perspective, it is at least reasonable to think Woodbeef might be right.

As an example, I have owned a few older tractors which seemed to be designed so that they would keep working when the pieces are REALLY worn out. Take the "bull gear" setup, for example: the bearings there would have to be totally shot before the mechanism would be compromised. I wonder if newer tractors are designed more on how they will work new and not enough on whether they will work old, and beatup.

 

[KiotiJohn]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( I wonder if newer tractors are designed more on how they will work new and not enough on whether they will work old, and beatup. )</font>
Yes, that's certainly something to think about. I'm never surprised to hear that tractors have problems we all wish they didn't. ALL brands have, at times, major issues that have to be worked out of their models, and I'm sure Kioti is no exception. I can't help feeling that if they continue to have front end problems that they will do something to correct the issue in order to stay in business.
One thing I've noticed, however, is that often, as in the auto industry, there are a few lemons that get a lot of attention and the millions of problem free ones don't get publicity.
Humans tend to lump things into a category based on what they have heard, not necessarily what the whole picture is.
Someone PM'd me to say that they he had front end problems on his DK55 a few times, broken axle, and was trying to get his money back. Now that's one out of many many more that have been sold, and it's most likely the problem I mentioned, a lemon mixed in with many good ones. He didn't want to post publicly so as not to prejudice his case, and I understand that. I'm aware, as we all are that there will be lemons in any company. I hope Woodbeef is incorrect about the extent of the problem on the much larger Kioti models because they have a pretty darned good product in general. I'm sure they will correct the problems for the sake of longevity of brand. John