Is this safe? (PTO shaft/rotary cutter)

bill333 · Sep 8, 2009

Soundguy said:
tsc sells clutches that fit smooth bore gearbox shafts, and have a spline end for a pto shaft..

soundguy

I'll look today. unfortunately my pto shaft does not have a spline end, it has the cross joint (?) which I assume is how the yoke attaches to a smooth bore on the pto shaft. the current system has a flange that is attached to the yoke, it bolts onto the current slip clutch.

aczlan · Sep 8, 2009

bill333 said:
I'll look today. unfortunately my pto shaft does not have a spline end, it has the cross joint (?) which I assume is how the yoke attaches to a smooth bore on the pto shaft. the current system has a flange that is attached to the yoke, it bolts onto the current slip clutch.

The slip clutch hooks onto the shaft coming off of the gearbox which will be splined or smooth, that is what is being referred to.

Aaron Z

Soundguy · Sep 8, 2009

He'll figure it out when he see's them on the shelf.

soundguy

bill333 · Sep 8, 2009

okay, here's what happened at 2 different TSCs, (at one I found a very helpful guy).
I tried to buy the 'back end' of the pto shaft (a longer one) plus a new slip clutch. the problem was that the shafts ended in a yoke, but we could not find the second yoke to fit that would have the spline end. (nor did they have the cross coupling, but that was moot).

So I ended up buying a totally new PTO shaft and a new slip clutch. Cost me $325. However, when I got home, I now cannot take off the old slip clutch from the mower. Either I'm not understanding how it is put on, or it is rusted so badly it won't break free.

There was a c clip on the front (tractor end) of the slip clutch, which I removed. I assumed, perhaps incorrectly, that the slip clutch would then just slide off the splined part of the mower, but it wouldn't budge. Looking at the parts diagram, there appears to be a 'hub' on the front as well, but only 1/8 inch is visible, and I couldn't figure out how to grab hold of it to see if it would turn.

I sprayed in a lot of rust buster stuff but it doesn't move...any suggestions?

6sunset6 · Sep 8, 2009

torch

bill333 · Sep 8, 2009

yes, I guess so. I'm trying to reach hardee just to make sure that there is nothing else holding the clutch on the spline...

Soundguy · Sep 9, 2009

look for thru bolts, side bolts / buttons or retainer pins

post a good pic of it as well.

last option is to split the hub with a grinder 99% thru 180' apart and just stay out of the input shaft metal.. then split with a cold chissle..

soundguy

bill333 · Sep 9, 2009

I spoke with hardee today. they tell me that nothing else holds the slip clutch on; it was just the clip. they suggest I use a gear puller (which I don't have but I assume is easy to buy), centering it on the spline and putting the ears on the flange, and get it off that way.

Soundguy · Sep 9, 2009

3 arm jaw puller set u back about 20$.. can get them at parts stores.. chinese parts stores.. flea market tool places.. etc..

soundguy

Soundguy · Sep 9, 2009

hit it with some penetrating oil and let it soak too.. hit the exposed splines with a wire brush to remove any debri that might make an interference fit hard..

soundguy

bill333 · Sep 11, 2009

thanks. I tried everything I can think of. let the penetrating oil soak in, hitting it with a hammer, using a gear puller on it until the puller wouldn't budge -- it won't move a bit.

greg_g · Sep 11, 2009

bill333 said:
thanks. I tried everything I can think of. let the penetrating oil soak in, hitting it with a hammer, using a gear puller on it until the puller wouldn't budge -- it won't move a bit.

Well, that PDF I pointed to way back when shows both current PTO shaft variants have push-pin locks on both ends. See http://www.hardeebyevh.com/images/shopcart/items/31.pdf pages 6 and 7

I'm wondering if your older style PTO shaft might not have a similar push-pin lock that's gripped by a slot in the transmission input shaft (?). If yes, it too is likely either jammed or rusted solid like the clutch - and might explain your current lack of success.

//greg//

bill333 · Sep 12, 2009

Greg,
Thanks for the message. If yo are referring to the PTO shaft that goes between the tractor and the implement, I had no problem removing that at all; it is attached via a flange.
As for the slip clutch, there IS a hole in the splined shaft that the slip clutch slides onto, but that hole is outside the slip clutch and is completely clear. The slip clutch is getting hung up before it is able to slide out that far.

greg_g · Sep 12, 2009

Yes I'm talking about the slip clutch end, but no - I'm not talking about that hole. That would be for a retaining bolt for yokes of that design.

Take a look at the PTO stub that sticks out the back of your tractor. It's got a groove ground around the circumference of the splines. A push-pin equipped yoke slides over the splines, after which the pin drops into the groove, locking the yoke in place on the shaft. I'm speculating that you may have such a groove on the transmission input shaft. And that - if once equipped - a push pin on the slip clutch may be stuck in that groove. You'll never see it till the yoke comes almost completely off.

Some designs use a round retaining clip to lock the yoke to the input shaft. If no push-pin, look for one of those too. It could be hidden under dirt/grease/rust, and can often be hard to get out without special pliers.

/greg/

bill333 · Sep 12, 2009

I understand. It actually did have a C clip holding it on, but I had taken that off.

Anyway, PARTIAL SUCCESS!
I finally managed to get the old slip clutch off, so I'm now going to try seeing if my new slip clutch plus new PTO shaft will fit...

I couldn't find any reason why it was so frozen on, other than some rust (but even that wasn't all that bad)

greg_g · Sep 12, 2009

bill333 said:
I'm now going to try seeing if my new slip clutch plus new PTO shaft will fit...

I hope you understand that you may have to "cut to fit". Most manufacturers include those instructions with the shaft, but it's not uncommon for farm stores to lose track of those instructions before the actual sale.

//greg//

bill333 · Sep 12, 2009

well, good news. the new slip clutch fit perfectly. only problem was that the new pto shaft I bought was a bit too long; I'll return it and get a shorter one. But I hooked everything up and I think it will be fine.

thanks to everyone for their help!

greg_g · Sep 12, 2009

bill333 said:
... the new pto shaft I bought was a bit too long; I'll return it and get a shorter one.

You're losing track of your topic here, that's what happens when you post in multiple threads. Because it seems you forgot that I asked you if you were prepared to cut that new shaft to fit......

I think that's another subject you need to study up on before trading that shaft in for one that may end up being too short.

//greg//

bill333 · Sep 14, 2009

thanks greg, you are right, I was torn between continuing the same thread and switching since the topic had kind of switched. anyway, when I bought the new shaft it looked like I needed the 48 inch from my measurement, and it DOES fit, but only when closed down to only having about 2 inches (in other words, should the shaft shorten by 2 inches, it would close completely). I didn't know if in the use of the mower there might be some movement in the shaft greater than 2 inches, so I am going to return it for the slightly shorter 42 inches( which is also $30 cheaper!); that would still give me about 8 inches of overlap on the shafts.
my measurement mistake was assuming that the pto shaft would slide all the way onto the mower spline before clicking in place (like my old shaft seemed to on the tractor end). but in this new pto shaft, the pin on the yoke unit is placed differently, so when it is slipped on the mower (and clicks in place) it sits out about 2 inches.