Jinma 284LE won't turn over

[Diamondpilot]

Just a addition to Greg's post. When you go to Napa or where ever to get your solenoid ask for a Ford Starter Solenoid. They have a 2 post and a 1 post type. Either will work but in Greg's example you are only using one of the little post and it will cost you $1-2 dollars more. The other small post is just left unused. You might as well get two of them why you are there because you are going to want to do the Glow Plug Upgrade via a second solenoid as Greg has mentioned.

Also just to clarify what Greg has said in his pictures you simply take the small wire off the starter and put it on the new solenoid on the "S" post. You then run a 10ga or heavier stranded wire from the positive terminal of the battery to one of the big post on the new solenoid. You then run another piece of 10ga or heavier stranded wire from the other big post of the new solenoid to the post from which you removed the small wire from on the starter. Make sure you mount the solenoid securely and ground it good and you will be starting much easier.


Chris

 

[markh1]

I'm still a little unclear on the relay/solenoid. Correct me if I'm wrong but my understanding is the solenoid is what's mounted on the starter where you hook up the positive battery post etc. At NAPA if I order a Ford 12 volt starter solenoid is that all they need? Does this new relay then connect to the original solenoid.
My other question is why it would turn over by jumping the starter before and since I cleaned it did I do something to it. I am going to do this but is there anything else I should be looking for.

Mark H

 

[Diamondpilot]

I guess I am a little lost here also. Your tractor would start with a screw driver prior to cleaning your starter but now it will not? If that is true Greg's trick will not work.

What he has you doing is mounting a second solenoid somewhere on the tractor, not on the starter. His thinking and mine also is that since you are only seeing 10 volts on the small wire going to the starter there is some voltage loss in the key switch/wiring. What he has you now doing is using that small wire with only 10 volts closing the "Ford Solenoid". When closed via the key switch it will now take 12+ volts from the battery via the new 10ga wires through the new solenoid and to the starter to activate the starters solenoid with full battery voltage or there abouts.

Chris

 

[greg_g]

You're being confused by the use of the word solenoid. What I recommended adding is a relay, not another solenoid. Factory wiring has a small gauge wire carrying voltage from the keyswitch to the starter solenoid. If insufficient voltage hits the solenoid, it may fail to kick the pinion gear far enough or hard enough - if at all. Adding a local relay will ensure that full battery voltage energize the starter solenoid. And I mounted my starter relay right to the starter motor housing with big spiral hose clamps.

But - if you're not even getting a click out of the solenoid or starter after reinstallation, I think you should re-examine how you wired it back up. You may have put the small wire on the wrong post.

//greg//

 

[SPIKER]

the other thing is you may have damaged the COIL inside the solenoid or the brushes when you disassembled and cleaned the starter... try ohming out the sol. from the small post to ground for resistance which should be very low 6~12 ohms. then do the same across the LARGE STARTER bolt that has the secondary solenoid side that will read the starter resistance from ground to the post through the brushes and windings. If you can't do this try the below items...

what the guys are saying above is that the factory KEY and WIRES do not put enough VOLTAGE/AMPERAGE onto the factory Solenoid to pull it all the way in every time. What they are suggesting is using a FORD STYLE starter relay/solenoid and adding it into the mix. the FORD "relay" would then be wired so that the FACTORY KEY & WIRES will turn on this ford relay and the ford relay will in-turn pull in and put voltage & High amperage onto the FACTORY solenoid. you will need to make a few extra wire connections to do this and it will help you in long run. but if you can not jump the starter with the screw driver as you had done in the past them you have some issues that will need to be fixed. to finish the wiring of the ford relay, you connect one wire large post of ford relay with the battery large post where the battery cable attaches to the starter. a 2nd wire then from the other side of the ford relay to the post on the OEM tractor solenoid. (where the old small key actuated wire used to go) that old Key actuated wire from the OEM tractor relay is removed and put onto the post of the ford relay and will pull it in when the key is turned to start.

You may need to buy the type of relay that uses a ground wire to ground out the relay other wise the standard ford relay uses a "case ground" and will need to be bolted directly onto the tractor frame/engine block or a wire ran to from ground/block to the case of the added relay. Also note that some ford relays have 2 small posts one is for the coil the other is a 12V out that was sent to older ford coils bypassing resistive wires to provide a full 12 volts to the coil during starting/cranking. these usually have an "S" and an "I" besides the terminals. "S" is Start or Solenoid and the "I" is Ignition.

I suggest checking the battery. (make sure you have a good 12.6 volts)
check and see if you can jump across the solenoid to rotate the starter, use 2 screw drivers and avoid the solenoid. won't pull in but should spin. BE SURE THE GEAR SHIFT IS IN NEUTRAL BEFORE MESSING WITH THIS!!!

next is to remove and clean battery connections. both at the frame and at the battery and at the starter. also check for broken main battery cable between battery and starter and frame...


mark m

 

[Ranch_Hand_Supp]

But - if you're not even getting a click out of the solenoid or starter after reinstallation, I think you should re-examine how you wired it back up. You may have put the small wire on the wrong post.

//greg//

How could he have done that without changeing the wire terminal ?? There is only one small wire and one small wire terminal ??



Ronald
Ranch Hand Supply

 

[greg_g]

Unless you've actually seen his starter Ronald, I'd rather wait for Mark's response - than to spar with you. I've seen starter solenoids with up to three small posts. The extra posts are typically for supply. But I think you already know that. If in fact his solenoid is of the single small post variety, we simply move one and look for another cause.

//greg//

 

[irwin]

Since the starter will no longer "jump" with a screwdriver after Mark took it apart, and then did a connection cleaning, the problems that jump into my mind are.....

Does this have any fuses or relays for the starter circuit he could have damaged/shorted accidentally?

Starter or wiring wasn't reassembled properly.

Perhaps the starter itself was on it's way out and it's a coincidence that it worked before and not after.


Once you get this anomaly resolved then you can do the Ford starter solenoid (relay) add on to address low voltage to solenoid.

 

[Affordable]

If the starter will no longer jump accross with a screwdriver you are going to have to find out what happened ,because no matter how many wires or relays you put on it's not going to work.I think that the main problem is in the starter/solenoid and you should either take it to a starter shop or buy a new one,while I know wire size may be a problem,there are thousands of these tractors wired with the same wire size as his and are working everyday,his was working also until something happened to it.I would put the new starter on,run a new wire from the key switch to the solenoid and be back working the tractor within a couple of hours.Just my 2-cents.

Tommy
Affordable Tractor Sales
Home of compact Jinma, Foton, and Koyker Tractors and Parts, Wood Chippers, Backhoes - Affordable Tractor Sales Company

 

[Ranch_Hand_Supp]

1: Unless you've actually seen his starter Ronald,

2: I'd rather wait for Mark's response - than to spar with you.

3: I've seen starter solenoids with up to three small posts.


//greg//

1: I thought you have seen a Jinma solenoid with 2 small terminals or you would not have made that statement.


2: You don't have to. Sparing is what you do best ! (more post)

3: The topic is about a Jinma 284LE. So are you saying that you have seen a Jinma 200 series starter with 2 small terminals or not?





Ronald
Ranch Hand Supply