Kioti HST PTO true neutral position?

[sdef]

I have a 2013 Kioti DK45 HST and have been using the PTO and PHD digging 9" - 24" diameter fence post holes in very hard, very rocky ground. The last (so far) 9" hole took 4 hours to create (ended up being 18"), mainly using a 20# digging bar, heavy manual rock post hole digger, four PTO post hole digger 5/16" grade 5 shear bolts and a lot of swearing in the hot summer sun.

Since the shear bolt attaches the PTO shaft to the PHD gear box, when the shear bolt breaks, the PTO shaft keep rotating until disengaged and the corresponding shear bolt holes on each end are no longer aligned. It is a simple matter to rotate the PHD shaft's shear bolt mounting hole for access through the PHD's PTO shaft safety, but I have not found a way to place the PTO shaft on the tractor into a neutral position where I can simply rotate the PTO shaft to align its shear bolt hole with the access hole in the PTO shaft shield for insertion of the shearbolt.

In my Kioti operator's manual I can only find a single mention of the PTO shaft in neutral position and it does not explain how to do so. So I suspect that neutral to Kioti does not mean the same thing as neutral to me. I do not see a mechanical lever to accomplish this and messing around with the two PTO electrical switches with the tractor running or not running does not accomplish what I need either.

I do break a lot of shear bolts. Does anybody know of a way to place the tractor PTO assembly into a true neutral position where it can be rotated manually by the attached PTO shaft? I guess my only other option of making this task easier would be to make the PHD's safety shield a quick removal item in some manner.

 

[JerryK]

' Usually ' , on a lot of modern tractors, the problem is that they have a PTO brake which prevents the shaft from turning. My old loosy goosy 2240 John Deere, with 5800 hours either never had said brake, or it is worn out and easy to turn by hand.... thus easy to hook up PTO shafts or replace shear pins. My new Mahindra, not so... I assume that your Kioti is the same... Sorry....

 

[whiskywizard]

My CK20HST is a much different model, but my PTO shaft turns freely by hand when the tractor is shut down. I rotate it every time I change shaft-driven implements.

 

[Msamt]

I'll try to check tomorrow how mine behaves exactly, however I know I can turn mine by hand (takes a bit to get it moving if I recall, but I do have to spin it for attaching my finish mower. I cant remember if it was while running the tractor and the pto switch off, or the tractor shut off. I'll check after I go fishing tomorrow.

 

[ritcheyvs]

The PTO on my DK45s seems to have a brake and the shaft won't turn (by hand) with the PTO off (or the tractor off, for that matter). This means you have to turn the implement drive shaft shaft to align the splines.

 

[paulfun9]

With the tractor off I have only limited turning of the PTO. Its usually more than enough to hook up any of my attachments but for when it isn't I have a bar and an old PTO shaft with a hole in it that turns any attachment with ease.

 

[IslandTractor]

My DK40se also has limited (maybe 10-15 degree max) free movement of the PTO when engine is off and PTO switch is off. As a personal safety policy I never touch the PTO with engine running even with PTO off.

 

[SSdoxie]

The DK uses hydraulic pressure pushing against a clutch pack to engage PTO with spring pushing some pressure on the clutch pack to act as coaster brake. The PTO drive gear is always in contact with transmission shaft direct coupled to the engine so it takes fair amount of pressure to slip that coaster brake to turn it by hand. Carry a pipe wrench to rotate either the auger shaft or the U joint.

 

[sdef]

Sorry for my tardy reply. About half of my TBN emails end up in the Spam folder and I have to remember to look there for anything new. I received an email notification of the yesterday morning replies but the rest from last night and early this morning went to the Spam folder. Go figure.

IslandTractor: Oh no. I will not hookup the PTO assembly with the tractor running.

Thanks to all. In general from the comments, it seems the tractor's PTO drive assembly may be able to be moved with sufficient force applied and this will be helpful in other circumstances. I can move my PTO assembly a few degrees by hand, but it is probably less than 5 degrees and is more like mechanical play and not moving against the force of a clutch. For PHD PTO connections, I connect the bare driveshaft to the tractor first and then to the PHD which is easily rotatable by hand.

But for realigning the PTO shaft and PHD gear box shaft due to a broken shear bolt, I do not see a workable solution with the design of this assembly and your comments. I guess my best solution is to make the PHD gear box shields easily removable for complete access to the shear bolt assembly and the problem will be solved.

A couple days ago I ordered an ETA 6900 HD PHD so will make any mods to it.

 

[JerryK]

That's OK... a LOT of our comments [ mine especially ] belong in the SPAM folder... and I, for one, take pride in that fact....

 

[TJP89]

My CK PTO turns with freely (I don't go near it with the engine on). As others have said, it must be the electronic engagement on the DK that brakes the rotation, unlike the mechanical PTO on the CKs. Isn't technology wonderful?

 

[Apsterbobed]

I don't have a pto auger so maybe I am completely off but could you install a slip clutch and do away with the sheer pin all together? If that is not an option would an overrunning clutch adapter give you the free play you need to realign the pin? I also don't have an overrunning clutch adapter so maybe they don't work like I think they do.

 

[IslandTractor]

I don't have a pto auger so maybe I am completely off but could you install a slip clutch and do away with the sheer pin all together? If that is not an option would an overrunning clutch adapter give you the free play you need to realign the pin? I also don't have an overrunning clutch adapter so maybe they don't work like I think they do.

Slip clutches are wonderful so long as you maintain or use them regularly. If you use the implement infrequently the slip clutch cannot be relied upon unless you service it each time and that is a PITA which takes far more time than changing a sheer pin. A frozen slip clutch is useless/dangerous and the only way to know if it is frozen is to slip it which means detensioning the pressure plate which then requires retensioning before use. It's easy to spend half an hour fiddling with slip clutch maintenance. I hate sheer pins but I've grown to hate slip clutches too.

 

[Apsterbobed]

I know that there is service time before you use the clutch but if you are breaking pins every few holes the time waisted messing with pins may be more than checking the clutch at the start of the fence job. Especially if you are fighting the auger to align the holes, but like I said my auger is hydraulic and I have no experience with the pto auger. Mine is for a high flow skidsteer so there is no worries about shearing pins...the thought of a rock is enough to stall my auger. I don't have nearly enough flow but I have enough that I can't out dig it with a shovel ! And the price was right (free to borrow whenever in exchange for its storage in my garage).