Land Access Over Railroad?

[Piper2022]

So I am interested in a nice 110 acre parcel of land that has a working passenger rail corridor through it. In order to build a home I would need to build a driveway that crosses it as well as bring power over it.

Anyone care to chime in on what would be required? I am guessing the rail company has specific regulations on how the driveway crossing is constructed.

 

[dave1949]

It may be next to impossible to afford. A friend has a house in North Anson (Madison area) on the "wrong" side of the tracks and he can't get power across.

I would check it out very carefully.

 

[oosik]

I would certainly want a correct & legal answer(in writing) to this situation before I purchased the land. A letter from the rail company regarding the driveway crossing and any utility crossings. Also letters from the utilities regarding their requirements on RR crossings. Also in the letter from the rail company - exactly what can and can not be within their ROW & procedures to secure permission to build within the ROW, if allowed.

You know, thinking long & hard, I can not think of a single private RR crossing in this part of the country. Lots of really long driveways off county built/maintained RR crossings.

 

[bcp]

Might be easier getting to it some other way with an easement, or finding a different property. Sometimes counties or states require easements be given for access to landlocked properties.

I've seen long private roads on or beside the RR right of way, too, to avoid crossing it.

Bruce

 

[jk96]

Based on a friend with a similar piece of property I don't think you'll be able to build across the tracks. He can only use his for farm or recreation.

 

[dave1949]

http://statedocs.maine.gov/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1008&context=mdot_docs

This would be required reading.

 

[joecoin]

Helicopter.

 

[oosik]

I read thru the narrative part of the report - link, maine.gov. How could you get a loan against property that was under a RR access situation, such as that. I do think I would exit - stage right - as fast as possible. There will be plenty of challenges building on a piece of property with "normal" access - -

 

[Piper2022]

Thanks for all the input guys. You guys are right I don't think I can pull this off. Not even worth it. The main reason this property caught my eye was that it would be a 150-200k piece of land but its listed at 59k. I figured if it maybe only cost like 20k more to get a railroad approved crossing it would be worth it.


But who am I kidding, there is a reason it's priced at what it is.

Thanks guys

 

[dave1949]

For the sake of learning more if nothing else, if a realtor is listing it they would be obligated to tell you about/disclose the RR situation if that is considered a property "defect." I think it would be, but I'm not a realtor.

But, as you say, if the property is sitting on the market at that price anywhere in Maine that passenger rail goes, there is a good reason for that.

 

[Piper2022]

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You can see why it caught my eye, 110 acres in Freeport should be worth 4x that.

 

[Piper2022]

0 Allen Range Rd, Freeport, ME 04032 is For Sale - Zillow

 

[dave1949]

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You can see why it caught my eye, 110 acres in Freeport should be worth 4x that.

I see they do state access across the RR would be necessary, plus the driveway extension. The property taxes @ $1280/yr seem very high for the asking price which should be reasonably close to it's actual market value. Add a house and they would want a bunch. Another battle.

In the long view--which is very important for property--the uncertainty of the RR jacking up the price or conditions is a lot of risk. I noted that Maine is apparently the only state with state laws regarding private RR access, and the lawyers are not in favor of more laws for contracts between private parties. The legislature can pretty much alter or repeal any statute that doesn't require a constitutional amendment. So, not a great amount of future certainty there either.

 

[MossRoad]

So I am interested in a nice 110 acre parcel of land that has a working passenger rail corridor through it. In order to build a home I would need to build a driveway that crosses it as well as bring power over it.

Anyone care to chime in on what would be required? I am guessing the rail company has specific regulations on how the driveway crossing is constructed.

Looks like you'd have a couple auto junk yards at your mailbox.

 

[2458n]

Worked at a factory that had buildings on both sides of the train track.Everything was fine until we needed to tie computers together in all three buildings. Kept legal busy, and engineering for half a year just to shoot a six inch piece of pipe under the tracks. Directional boring was used to every ones approval.

 

[MossRoad]

I used to know a girl in high school that had a private driveway to her parent's house over some RR tracks. And there are lots of farms around here that have the same thing. Only way onto the property. I'm sure its a common thing and the RR could give you a quick answer.

We have a RR grade on the edge of our property. And an old RR bridge. It is now abandoned and the easment has reverted back to the land owners. I think I own the west half of a north/south bridge!!!

 

[PoorPlowboy]

It may be next to impossible to afford. A friend has a house in North Anson (Madison area) on the "wrong" side of the tracks and he can't get power across.

I would check it out very carefully.

There are laws to prevent a right-of-way holder from prohibiting a landowner from using their property in any usual manner or denying them basic human rights. Electrical service, one could argue, is a basic human right in this modern age in any first world country. I would seek the advice of a lawyer if I were your friend.

 

[2LaneCruzer]

There are laws to prevent a right-of-way holder from prohibiting a landowner from using their property in any usual manner or denying them basic human rights. Electrical service, one could argue, is a basic human right in this modern age in any first world country. I would seek the advice of a lawyer if I were your friend.

Good advice. Under common law, and in most states, if you have property, it comes with the right of access. You may have to go to court and get a court order for an easement, and you may have to pay for the easement, but you normally cannot be denied access. I'm sure the RR has addressed this issue many times before.

 

[dave1949]

There are laws to prevent a right-of-way holder from prohibiting a landowner from using their property in any usual manner or denying them basic human rights. Electrical service, one could argue, is a basic human right in this modern age in any first world country. I would seek the advice of a lawyer if I were your friend.

The RR's can be pretty high-handed about this issue. An example is the $10 million liability insurance the RR demanded from crossing ROW lease holders. It's not that a person couldn't eventually force the issue of power or access, but can they afford the years of court battles required to get it and even at that, the ongoing price of access may be high.

My friend has an off-grid solar system and generator, that has worked out okay for him and it was cheaper than lawyers or whatever ridiculous fee the RR wanted for power lines to cross. His road access is not a problem. The crossing was there long before him and is used by several properties. I think the crossing may be used by the stone quarry that abuts his lot.

As another poster noted, it took six months for his company's legal dept. and engineering staff to get an underground data line crossing. A normal resident doesn't have those resources or leverage. A typical community will go to bat for local businesses, and they have ways of applying pressure to RR's because the RR's are almost always in violation of something somewhere. That would be rare to happen for an individual. Just the way it is.

 

[Country Geek]

I used to know a girl in high school that had a private driveway to her parent's house over some RR tracks. And there are lots of farms around here that have the same thing. Only way onto the property. I'm sure its a common thing and the RR could give you a quick answer.

We have a RR grade on the edge of our property. And an old RR bridge. It is now abandoned and the easment has reverted back to the land owners. I think I own the west half of a north/south bridge!!!

You might want to be sure of that. Those RR easements never seem to go away. I remember in the late 1990s when I was looking for my land I found a nice property with an abandoned RR easement on the survey, between the house and the road . Everyone assured me that it was truly dead and nothing to worry about as the railroad would never use it again. I passed on the property for a few reasons, one of them being that IMO if it was really irrelevant it wouldn't have been on the survey. And yep, sure enough they were right that the railroad had no interest in ever using it again, but instead it became part of a local rails-to-trails network. I use the trail myself and the current owners of that house have little privacy because the trail is a bit higher in elevation than the house, one of the major access parking lots is their next door neighbor, and they had to build a gate to keep the trail users off their driveway (which crosses the trail).