Loader Valve Recommendations?

[K5lwq]

I have a 3 spool Youli MB3 valve and would like to replace it. My system has a 10 GPM pump and would like to keep in that range for the valve flow rate.

Issues are there is no load checks in the valve and the valve body has a flaw that will not send full flow to the first spool. Instead it blows over the relief valve.

I have just been dealing with these issues, but really want to correct them now.

I would like a 3 spool, 10 to 14 GPM valve with float on the first spool. Need load checks on the first two spools as well. The third spool should be spring to center. I would like the joystick on the first two spools as well. It also needs to be a power beyond valve.

Any suggestions as to which valve I should get? Or, is this as good as it gets?

Here is my current setup. I do like the size of this valve as it fits within the footprint of the tractor.

 

[oldnslo]

Bucher hydraulics HDM11 series valves have three spool monoblock valves. I think they have all of the features that you are looking for.
Monoblock directional valves HDM

 

[100 td]

What's the valve (flow?) external to the left spool?

 

[K5lwq]

Bucher hydraulics HDM11 series valves have three spool monoblock valves. I think they have all of the features that you are looking for.
Monoblock directional valves HDM

I think you are correct. I will do some research to see where I might buy from and hopefully can talk to a rep. Thank you so much for the info!

 

[K5lwq]

What's the valve (flow?) external to the left spool?

Because of the first spool having the issue when lowering the boom, it made it all most impossible to set a pallet down gently. No feathering at all. That flow meter is on the return line when lowering so I can slow it down when needed. It helps a lot but still don't like I have to adjust it for what I am doing.

Other than this, and no load checks, it is a pretty good valve. Youli has no intentions of redesigning the valve block to correct the issue even though they are fully aware of the problem. The vast majority of their customers don't care because feathering is not an issue. They want all or nothing for their applications. At least this is what I was told.

 

[100 td]

Issues are.... the valve body has a flaw that will not send full flow to the first spool. Instead it blows over the relief valve.

What is the model number of the flow control valve, it's difficult to tell it's size from your pic, could it be under rated for your pump flow in bypass mode? If it's a STUF-380 it's only rated at 30l/m maximum and your pump is 38l/m.

 

[K5lwq]

What is the model number of the flow control valve, it's difficult to tell it's size from your pic, could it be under rated for your pump flow in bypass mode? If it's a STUF-380 it's only rated at 30l/m maximum and your pump is 38l/m.

I don't know the model number off hand. However, the flow valve was added after the valve body was proven to have the defect. When I ordered the new valve from my local hydraulic supply house, they liked the set up and ordered two. One for me and one for their floor. When I installed and realized it was a problem, I took the valve back to them to test. On the test bench, we were able to duplicate the issue. We then tested the one they ordered for the floor, we got the same results. When activating the first spool, it will blow over the relief valve. Even with nothing attached, it will do the same thing as it is an internal issue.

We also tried replacing the spool and again, it would blow over relief. It only does it on the first spool and only in one direction.

We then contacted Youli USA, and they were not aware of an issue so they contacted the factory. The factory told them that they have had a few complaints and found the flaw to be in the valve body. However, because of how few complaints they had, they decided not to correct the problem.

My hydraulic man offered to give me a full refund, but I felt like it was not his fault and didn't want him to lose money on the deal. He understands that the valve has no feathering on that spool and gave me the flow valve at no charge to help with control. That allows me the ability to slow it to a crawl if I need to when using my forks.

The flow valve is working as designed with no issues.

I have just decided to look for a different valve because it drives me nuts everytime I lower the loader. To me, it is not good for the system and a waste of energy. It takes more effort for the system to lower than lift a heavy load with gravity on it's side.

We also thought the valve would have load checks but apparently you can't get a 4th position float in the valve body that has checks. Just not a good loader valve.

Thanks for the help!

 

[ptsg]

We also thought the valve would have load checks but apparently you can't get a 4th position float in the valve body that has checks. Just not a good loader valve.

Thanks for the help!

Well, having check valves there just kinda defeats the purpose of the float function doesn't it? Check valves need pressure coming from the pump to open. If it opened with cylinder pressure, let's say with an heavy load on the loader, it would be useless anyway. I'm might be wrong tho.

 

[oldnslo]

Load checks Vs work port checks

Load checks are in the pressure port feeding the spool valve. On open center system the pump pressure is minimal so this check prevents flow from flowing out of the cylinders into the pressure port from load induced pressure. These have no effect on float features.

Work port checks are in the work ports. On some valves these are mechanically operated by the spool movement and on others they are pilot operated. Depending on the style these do not allow float feature.

 

[K5lwq]

Load checks Vs work port checks

Load checks are in the pressure port feeding the spool valve. On open center system the pump pressure is minimal so this check prevents flow from flowing out of the cylinders into the pressure port from load induced pressure. These have no effect on float features.

Work port checks are in the work ports. On some valves these are mechanically operated by the spool movement and on others they are pilot operated. Depending on the style these do not allow float feature.

This was my understanding as well. Now the challenge is sourcing the proper valve. I did some research on Bucher valves and not sure yet if I can get the correct orientation valve with a joystick. I will have to call to find out the answer to that question. From reading their website, it doesn't look promising. Hopefully I can find time tomorrow to give them a call.

Any suggestions on a good Bucher dealer?

 

[Dave M7040]

The best advice from a hydraulic manufacturer available to anyone is from Cross Manufacturing.
Hydraulics

You don't wait long on the phone to get to talk to knowledgeable staff.

I have sought advice from many other manufacturers but these guys were the best.

I would look over stuff on their site before calling.

Dave M7040

 

[oldnslo]

I have never used a Bucher valve but person that makes top n tilt recommended a distributor in one of his posts. Can稚 remember his name but I think the post was about valve leakage

 

[K5lwq]

The best advice from a hydraulic manufacturer available to anyone is from Cross Manufacturing.
Hydraulics

You don't wait long on the phone to get to talk to knowledgeable staff.

I have sought advice from many other manufacturers but these guys were the best.

I would look over stuff on their site before calling.

Dave M7040

Thanks Dave for the advice. I have looked at cross before but can't find a three spool valve at all.

 

[K5lwq]

I have never used a Bucher valve but person that makes top n tilt recommended a distributor in one of his posts. Can稚 remember his name but I think the post was about valve leakage

Thanks, I will search for the thread.

 

[K5lwq]

I found the thread. It was Brian at Fit Rite. I will PM him. Thanks again.

 

[K5lwq]

Anyone have any experience with this valve? It looks as if I can get most of the features I am looking for with this unit.

One question I have is they say it has load check. On other valves in the same line, they say they have load checks on each spool. What, if any is the difference?

 

[oldnslo]

Without a schematic I am just guessing on the load check but some valves only have one load check at the inlet and some have them at each spool. If only operating a single function at a time one load check works. Running multiple functions with different loads require a check for each spool.

 

[K5lwq]

Without a schematic I am just guessing on the load check but some valves only have one load check at the inlet and some have them at each spool. If only operating a single function at a time one load check works. Running multiple functions with different loads require a check for each spool.

Thanks for the reply.

This is what I was thinking. Unfortunately, I have not located a schematic for this valve.

I do see Nemco had a valve that also has the options I want. However, I have seen some negative comments about their products. Still researching what is the best option.

 

[K5lwq]

I have found 4 options for a new valve. None of them are exactly what I want, but all would be better than what I have. Which one would you choose?

1. Bucher HDM11P:
A. 12 GPM
B. Adjustable Relief 1300-3000 PSI
C. Parallel Circuit
D. 4th Position Float
E. No Joystick available with 4th Position Float
F Single Load Check
G. Spool Leakage @ 1450 PSI is 6cc/min

2. Prince WVS31BBB5C1:
A. 14 GPM
B. Adjustable Relief 2200-3200 PSI
C. Parallel Circuit
D. Float can be used on any Spool
E. Joystick available
F. Single Load Check
G. Spool Leakage @ 1500 PSI is 3cc/min

3. Nimco CV110:
A. 13 GPM
B. Fixed Pressure Relief (not sure of what options)
C. Parallel Circuit
D. Float can be used on any Spool
E. Joystick Available
F. Load Checks on each Spool
G. Spool Leakage @ 1450 PSI is 2cc/min

4. Walvoil SD5
A. 12 GPM
B. Adjustable Relief 1500-3000 PSI
C. Parallel Circuit
D. Float on any Spool
E. Joystick available
F. Main Load check and Load Check Special Float Spool Only
G. Spool Leakage @ 1450 PSI is 3cc/min

 

[oldnslo]

On your first post you stated one of the reasons that you are looking for a different valve is that your current valve has no load check. Why would you consider another valve without load checks?

Did you look at the Bucher HDM11S series? It appears to offer load checks on each section. I did not look at all the other features or options though.

Would also suggest contacting Prince since there two section loader valve has load checks for both spools. Three section might also.