MIG vs. Flux Core Welding

[Transit]

Yes, yes. I know all about the ins and outs of wire feed welding. With 110volts your not going to weld other than short arc. Most of the El Cheepo 110 v units are not more than stick welders with long rods, totally striped down, no capacitors and minimum inductance, the gun hot all the time.

And you missed SHIELDED FLUX CORE as opposed to Shelf Shielded Flux Core.

 

[cdaigle430]

I have had my little Lincoln 110V wire welder for over ten years now.
I use it on everything, just not that skilled at small stuff, does not seem to be a big need to weld thin steel on my little farm. I have only used Flux Core and never tried MIG. I want to build a big smoker and want the welds to look really good. Does MIG make better welds than Flux Core?

Thanks,
Charlie

Does your MIG have the capability to do both like mine?

120 Amp Flux Wire Welder with Wheels

Granted this one is a low duty cycle welder but it gets the job done, I paid $129 for mine on sale.

 

[Transit]

Read the specs carefully, 120 amp welder. 18 v @ 130 amps, 15% or 1-1/2 min weld time @ 115 Amps.
At 130 A the weld time is around 1 min. or 10%.
The problem with these units is people think they can do the equivalent work of a pro model. You should hear some of the projects they want to do with such a welder, like build a trailer to run on the highway. These units don't have the penetration of a pro model and that is what gives Mig a bad name.

 

[cdaigle430]

Read the specs carefully, 120 amp welder. 18 v @ 130 amps, 15% or 1-1/2 min weld time @ 115 Amps.
At 130 A the weld time is around 1 min. or 10%.
The problem with these units is people think they can do the equivalent work of a pro model. You should hear some of the projects they want to do with such a welder, like build a trailer to run on the highway. These units don't have the penetration of a pro model and that is what gives Mig a bad name.

Yep,
I know it has a low duty cycle but for the amount of time I use it, it's perfect. I am a professional welder turned Information Technology so I understand how the needs verus cost goes. I have $12,000 dollar computer system at home because I need it The welding is just a hobby/home repair item for me now.

I can't justify having my house wired for 3 phase electricity and spending $1,500 dollars plus on a machine I use maybe once a year to gain another 60% on the duty cycle. I don't see how this gives MIG a bad name?

 

[Transit]

Ok, so you know a lot more than you are letting on. Mig gets a bad rap because of the little cheepo pee shooters.
There have been many used pro-Migs for sale on Crags list and such. Have you ever been to WeldingWeb™ - Welding forum for pros and enthusiasts - Powered by vBulletin

 

[lostcause]

Read the specs carefully, 120 amp welder. 18 v @ 130 amps, 15% or 1-1/2 min weld time @ 115 Amps.
At 130 A the weld time is around 1 min. or 10%.
The problem with these units is people think they can do the equivalent work of a pro model. You should hear some of the projects they want to do with such a welder, like build a trailer to run on the highway. These units don't have the penetration of a pro model and that is what gives Mig a bad name.

i know a bunch of you have big issues with these 120v welders, especially for making trailers that travel on public roads. to be honest, i can't see what the deal is. trailers that can be hauled behind light duty trucks have very little steel on them thicker than 1/4". my trailer that i made 10+ years ago (16' deck with 5' +/- v-nose) uses c5x6.7 for the two rails and the rest of the tongue. the cross members are c3x4.1. the shackles are about 1/4", the coupler is about 3/16".

the only parts here that are thicker than 1/4" are the heels of the channel flanges. they are probably 5/16"-3/8" at the very edge of the heel and taper to 3/16"-1/4" at the toe of the flange. i have no issues with welding these shapes with a 120v welder. in fact, there are a lot of 120v welders out there now claiming to put out 140a through some intricacies and voodoo of inverter technology. my old welder is a century 90/110 wire feed that (i believe) is putting out a 90a max because i use it on the 20a input setting - i assume the 110a is only attainable on the 25a input. i've welded plenty of steel in this range with that old century, and i'd have to think that a newer lincoln or miller (or other) 140a would make it even easier.

do i get full penetration with this? absolutely not. do i care? absolutely not. i don't believe you will find any full penetration welds on any commercially built trailer anyways. you certainly need to get enough heat to obtain proper penetration to get fusion between the metals, but thinking you need full penetration everywhere is a pie dream.

in fact, to get full penetration on a channel shape, you would need to cut out a portion of the web and grind back the underside of the flange to allow an access for either a backing bar or a backgouge/backing fillet. i can't say i've seen a trailer built this way, though it's possible they exist. generally, if concerned, just weld both sides of the web & flanges and you're going to see the strength you need. the channel section will yeild before the weld as long as you get enough heat into it.

sorry for getting away from the question about a smoker, but i wanted to address this.

 

[Luremaker]

... in fact, there are a lot of 120v welders out there now claiming to put out 140a through some intricacies and voodoo of inverter technology. my old welder is a century 90/110 wire feed that (i believe) is putting out a 90a max because i use it on the 20a input setting - i assume the 110a is only attainable on the 25a input. i've welded plenty of steel in this range with that old century, and i'd have to think that a newer lincoln or miller (or other) 140a would make it even easier....

I don't want to hijack this thread but speaking of Lincoln. Anyone have any experience with the Lincoln 140 Mig. I see it is on sale for $499 CAD at Canadian Tire this week.

 

[yomax4]

If a 115v unit is on your wish list, I would go with the Lincoln. When the 115v craze hit in the early 90's I sold thousands of Lincoln SP machines in 115v. We never did have a warranty claim on one. I don't like Lincoln as a company or business model but you have to admire their 115v program. I have owned many dozen welders from Miller, Hobart, Century, Powcon, Esab, Thermal Arc and a couple of unknown origin but the small mig market is considered a throw away market and Lincoln seems to get thrown away less than than most from what I see in my travels..

 

[Transit]

Lost, consider yourself lucky, less than full penetration means a less than full strength weld. Consider, equipment produced 10 years ago was better made; take a look under the covers at the same model today. What makes Mig a constant voltage process is the large capacitor storage bank. Most all el-cheepos dont have cap banks and those that do are inadequate.

 

[gauthier]

Well,I've never used one of them 110 volt migs,so couldn't say what they will do or won't do,,but know I wouldn't buy one.

As far as full and not full penatration,,a fillit weld is not supposed to have full penatration,,think about it,,set up a tee joint,or a lap joint,,if you had full penatration you would be burning a hole through back of joint.

A fillit weld is not a full pen weld,,now that don't mean it is not supposed to have some penatration in root of joint,,but how much?

If you are using correct amps/volts for the rod/wire you are running,and you can weld,,you will get enough penatration in root of a fillit,[if you need a stronger joint than you need to come up with something other than a fillit.],if you can't turn machine heat to where you need to or you don't know how to weld,,than you will have trouble getting enough penatration and fusion,,to make a good weld.