Mower is acting funny, what do you think is wrong?

[BrokeFarmerJohn]

Last week I mowed I didn't have a issue, this time was diff.

First I hopped on and the battery was dead which was odd.

I jumped the tractor and started mowing, after about 35 mins it started dying so I disengage the blades and the hour meter comes back on, I parked it closer to the house, killed the motor hopped off and looked around, felt for hot wires ext.

It was too dead to start so I jumped it again and it started, unhooked the jumper cables and the pto wouldn't engage but it would with the cables hooked up, I got another 15 mins mowing before the it started dying again and the hour meter went out.

I drove it up to the house and let it idle, the hour meter came back on, got a meter and the battery was reading 7.48v and VERY slowly climbing, I let it reach above 9.4v after a few mins, tried to engage the electronic PTO and nothing, put the meter back on the battery and we were back to 7.4v i disengaged the PTO and the voltage started slowly climbing again.

So there's only 3 culprits that I can think of that would be causing this.

1. A bad battery.
2. A weak alternator.
3. Something todo with the PTO switch draining too much power.

Not sure how strong a alternator on a tractor is supposed to be.

Mower is a GTH2454T
Motor is a 24hp Intek V-Twin B&S. Has 247.6 hours on the clock.

Battery is a Duracell not sure of age, doesn't look original.

 

[KWentling]

My guess is your battery is history. If you have a charger, disconnect it from the tractor and see if it will take a charge. Fully charged would be 12.7 volts and that will drop a little after it has set for an hour or two. If it charges up, you can either put it back in the tractor and try again, or better yet, take it and have it load tested.

 

[BrokeFarmerJohn]

My guess is your battery is history. If you have a charger, disconnect it from the tractor and see if it will take a charge. Fully charged would be 12.7 volts and that will drop a little after it has set for an hour or two. If it charges up, you can either put it back in the tractor and try again, or better yet, take it and have it load tested.

How fast does a tractor alternator charge a battery? A car will put out 13 or 14 volts, my tractor was barely charging the battery and it couldn't stay ahead of the PTO switch, I would think even with a bad battery the tractor should operate normally, just not start.

 

[boggen]

TractorData.com John Deere 432 tractor information

no mechanic. but 12v tractor to 12v car to 12v truck. it is all the same Volt wise, from battery to alternator. just the amount of amps differ. more amps, larger the battery, larger the alternator, and larger the wires. less amps = smaller battery, smaller alternator, smaller wires.

check fluid level in battery. is it low?
check cables to battery make sure not loose / corroded.
check cables to alternator if they are loose or not.
check ground wires were they connect to frame and see if corroded or loose or not.

if you get tractor started, toss meter on and you should get 13 to 14v. if less i would say alternator is going bad.

there was a couple videos of folks pulling cable off battery, after machine was running, to see if it will stay running with just alternator going. and with that same statement, generally noted not advised due to all the newer computer chips, extra relays, etc... and causing damage to them possibly

=========
youtube "parasitic draw" if you think something is bad, and draining battery. most of the videos goes through of how to check and find stuff. and how to run meter across fuses without pulling them individually. along with alternator and battery checks, starter checks, starter relay checks, starter solenoid checks.

i only mention parasitic draw. due to seeing a cab tractor. and with all the lights, and most likely extra wires in wiring harnesses. it might help ya if it ends up going that direction.

myself had bad battery cable right were wire goes into battery terminal on the battery. *grumbles* wasted a couple days tracking that down.

===========
tossing a meter across battery just to read volts. can be false positive in battery is good.

load tester for battery, pick one up from automative places to larger hardware stores. any were from $20 to $30 bucks. cheap one i have, has a "heating element" inside of it. and when ya push the button to load test battery, it sends electricity through the heating element and the gauge reads from that.

walmart and regular automative repair shops and automative part stores. good chance they will load test battery for free.

 

[Wagtail]

boggen, Mate. BFJ's troublesome lawn tractor is a Husqvarna GTH2454T

 

[BrokeFarmerJohn]

TractorData.com John Deere 432 tractor information

no mechanic. but 12v tractor to 12v car to 12v truck. it is all the same Volt wise, from battery to alternator. just the amount of amps differ. more amps, larger the battery, larger the alternator, and larger the wires. less amps = smaller battery, smaller alternator, smaller wires.

check fluid level in battery. is it low?
check cables to battery make sure not loose / corroded.
check cables to alternator if they are loose or not.
check ground wires were they connect to frame and see if corroded or loose or not.

if you get tractor started, toss meter on and you should get 13 to 14v. if less i would say alternator is going bad.

there was a couple videos of folks pulling cable off battery, after machine was running, to see if it will stay running with just alternator going. and with that same statement, generally noted not advised due to all the newer computer chips, extra relays, etc... and causing damage to them possibly

=========
youtube "parasitic draw" if you think something is bad, and draining battery. most of the videos goes through of how to check and find stuff. and how to run meter across fuses without pulling them individually. along with alternator and battery checks, starter checks, starter relay checks, starter solenoid checks.

i only mention parasitic draw. due to seeing a cab tractor. and with all the lights, and most likely extra wires in wiring harnesses. it might help ya if it ends up going that direction.

myself had bad battery cable right were wire goes into battery terminal on the battery. *grumbles* wasted a couple days tracking that down.

===========
tossing a meter across battery just to read volts. can be false positive in battery is good.

load tester for battery, pick one up from automative places to larger hardware stores. any were from $20 to $30 bucks. cheap one i have, has a "heating element" inside of it. and when ya push the button to load test battery, it sends electricity through the heating element and the gauge reads from that.

walmart and regular automative repair shops and automative part stores. good chance they will load test battery for free.

I would be WAY more concerned if the 4320 was having this issue, lots more variables.

As far as the garden tractor goes, everything is tight and clean.

I forgot to hook the battery charger to it, I will later today.

 

[boggen]

*looks down*
*forhead drops into desk*
DOH!

 

[Leejohn]

The fuse holder is melted.

 

[BrokeFarmerJohn]

Turns out I learned something new about my mower engine and how it works. It ended up being a bad voltage regulator, mine is hosed.

I threw my battery on the charger, after 3 hours put the battery in the mower, did some voltage tests after I knew what I was looking for found out I'm getting 23-25v AC out of the motor, battery was at 12.5v but not getting anything out of the regulator when I should be getting 13-15v DC, seems I'm just running on battery alone.

I got all my mowing done running off a charged battery, I will order a new regulator.

Time to pull the deck off and clean it out, grease some zerks and put it all back together.

I'm getting a build up of wet grass on the deck so I'm just gonna clean it out properly, deck doesn't like wet grass too much lol.

 

[BrokeFarmerJohn]

I should have taken before and after pics, I'm surprised it could discharge anything lol, sticks and all kinds of crap stuck inside.

 

[BrokeFarmerJohn]

Just ordered the regulator

Amazon.com : Voltage Regulator for Briggs & Stratton 691185, 39489 : Lawn And Garden Tool Replacement Parts : Patio, Lawn & Garden

$12.50 with free shipping, estimated arrival may 25th-31st

Next will be an oil change, it's got close to 50h on this oil, after that, hopefully nothing for a few years lol.

Here is a pic of the old one that's still on the tractor

I am thinking about changing blades, I have standard blades on it now, they do a good job but don't lift the grass as well as I would like, it leaves a strip of taller grass if I go full speed on taller grass, it cuts all the grass just slightly higher strips sometimes which on the front is an aggravation, the back it doesn't bother me lol.

Teach has been talking those G5 blades up pretty high, in a month or so I may give those a try, I'm sure scrapping all the crud from the deck today will help the cut and discharge substantially.

So far these blades have held up great, I have hit a few larger rocks, it grabbed and chewed up a junction box and wire it found in taller grass, I checked the blades today and the middle one has a chip, overall there still decently sharp.
Amazon.com : Set Of 3 Blades Replaces HUSQVARNA 532 18 72-54 532 18 72-55 532 18 72-56 : Patio, Lawn & Garden

Current blades.

 

[Leejohn]

Doesn't a B&S engine run off of a mag and the battery only for starting?

 

[BrokeFarmerJohn]

Doesn't a B&S engine run off of a mag and the battery only for starting?

When I checked the voltage comeing out of the alternator it showed 23-25v AC, so for my test that is good, the voltage regulator wasn't charging the battery though.

Yes the motor seems to be able to run off its own power when I was unhooking the regulator during the test, but the Electronic PTO seems to draw power from the battery to engage and stay engaged, when I ran the deck is when the battery was nearly drained before, the regulator isn't keeping up with the Electronic PTO demands at this time.

This is the alternator which is by the flywheel. Amazon.com : Briggs & Stratton 59283 Alternator : Lawn Mower Tune Up Kits : Patio, Lawn & Garden

 

[Leejohn]

You are calling the electric clutch a Electronic PTO, it's just a electric clutch and maybe it's drawing to many amps to keep it engaged in turn running your battery down. Did you check that fuse holder out real good? Check the voltage in and out of it and move the wires around. If it's bad the tach well go out and back on.

 

[Coyote machine]

A fully functional battery will read 13+ - 14.25-14.5 Volts MAX. Anything over 14.5 Volts is too much voltage and will do damage eventually.
Ideally you shouldn't disconnect parts of the electrical system when the tractor is running, including the battery cables from their posts, and voltage regulators or alternators, depending on what your tractor uses to supply/regulate voltage and output amps through the system.
Hopefully the v-reg replacement will solve your issues.
Make sure to balance any replacement blades before installing them, so they minimize vibration, and get them right side up too so they cut effectively.
I usually keep two sets of spares and one running set. The spares are ready to go, already sharpened and balanced. It saves time in the long run and makes changing them more frequently less hassle.:thumbsup:

 

[BrokeFarmerJohn]

You are calling the electric clutch a Electronic PTO, it's just a electric clutch and maybe it's drawing to many amps to keep it engaged in turn running your battery down. Did you check that fuse holder out real good? Check the voltage in and out of it and move the wires around. If it's bad the tach well go out and back on.

I checked voltage at the battery and got 12.48v and voltage at the wires coming out of the regulator, I had the same 12.48v DC there as well so I'm not losing anything at the fuse holder, I have played with the fuse holder in the past, blown 1 15A fuse last year, I just looked in the manual and it says that fuse should be a 20A, I will leave it for now.

And I wasn't sure of the terminology on the electronic PTO button, thingy ma bob, lol.

 

[BrokeFarmerJohn]

A fully functional battery will read 13+ - 14.25-14.5 Volts MAX. Anything over 14.5 Volts is too much voltage and will do damage eventually.
Ideally you shouldn't disconnect parts of the electrical system when the tractor is running, including the battery cables from their posts, and voltage regulators or alternators, depending on what your tractor uses to supply/regulate voltage and output amps through the system.
Hopefully the v-reg replacement will solve your issues.
Make sure to balance any replacement blades before installing them, so they minimize vibration, and get them right side up too so they cut effectively.
I usually keep two sets of spares and one running set. The spares are ready to go, already sharpened and balanced. It saves time in the long run and makes changing them more frequently less hassle.:thumbsup:

I was not getting over 12.48v DC at the battery, which was just battery power, no help from the voltage regulator.

I got the 23-25v AC out of the alternator/magneto whatever it's called which is correct, the engine is producing power and the regulator is failing to transfer the AC voltage to DC and charge the battery.

As far as blades go, the ones I got with the tractor were mulching blades I believe and they were hosed, the guy sharpened them on both sides, I may take them to a guy to see if they can be sharpened.

I do plan on ordering another set soon. 2 sets on rotation will be plenty for me. I mow weekly and average 30-40 hours a year mowing so 15-20 hours per sharpening sounds about right. I will play it by ear on blade sharpening.

 

[BrokeFarmerJohn]

Briggs & Stratton Battery Not Charging - Simple Voltage Regulator Test - YouTube

I followed the same steps this guy did and came to the conclusion of a bad voltage regulator.

I forgot to add the video in my post earlier before I pulled and cleaned the deck.

I also hit all the 4 front zerks and the 3 spindles on the deck with grease, the belt pulleys which I replaced (3 total) earlier this month are non grease-able but are not too hot to lay my hand on after mowing.

 

[Coyote machine]

I was not getting over 12.48v DC at the battery, which was just battery power, no help from the voltage regulator.

I got the 23-25v AC out of the alternator/magneto whatever it's called which is correct, the engine is producing power and the regulator is failing to transfer the AC voltage to DC and charge the battery.

As far as blades go, the ones I got with the tractor were mulching blades I believe and they were hosed, the guy sharpened them on both sides, I may take them to a guy to see if they can be sharpened.

I do plan on ordering another set soon. 2 sets on rotation will be plenty for me. I mow weekly and average 30-40 hours a year mowing so 15-20 hours per sharpening sounds about right. I will play it by ear on blade sharpening.

Sounds like the bridge rectifier of you V-reg is not functional. That is what converts from AC to DC as it passes through the charging system. It uses a set of 4 diodes to convert the current to the correct usable waveform; in this case from AC to DC.

 

[BrokeFarmerJohn]

There it is, $12.50 in all its glory professionally installed I might add lol.

I'm getting 33v AC out of the alternator and I'm getting 13.3v DC at the battery, my problems are solved.