My Remote and TnT Install on L3400

[canoetrpr]

After much research, and a LOT of help from many of you at TBN, I've successfully installed a 4 spool valve and TnT cylinders from CCM.

For starters, let me again than the many of those who have helped me with this, including but not limited to: MadReferee, wushaw, WayneCountyHose, Kenndy and last but not least StrangeRanger who did the exact same install at the same time as me and who I was able to bounce many an idea by (and shamelessly steal many from!).

Details:

- I decided upon a 4 spool stackable Prince SV valve from Surplus Center that many here including MadReferee has used. The valve is nearly identical looking to the 'factory' remote setup that Kubota has for the B series and and standard L series. It is about 1/3 the price. It requires that you come up with your own way to mount it however - which is the own down side IMHO vs. the Kubota setup.

- Mounting cleanly is probably the biggest challenge. I don't weld - wish I did. StrangeRanger came up with the idea for mounting bracket. I copied his exactly - got a local welder to do it for me out of -1/4" steel. He charged me $100 total. I'm very happy with the mount.

- Got the TnT cylinders from Mark Carter at CCM. I'm very happy with them. Mark is a great guy. One suggestion to others that order TnT cylinders. Get a picture of your side link and measure carefully. Some side links (like the one on the L3400) has a 15 degree angle at the clevis. Others (I saw a M5000) at a dealers had no angle. Be careful to note this when you order from CCM.

- WayneCountyHose suggested that I find a local hydraulic shop to help me out with fittings and hoses. That was great advice. The hydraulic shop here was fantastic and a guy there spent a lot of time with me getting the right fittings. It was a lot more expensive than getting premade hoses or ordering fittings on the internet, but it was well worth it for me.

- I picked up Pioneer QD fittings at the local Princess Auto. Could not justify the extra $ for those at the hydraulic shop (they were 3 to 4 x more expensive for the QDs they had there). StrangeRanger did not get QDs for his TnT spools as he didn't see himself taking them off. I pondered whether I should or not but since I got a good deal ($18 each) I did and I'm really happy I did because I realised that the little top link holder bracket on the tractor will no longer hold my new top link so I just had to take my top link off as I was out harrowing and only used the drawbar.

- Hooking up the plumbing to the remote was straightforward. The three hoses I got for that (loader PB port to remote IN, remote OUT to tank, remote PB to tractor hydraulic block) were 3/8" and terminated with JIC -8 female swivel fittings.

- MadReferee had pointed out to me a couple years ago when I first posted for advice that he used 1/4" hoses for the TnT cylinders to limit the flow so that they could be feathered. This was a brilliant idea. I can adjust the cylinders ever so slightly. I got 1/4" hoses. They were terminated with 3/8" NTP male (as one end of each was getting a 3/8 QA on it). All my QD are 3/8" - just the hoses to the cylinders are 1/4".

- I had to think through some details like how am I going to be able to access the QD's on the valve since the ports are so close. I used an ORB 8 to NTP 3/8" and a 45 degree NTP 3/8" female by male on each of the work ports and then put my 3/8" QDs on each work port.

- For the newbie, when you are tightening fittings, think about which ones would be easier to do first. If you've got two fittings that are close, chance are it will be easier to do a particular one before the other. Obvious stuff but I missed it a couple of times.

- I used a Kubota provided tank port plug and o ring for the return to tank hose from the valve. If I were to do it again, I would follow MadRefree's method and tee the tank inlet from the loader at the hydraulic block instead. Doing it the way I did (the factory valve does it this way) just makes it a bit of a hassle when you have to top of hydraulic fluid as you need to undo the tank hose.

I've posted some pictures of my installation. I should point out that I was pretty mechanically inept (and generally un-handy) when I came to TBN. I've been helped by those of you who generously give your time here to do way more than I ever imagined - starting with a 50 hr service to now installing my own remotes and TnT cylinders. To anyone else who is consider whether or not to do it themselves or to send it to the dealer - IF I CAN DO IT...... BELIEVE ME YOU CAN!.

Cost breakdown is as follows. Note that these prices include shipping to Canada, taxes, and UPS brokerage fees.

- Prince 4 spool valve = $400.
- CCM TnT cylinders = $565
- Hoses and fittings + plastic ties + teflon tape = $448.58
- 6 sets of QD (male and female) = 108
- 2 ORB 8 steel plugs (I didn't put QD on one work section) = $4

Total = $1525.58

If you are in the USA then I imagine you can easily take $200 to $250 off that given you won't have to pay brokerage fees to UPS, your shipping will be slightly cheaper and you taxes lower.

I should point out that what I spent in total is not far from quotes I have gotten from dealers for a 3 spool remote setup (aftermarket) once you throw in paying them to haul the tractor to and from the dealership.... so I think I did pretty well as I got an extra spool and the cylinders for that price.

 

[canoetrpr]

Few more pictures

 

[TwinWillows]

Hey that's a pretty nice looking install - I have TNT & really like it & imagine you do too.

 

[afish]

I am a newbie to hydraulics so please excuse me if these some of these questions are stupid. With your valve setup I see three sets of QD but I see 4 levers what does the forth lever do? I am looking at getting a L3240 with 3 rear remotes. I figure 2 to control the top n tilt and a third for adjusting the angle for rear blade or landscape rake. Wouldnt I only need a 3 spool valve for this set up? I looked at the surplus link you provided for the valve and I'm unsure which type of work sections to get. They give you about 15 different options. I was thinking dual action spring centered but there are different ones of those to and I dont know what the difference is. I was going to just order the rear remotes from the factory with the tractor but they are a little pricey. I would also like to learn a little more about hydraulics and thought this would be a good opportunity.

Can anyone post picks of factory installed rear remotes on a L series Kubota?

 

[canoetrpr]

Realised that I left a couple things out of my cost breakdown. Here is the revised one:

Cost breakdown is as follows. Note that these prices include shipping to Canada, taxes, and UPS brokerage fees.

- Prince 4 spool valve = $400.
- CCM TnT cylinders = $565
- Hoses and fittings + plastic ties + teflon tape = $448.58
- 6 sets of QD (male and female) = 108
- 2 ORB 8 steel plugs (I didn't put QD on one work section) = $4
- Kubota port plug and oring for return to tank = $45
- Kubota grey ROPS paint = $20
- Mounting bracket = $100

Total = $1690.58

 

[canoetrpr]

afish - no questions are silly.

The work sections I got are SVW1BA1 - Dual Acting cylinders spring centered. For the vast majority of what a CUT owner will do with rear remotes this is what they need.

I have 4 spools (thus the 4 levers). Since I have no plan to use the 4th (bought the extra spool anyway as it was only an additional $56), I just put steel plugs on the work ports. Plugs are much cheaper than fittings and QDs ($4 for two). Will add the fittings and QDs if I ever need to use that spool.

Three rear remotes are generally plenty - two for TnT and one spare for whatever else, but more never hurt .

One of the reasons I did not spring for the 'factory' setup is that it is nearly identical in cleanliness of the install to what I got aftermarket but for a higher price. This statement is specific to the B series and the standard L series. The factory setup on the Grand L series is definately nicer and I believe uses hard lines to get the flow from the valve to bulkhead fittings on the rear.

If I were in your position and getting a brand new Grand L (wish I was!), I would get the dealer to work it in as part of the deal. A dealer should be able to give you a decent price on remotes since they are setting up the machine for you anyway.

Feel free to ask any questions you might have about hydraulics. I am a noob just like you to it but will do my best to answer.

 

[Charlesaf3]

great post, thanks!

need to add T&T to your sig line...

 

[afish]

Thanks canoetrpr I took a closer look at your pictures and see the plugs on th forth spool. Do you know where they mount the valves on the grand L series? In the brochure it shows three empty slots to the right of the seat is that where they install the valve and levers for the rear remotes? That was the main reason I was going to get the factory rear remotes (Nice clean install) but I cant find any pictures or info on the factory installed remotes. I would like to see what i'm buying before I buy. I stopped at my local dealer and could not find a single tractor of any series (B,L,M) with rear remotes or 3rd. function valve for the loader anywhere on the lot. Kubota really falls short in there brochure and web site for this info.

 

[3RRL]

Very nice and clean install!!
Since you got all your cylinders at CCM, I presume they have DPOCV's, right? Have you tried it out yet? Any words about how it works for you?

 

[canoetrpr]

I believe that they do have DPOCVs. I *should* be finally getting my box blade delivered tomorrow. Will post how well things work. The side link cylinder does not seem to leak down but then again it isn't under load yet

 

[lincolnvt]

Wow! Very nice install - appreciate your time posting. Can't wait to see some TnT action shots with the box blade

Cheers,
Brad

 

[wushaw]

Very nice

After you get to using your BB you will see how nice it it to have the TNT.

 

[Bird]

This is a good thread that I believe will help a lot of other people who have questions about TnT. I appreciate your posting the information and photos.

 

[zapper]

I would like to copy the mounting bracket that canoetrpr and strangeranger used for the prince valve. I have a b2910 that I previously installed the same valve, that I use for an hydraulic toplink . Madrefere helped me on this several years ago. I have been unhappy of my mount though. Is it possible you can send me or post detail bracket pics and dimensions so I can have the mounting bracket made for me. Thanks for any help guys.

 

[canoetrpr]

zapper, here is a link to the thread that StrangeRanger have been communicating about our install in. That link will take you to the page where SR posted the drawings for the mounting plate. Dead simple.

I would recommend that you take your own measurements for the distance between the holes.

I had the side plates welded about 76 or 77mm apart to fit over the ROPS. I also suggest that you measure your ROPS thickness carefully and add a 1 to 2 mm to it.

 

[canoetrpr]

Rob:

I've had a 600 lb or so ballast box attached to the 3pt with the 3pt raised and the side link extended to 1/2 of it's stroke. Left it for a couple days. The SL cylinder has not moved at all.

Can't wait to try it on my brand new box blade this weekend!

 

[canoetrpr]

Talk about heartbreaking.

I wandered out today to hook up my brand new box blade and found that the hydraulic top link is about 1 inch too short .

I've got a Pat's so that puts the lower links out by 4 inches. I'm guessing StrangeRanger does not have a Pats which is why his TL fits fine. I was paranoid and wanted to ensure that I didnt' get one too long so that I would be able to shorten the top link and rip. I got the 18"-26.5" which is the middle size that CCM sells.

A note to anyone with a L3400 and a Pat's like me - I suggest going with the largest TL that CCM sells - 21-32".

I think that my best bet is going to be to hire the machinist that did my valve mount to do an extension bracket like the one I've seen on another thread here.

Was really looking forward to working on my drive this weekend

 

[lincolnvt]

Bummer - sorry to hear that. Good luck with the modification

 

[StrangeRanger]

Hi all,

Canoe and I did the same install at the same time and I have to say his looks a little better b/c he bothered to paint his cylinders But the install and all was a lot easier than I had imagined it was going to be.

I live in the states and can say that my total cost was substantially less. Canoe I definitely feel for you bud, your shipping and taxes must have been CRAZY!

Canoe, in your last (I think last) pic, where you show your hyd block, you've done pretty much what I mentioned, but you may want to move that zip tie to the spot I mentioned. I envisioned a zip tie in the location not lasting very long. If you follow the foot deck back to the fender you'll see a bolt that connects the fender and deck. A wide zip tie turned side ways will go over that bolt and hang down to under the deck. Leave it hanging like a loop and you can then run a zip tie around your hoses and through that loop. That will get the hoses up out of the way like we want, but the zip tie is back and down kind of between the fender and deck protected from your feet and other things.

Way sorry to hear about the link being too short!! OMG that must suck.

I've got quite a few hours on my TnT w/ my BB and blade and love it. And yes they do have the DPCV's. Folks argue both ways whether you need them or not, but the CCM cylinders come w/ them so... I have zero leak down. My "driveway" is about 2,200' long and I don't know how I ever did it w/out the TnT before.

If anyone else is considering a TnT, you may want to see the thread that Canoe started where we went back and forth w/ things: http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/kubota-owning-operating/117710-l3400-ccm-hydraulic-top-link.html
j

 

[3RRL]

Canoe,
You have seen the thread about Loretta's tractor when I added Pat's to it? I cut a section out of the lower drag links.
Here is another thread with a similar question about Pat's and I posted in reply #6. Pat's System - Fab Extension
It may not be what you want to do, but it is a good alternative to keep ALL the implements closer to the tractor and retain your max 3pt lift. Bill decided not to go that way, but you can remove a section wherever to make it work.

I also am glad to hear a lot of you guys are happy with the CCM top link and their DPOCV's. I've been a proponent of the check valve use having put them on many cylinders where I like (need) them to stay in the position I choose. Especially for boxblade work when dragging my road smooth. Once I find the "sweet spot" where the road comes out perfect, it stays there. I've got one on both top links, I put them on my side links (DIY job), on my hyd gauge wheels and even on my backhoe stabilizer legs all for the same reasons.
I like them so much I want to install one on my kids mouth.