Narrowing my tractor choices

[art]

Part of any chore is having the time to do it! To have five hundred acres to play or work with would be exciting but I wouldn't want to be married to it! I'd very well be looking at a 100 horse tractor with a big batwing mower for doing the mowing and towing stuff out of the way that a used larger TLB couldn't move as well. At best a five foot brush hog can only mow about three to four acres and hour!
There are compacts that are designed for a chassis life of ten thousand hours! I'd have trouble recommending that purchase to you or anyone for what you are looking at having for a work load.
A larger farm tractor that's used should be about 10,000. and still reliable enough to get your work done. The backhoe that of coarse has a HD loader on it for the digging chores should be under 15,000.

 

[Z-Michigan]

I am thinking 50-55 HP is adequate for any and all 6' implements. Please correct me if I am wrong.

I think that's too general a statement. Some 6' implements require far more power than others. For instance, a 6' light duty brushhog will have all the power you can use at 50hp, but a 6' heavy duty (the kind that cuts 3" trees) would be marginal. Similarly, if you wanted a turnover plow, a 6' wide would be 4 or 5 bottom, too much for a 50hp tractor. OTOH a 50hp tractor will easily handle a 7' or even 8' rear blade or rake, cultivator, etc.

50hp would probably handle a 7' disc but nothing wider. As for a drag harrow, you will have no problem at all pulling an 8x8', and could pull nearly twice that size if you wanted.

 

[texbaylea]

Highsmith

You have received a lot of good advise but I would add: 1. get a quick attach adapter for the loader, good for bale spear, different buckets and pallet forks; 2. go 4wd as it will be extremely valuable for loader work; 3. don't discount the value of a cab, that area can get extremely hot and dusty.

Vernon

P.S. Almost forgot get R4's to fight off the thorns.

 

[Iowachild]

Skip the farmtrac, same with mahindra. The other manufacturers are good and established, you'll be able to get parts 20 years from now. I bought an off brand tractor about 15 years ago, now I can't get parts and it's a boat anchor.

Care to elaborate?

 

[Kendall69]

I bought an off brand tractor about 15 years ago, now I can't get parts and it's a boat anchor.

Same goes for name brand stuff. Some manufacturers refuse to keep, or manufacture parts after 10 years in some cases. I have an older Kubota, 80, something. When it was 10 years old I needed front end parts, and all the dealers I contacted gave me a resounding " nope" I called Kubota headquarters and explained my frustration " WHAT!!!, after 10 years Ican't get the parts I need" " sorry" But they did look up the numbers and came up with something that " might work". Same with a Ford 450, I called for an appointment for a lousy tune up, and they refused to even take it in fo ran appointment, said they do not work on vehicles over 10 years old WHAT!!!. I had to scream at the service manager and explain "what do you mean you can't get parts" I will bring in the plugs, and wires from NAPA, if it's too difficult for you - he let me come in.

I think Federal law says they have to keep parts for 10 years, after that they could care less.

 

[frank_f15]

ABOUT FARMTRAC we have dealer in town have looked at them a few times( just stoped in) they seem like they are heavly built . if i was really looking to purchase i might look hard at them. They do seem a bit cluttered tho.

 

[BarryinMN]

Same goes for name brand stuff. Some manufacturers refuse to keep, or manufacture parts after 10 years in some cases.

I think Federal law says they have to keep parts for 10 years, after that they could care less.

Thats part of the story -- for some classic cars, parts div can go back 20-30 years. Availability of manufacturer parts will also cost a huge premium, which opens the door for aftermarket suppliers into niche volume replacements. Want a freshly rebuilt '65 Mustang?

I replaced the exhaust pipe on my JD A ordered it from the local dealer & came in on normal delivery cycle 2-3 days. Cost $80. Found the same thing aftermarket at a two cylinder club meet for $30. Live & learn.

Intending to keep a machine for decades makes a warm & fuzzy, but in reality the cost to repair may outstrip it's economic market value. I found a JD radiator cap in a agricultural junk yard cost was free, owner said come back & buy something next time. Value was even better when I found out aftermarket caps are selling everyday of the week for $40-50.

Best way to assure parts decades into the future is pick a machine that set a new benchmark and as a result had huge production volumes.

 

[wolc123]

If you are looking for value, and not "fancy shmancy", I would look at Mahindra for sure. They are one of the worlds largest tractor manufacturers and come from the same country as those economy JD's you are looking at. I think final assembly is done in Texas. These tractors outweigh most of the competition which is a big asset for moving round bales, etc.. I would go as big in hp as you budget allows, 60-75 if possible. Skipping the 4wd and cab will let you buy quite a few more horses. A canopy does a good job with that hot old summer sun and does not rob hp like an A/C cab. I bet you could get around 10 more horsepower and 1000 or more pounds in a Mahindra for the same money as the other models you are looking at.

 

[Z-Michigan]

As far as parts, John Deere is the definite leader in keeping parts available and having them easy to get. And I can't name how many posts I've read about difficult parts availability for Kubotas that aren't very old (or in some cases, are brand new). I think the runner up in parts availability would probably be New Holland, based on their volume and length of time on market (as the successor to Ford/NH).

I would also say that for any major brand, I would have a much greater expectation of getting parts 10+ years down the road for an ag type tractor than for a CUT.

As far as Mahindra - I would look at them. Look really close. They get good reviews, but I personally haven't seen any in person. I was skeptical of Kioti when I heard about them, but after seeing some up close I was quite impressed - but lack of a nearby dealer (and concerns that the dealers in my state didn't sell enough to necessarily keep the line) kept me from getting one. I think if you look closely at a lot of different tractors you will start seeing significant differences that the marketing hype skips - ergonomics for practical use items, like the hitch draft links, stabilizers, drawbar, how easy/difficult it is to refuel and where the filler is located, etc. Things that aren't "sexy" but make a big difference in how pleasant the tractor is to use and how well it will hold up. There are also some things that look bad but make no practical difference - specifically straddle type platforms, which seem like a throwback but in actual use, at least in my experience, the transmission tunnel doesn't get in the way, and I like sitting low enough to see the front end more horizontally than vertically.

 

[LoneCowboy]

so, had an interesting experience yesterday that might help shine some light on your situation
Went out to look at this old farm. 60 acres, used to run irrigated pasture (and raise horses), with the drought, they lost water rights, it all dried up and at this point it's basically just weeds. He wants to start renovating it.

I told him, you should start over, there's nothing to overseed, come in, rip it up (it's good dirt, strangely enough, with no compaction), put in a cover crop, then rip it up again in the fall

he asked me "can you do that?"
sure, i can do it, but it will take 1/2 the summer. I can do the small areas (inside paddocks) and such, but really, you should just take to your neighbors and let them do it. You'll get a much better price.
so we agreed
now I agreed to maintain it (because by the time it needs mowing, my TN75 will be here, I hope), but a 5 footer is just ridiculous
and that's for 60 acres

just my experience.

 

[redlevel]

ABOUT FARMTRAC we have dealer in town have looked at them a few times( just stoped in) they seem like they are heavly built . if i was really looking to purchase i might look hard at them. They do seem a bit cluttered tho.

I agonized for nearly two years before I bought my Farmtrac 535. You have to consider how hard it is for someone who grew up on Massey Ferguson 135's and Ford 600's to finally buy a "foreign" tractor. I finally got the Farmtrac because it was the closest thing now available to what I was used to. It is basically 1970's technology. That is why it seems "a bit cluttered." Not too many worries back then about ergonomics, etc. I only have about 80 hours on it and am very well pleased to this point. It does everything a small Ag Utility is supposed to do. I would hesitate to recommend it based on that limited exposure. When I have 500 hours on it, I'll feel better about telling someone to get one. I first saw them at the Sunbelt Expo in Tifton several years ago. Their display there has grown from one or two tractors, a few brochures, and a local dealer representing the whole outfit to a large, well laid-out, fancied-up with wood chips and fencing display with a dozen or more tractors, both CUT and Ag, with representatives from the International outfit that owns them. There are several dealers in Georgia that I know of, two of them within 30 miles of where I live. In other words, it seems if there is now a support infrastructure in place. By the way, I happened to see a mechanic at my dealership using a Ford shop manual while working on a Farmtrac.

I know nothing about Mahindra, Kioti, etc.

I still believe the original poster should go with a minimum of 60 pto hp. A medium sized Ag Utility, etc.

 

[BarryinMN]

I think that's too general a statement. Some 6' implements require far more power than others.

There are mathematical formulas that quantify force required by various attachments. This particular plow calculated out to requiring 10,000 pounds force. With the plow adjustability (16" - 18" and 20") force could range 8-12,000. There is a fudge factor constant to accommodate diferent soil types. The Farmer I bought it from had trouble pulling it with his 8,000 lb 2wd tractors so was going back to his semi mount plow which adds weight to the tractor and also puts a wheel in a furrow for steering guidance.

Anyway, I knew going in I was at my limit for tractive force, the price was right (cheap) and it was a one time use. I knew better than borrow a plow because I have a tendency to break everything at least once. I do salvage from the wreckage and create something needed. Be tough to explain borrowing a plow but returning a hay wagon. It pays to have a good relationship with a local blacksmiths shop.

 

[froggy]

"A canopy does a good job with that hot old summer sun and does not rob hp like an A/C cab."

Come to Texas in August and I think you will change your opinion.

 

[Highsmith]

Went tractor shopping today. Visited NH/MF and JD dealers. Here is what the JD dealer quoted me:

• JD 5103 $13,490
• JD 5203 $14,595
• Frontier 6' Mower $1500
• JD 512 Loader $4450
• Frontier 200 PHD $1000
• Frontier 6' Tiller $2825
• Frontier 6' Box Blade $850
• Frontier Bale Fork $480

Called a Massey Ferguson dealer in Oklahoma I saw advertised on Tractorhouse.com. Here is how the MFs compare:

• MF 543 $17,900
• MF 563 $20,300
• MF 573 $19,200
• MF 583 $21,300

I thought it odd the 563 was higher than the 573. Dealer explained the MF 563 is only manufactured with a shuttle transmission. That drives the cost up $1100.

 

[GaryCrowell]

Called a Massey Ferguson dealer in Oklahoma I saw advertised on Tractorhouse.com. Here is how the MFs compare:

• MF 543 $17,900
• MF 563 $20,300
• MF 573 $19,200
• MF 583 $21,300

I thought it odd the 563 was higher than the 573. Dealer explained the MF 563 is only manufactured with a shuttle transmission. That drives the cost up $1100.

Those prices are high by a couple of thousand across the board.

 

[Highsmith]

Those prices are high by a couple of thousand across the board.

I thought so too. So I called another dealer and he confirmed MF is high. This particular dealer also sells New Holland. He said he did not know how he would move MFs when there is a comparable NH sitting right next to it for a grand or two less.

 

[Highsmith]

I am having trouble figuring out what tractors can accept a 4-in-1 loader. I saw this attachment on some other threads and it looks great. Will the tractors that I am focused (JD 5103, KB M4900, FarmTrac 555 types) accept this option?

 

[Turbys_1700]

The replys here are right on for the most part. My priorities would be:

1. CAB with air
2. CAB with air
3. CAB with air

I know that was silly but here in NC it is hot and humid and it's even worse in Texas.

One thing you may want to do is get two tractors. One utility in the 50 HP 4WD range and then another larger one. My dad purchased an AC 8050 with Cab and air for $12K several years ago. Sure it's got some hours on it but gosh-all-mighty will that bugger do some work. 180 HP in air conditioned comfort.

Life is good.

 

[Kyle_in_Tex]

I'm strapped for time this AM but, I mostly agree with everyone else especially Redlevel except that I feel 4WD is worth the money. 2WD is OK if you know your limitations and stay away from muddy areas.

I am very lucky in that I have 2 tractors available. I would think you could use 2 yourself. 500 acrees is a LOT of land. Don't plan on mowing more than 25 acres a day with a 6' cutter. I'm talking about previously cut acreage, not brush. If you are knocking down brush, you need something very heavy duty.

Are you an Air Condition type person. You will find out quickly how hot it gets without a cab.

My recommendations:
1) Find you an A/C cab older JD 4240, 2955, or something in that genre. Ford made some decent machines too. Get you a 12-15' batwing shredder. 2wd or 4wd. If you buy JD used at good price and don't like it, you can get your money back.

2)Get a smaller tractor such as big compact. Look at JD 4710, Kubota MX5000 etc with 4WD. This would be easier for post hole digging, manuevreability, close in shredding, anything needing tight cornering.

3) you need to think about root plowing with a BIG dozer prior to brush hogging. D7 on up. If I had that much land, I'd buy one used, finish my job, and sell it. This would take guidance by a knowledgeable person who would be willing to help gage the condition of a potential dozer.

Remember, if you can buy used you will save thousands.

Don't get in a hurry, the land has been sitting for some time apparently anyway.

 

[Z-Michigan]

I am having trouble figuring out what tractors can accept a 4-in-1 loader. I saw this attachment on some other threads and it looks great. Will the tractors that I am focused (JD 5103, KB M4900, FarmTrac 555 types) accept this option?

I believe you mean a 4-in-1 bucket - it allows you to operate as a bucket, dozer blade, or grapple. The only requirements for a 4-in-1 are:
-quick attach system (either JD or skid steer type)
-third function valve that allows you to operate the moving part of the 4-in-1 bucket

The third function valve can be either a standard rear SCV with a long hose, or if you want to go really nice it can be a 3rd function valve on the FEL valve controller (joystick).

Most tractors can accept these, but I'm not sure a 5103 can because I think its FEL control is simply the two SCVs that are optionally installed (rather than a typical joystick that simultaneously controls two of its own SCVs), and I don't know if you can install a third SCV.

While not a requirement, using a 4-in-1 will probably be nicer with 4wd, especially for grapple work.

While I would love to support green, I really don't think a 5103 is the tractor you want. I'd look at the 5105 but really jump over that to the 5x25 series, probably a 5225 with a 12x12 power reverser. On the Kubota side, I'd skip the M4900 and look at an M6040 or M7040. Sounds like you're going to be on the tractor a lot and the extras you get on these models will be worth it. If money is the problem I would look at used rather than smaller/fewer features.